Zwei pessimist discussion

im sure its a mix of both. Although really, a lot of characters don't have the tools to stop Zwei from doing his thing.
 
Thiss video is pretty old now!

The level here is changing a lot, a lot's of player start to JustG a lot's of things, and know ZWEI better.

My last match versus Akire at the FR qualifier for SoulImpact was close, and i lost 3-2 to him, he knows better ZWEI, and he can still progress on the MU. But Keev destroyed me 3-0 at the Loser Finals, he knows pretty well the MU, and he choose every time the right option, and Nightmare overspace Zwei badly.

My actual though about ZWEI is that he has a lot's weak point, even on his pressure tool, and especially his spacing versus fast steping TC attack. He also lacks on fast good mid option (without BE).

His throw game is not that good because A type throw does too much damage than B type. And you can't B type throw when you are using your pressure tool because it call EIN before. Trying to Side throw will open you more to counter attack, and you don't have already some good mid option to prevent it (except [B.] but it does bad damage on neutral hit)

His best tools remains on Okizeme, and the good application of B+K:BE which does serious damage, open for unblocable trap, counter trap, roll trap etc... also 66A+B is still on of his best move on okizeme too.

His actual weakpoint cannot be compensated without taking risk :
- 3A / 88A to beat fast stepping TC attack, but it's slow and unsafe.
- With anticipation 66A+B on spacing, but it's very slow so you can be hit before.

Some MU seems better for ZWEI, it seems that Saitoh's Astaroth was easier to deal than his Maxi etc...
 
So here is Hayate carryinh his team with Zwei in a tournament. Im wondering if its because hes so good? Or is it because no one knew how to fight against Zwei at the time. Thoughts?

http://www.twitch.tv/swga_maho/b/309079841 (Starts at 1:15)
OMG foreign announcers. is there a youtube channel that uploads american tourney matches with english commentary?

and how did that hayate guy do the fake at 1:26:45? he faked a move twice and i can't tell what it is...
 
His throw game is not that good because A type throw does too much damage than B type. And you can't B type throw when you are using your pressure tool because it call EIN before. Trying to Side throw will open you more to counter attack, and you don't have already some good mid option to prevent it (except [B.] but it does bad damage on neutral hit)
B-throw deals a lot of damage actuall and setups if you master the partial hold. Of course its hard to apply it in generic pressure patter b/c of EIN cooldown, yes, but otherwise you underestimate B-throw.
 
Thiss video is pretty old now!

The level here is changing a lot, a lot's of player start to JustG a lot's of things, and know ZWEI better.

My last match versus Akire at the FR qualifier for SoulImpact was close, and i lost 3-2 to him, he knows better ZWEI, and he can still progress on the MU. But Keev destroyed me 3-0 at the Loser Finals, he knows pretty well the MU, and he choose every time the right option, and Nightmare overspace Zwei badly.

My actual though about ZWEI is that he has a lot's weak point, even on his pressure tool, and especially his spacing versus fast steping TC attack. He also lacks on fast good mid option (without BE).

His throw game is not that good because A type throw does too much damage than B type. And you can't B type throw when you are using your pressure tool because it call EIN before. Trying to Side throw will open you more to counter attack, and you don't have already some good mid option to prevent it (except [B.] but it does bad damage on neutral hit)

His best tools remains on Okizeme, and the good application of B+K:BE which does serious damage, open for unblocable trap, counter trap, roll trap etc... also 66A+B is still on of his best move on okizeme too.

His actual weakpoint cannot be compensated without taking risk :
- 3A / 88A to beat fast stepping TC attack, but it's slow and unsafe.
- With anticipation 66A+B on spacing, but it's very slow so you can be hit before.

Some MU seems better for ZWEI, it seems that Saitoh's Astaroth was easier to deal than his Maxi etc...


So I have to ask. So im some one who is new to the series and looking to snag a great character, is Zwei not a great first choice if Im not completely familier with the game nor other characters? Advice?
 
So I have to ask. So im some one who is new to the series and looking to snag a great character, is Zwei not a great first choice if Im not completely familier with the game nor other characters? Advice?
You know the answer to that. Don't use Zwei, news flash: he sucks. Use a top tier character like everyone else. It's a game of tier whores, play along. I chose Cervantes to bail me out of playing Zwei.
 
Competitive or not. It's a game. Play to have fun. Play whoever you have fun with. That's why I still play Zwei so much.

I keep telling myself I will switch over to Omega, but it hasn't happened yet.
 
So obviously Ill never get to this guys level. But, there is a Zwei player in the top of the world. Watching his videos, he clearly plays Zwei the way he needs to be played.


Here is some of his fights. Just awesome.

 
Toilet is really good, but he is getting away with a lot of stuff there. I heard the 2 japanese entrants weren't actually even the Japanese champs. I think they were actually 3rd and 4th in Japan, but top 2 couldn't go.
I have a feeling Toilet gets eliminated early in this tourney. With only 8 competitors, I'm pretty sure people are going to be doing there homework on their competition. Should be interesting.
 
Toilet is really good, but he is getting away with a lot of stuff there. I heard the 2 japanese entrants weren't actually even the Japanese champs. I think they were actually 3rd and 4th in Japan, but top 2 couldn't go.
I have a feeling Toilet gets eliminated early in this tourney. With only 8 competitors, I'm pretty sure people are going to be doing there homework on their competition. Should be interesting.

Im no where nearly close to giving my opinion since Im new. But would you think that today, most of the serious players would know zwei or toilet enough to have done their homework? (Again, im new, so Im just curious)
 
im sure they all have some degree of familiarity with Zwei, but possibily not much in depth match-up knowledge up until now. But i'm sure by the time the tourney rolls around, every one of these guys will have taken Zwei into the lab and worked on reacting to his strings. Its not really that hard for players at this level to learn to react to moves. They still might not have experience playing against a Zwei that uses all the tricks as Toilet, but I think they can learn enough to start exploiting Zwei's deficiencies.
 
I'm loving that 3B 1(B) reset that Toilet's doing. It almost makes ZWEI look like he has good oki, lol. Still feel that anyone with good tech crouches and range poop on him for free though.
 
he does have good oki. Thats pretty much the strongest point of his game. Its his neutral game that is lacking.
 
he does have good oki. Thats pretty much the strongest point of his game. Its his neutral game that is lacking.
What are his options against tech rolling left/right? 1K BE picks them up but sometimes it whiffs. Might only track in one direction.
 
If all they do is left tech, just run up and mix them up everytime. They will stop teching everytime eventually.
 
I think the opponnent can get up and interupt with fast TC option or 2A. I will try more this kind of setups.
 
I think the opponnent can get up and interupt with fast TC option or 2A. I will try more this kind of setups.
This is correct but if you train them to block, those types of setups because very powerful for zwei. you could use 2a of your own to beat theres on wake up to discourage the use of it during your setup.

If your opponent is just teching the same direction, something i like to do is 66A+b and hold it, If they remain on the ground, 2k. If they get up, they have to block the Ein. Not something to do all the time but it helps against certain player types
 
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