Jaxel's Impressions on Soulcalibur V

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by Jaxel, Oct 21, 2011.

  • by Jaxel, Oct 21, 2011 at 3:24 PM
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    Jaxel Administrator

    PSN:
    Jaxelrod
    First lets get some history out of the way... Growing up, I never really liked fighting games; I played them, but very rarely, and often with disapproval. Then Soulcalibur II came out, and all that changed. Suddenly the idea of a fighting game that didn't require physical dexterity to play was apparent. I could use mind games to win matches, instead of muscle memory.

    To this day, Soulcalibur II is still one of my favorite games; even though going back to it is often hard because of the lack of "flashiness" we've grown accustom to in more recent games. However, when SC3 came out, I became soured on the series. I very publicly decried the game and hated it with every fiber of my being. Even SC4, which is arguably, an extremely good game, took a long time to grow on me in the aftermath of SC3.

    That all being said, let me put this out there: I LOVE SOULCALIBUR V! In my short time playing the game earlier this week, I felt genuinely elated to have my hands on with the game. While the game is still a few months away from release, it feels well polished and you can tell the developers of the game are working hard to take good care of the franchise.

    ===== GAMEPLAY =====

    By now, you have have already seen some older videos of gameplay from Soulcalibur V. Well things have changed significantly since then. Now, it appears that damage output has been decreased across the board from earlier builds of the game. In earlier trailers, a raw critical edge would do over 50% damage, now it appears they do more like 30%. In general, damage output now seems rather low, so I wouldn't be surprised if it changes again.

    The game itself is very fast. It appears to be a compromise between those who liked SC2 and those who liked SC3/4. Movement in the game is very fast, with step being buffed up from previously releases. However, at the same time, the game has the fluidity we see in current generation gaming (generally, in order to make animations more fluid, games have to be slowed down). So is the game more like SC2 or SC3/4? Well... neither. This is a new game.

    When I got my hands on the game, the first thing I tested were button binds. In earlier versions of SC4, Hilde could have multiple binds by having multiple buttons tied to the same command. There was fear that this could potentially be used to exploit the new "just-guard" system. I can tell you now that these fears are unfounded and input times are linked to the command, not the buttons.

    Not only that, but it appears you can't mash just-guards in the first place. When you press guard, while you may be guarding from frame 1, your character goes through a transition animation; you can only just guard during this animation. As well, after you've attempted (and failed) a just-guard, the game seems to "lock out" just-guarding for a small number of frames to prevent you from trying it again.

    So yes, while you can technically "full parry" critical edge supers in SC5, it will take a lot of skill and you'll pretty much have to be on point for it to happen. Why "full parry" instead of simply blocking or guard impacting? Because every time you just-guard a move, you gain a little edge meter, and managing your meter seems to be the name of the game.

    So just-guarding is powerful right? Then why guard impact; especially when GI-ing takes half a bar of meter? Well, even though just-guarding lessens some frames of recovery, it rarely gives free "major" damage. GI on the other hand leaves the player in a large window of recovery. So large that I was able to get free with Ezio: :B::+::K: :2:*:8: :B:; which is a very slow shoulder rush, into dodge roll stance, into coup de grace gunshot on the ground.

    ===== STAGES =====

    As you may have heard from other reviewers; the stages are beautiful! SC4 introduced "destructable" stages, where a wall could come down mid-match after a player is slammed into it. Namco has expanded on this with multi-tiered stages and between round automatic stage destruction.

    sc5_pub_stg_naval-battle_001.jpg

    One stage in particular, the "Sinking Merchant Ship" is very reminiscent of the pirate ship from previous games. However, this time, the ship is present during an ensuing battle with the cannonade proceeding in the background. The catch is, once you get to the final round, the stage changes. A custscene breaks up the gameplay (which can be skipped), where another ship fires their cannons at the merchant vessel, dropping the players to the lower decks of the ship, thus removing all ring outs.

    Another stage, the "Shrine to the Ancient God Palgea" (the replacement for Kunpaetku Shrine?) has multiple tiers. At first, the match starts in a very narrow bridge, very similar in size and shape to SC4's "seesaw", but with ringouts only on one side. When a player gets rung out, we get to see a cutscene where one player falls to the lower level and the other player drops down to follow them.

    Soulcalibur-V_2011_10-20-11_035.jpg

    Besides the stage gimmicks themselves, a lot of work and care was put into the design of the stages themselves. In one stage, the "Grand Festival of Guandi Template", you can see a Chinese New Year celebration, where it appears the current match has become the highlight of the event. Spectators party and dance around with traditional Chinese paper dragons.

    ===== ATMOSPHERE =====

    Characters have personalized entry quotes and victory poses. For instance, when Tira beats Pyrrha, she comments on how no amount of apologies will save her (Pyrrha apoligizes a lot during battle). Or for instance, in a battle between Leixia and Maxi, Leixia greats the match with "Lord Maxi, please be easy on me", but a very respectful bow... and when she wins: "Lord Maxi, you let me win, didn't you?!"

    The music in the game also seems to be a lot more "aloof" than recent entries into the franchise. In that mind, it bears far more resemblance to SC2 than SC3/4. SC3/4 had been deep and moody scores, while SC2 was a bit more upbeat and "synthy". SC5 appears to focus very heavily on trumpets and drums in it's music; which may remind players more of a marching band.

    ===== CHARACTERS =====

    Before we get to the good part; I want to make it a point to say that I did not have the game in a tournament setting. For the most part, I only had the computer to play against. While the computer AI in SC5 seems to be excellent (I was told that the developers actually had to tune down the CPU because at first it was too good), I never got the chance to sit down and do anything technical like testing frames, or play against other tournament players.

    These impressions are my initial impressions based on a limited playtime. Lots of characters have been discussed previously in other playtests, so I will limit myself to only new playable characters. Namco also reiterated to me many times that characters are constantly changing in an effort to balance the game; so they may change significantly from now till release.

    Ezio6.jpg

    Of course, everyone wants to know about Ezio. Ezio was definately fun to play; short range attacks tend to use of single directions, while his mid range attacks are generally out of multiple directions (such as 8-way-run or quarter circles). His long range attacks all come from uses of the input :B::+::K:; which could make use of a crossbow or hidden gun. You can see a video of me playing Ezio against the CPU.
    Soul Calibur V - Ezio Auditore Vs Raphael
    As much fun as he is to play, right now he felt "incomplete". Maybe its because we were not given move lists and we had to figure out moves on our own, but he felt very limited in his options. Not to mention, his fast moves have such short range that he has to pretty much be on top of you to get any sort of advantage. His mid/long range moves are so slow that he probably doesn't have much in the way of pressure. I'm sure he's still being worked on, so hopefully he'll be a bit more viable on release.

    Raphael3.jpg

    I didn't play Raphael at all in SC4; my experience with him is based sorely on SC2. Because of this, I had no idea what I was doing with him. All in all, he seems to be Raphael. Very linear, but at the same time very fast. I was hoping that the computer would be able to show me something, but even on very hard, the computer couldn't put up much of a fight. You can watch the video above and try to analyze things if you wish, I know people on the Raphael forum have already begun so.

    Nightmare6.jpg

    Just like with Raphael, I have very limited experience with Nightmare. I never played him in SC2, let alone SC4. However, with my limited playtime in SC5, he looks pretty much exactly the same was the previous iteration. Of course, I can't comment whether or not his inputs have changed, since I never knew them to begin with. I can say however, that his soul charge moves are gone... and he is FAST. Yes, Nightmare is FAST... and I mean FAST.

    soulcalibur-v-viola.jpg

    I imagine Viola will be a tough contender during the early days after SC5's launch. While, you can't technically have cross-ups in a fighting game with a block button, often against Viola, you'll feel like you're getting hit with one. Normally in a fighting game, the opponent attacks, and you block; once their attacks are over, you stop blocking and start your retaliation. With Viola, when you start your retaliation, you get hit in the back of the head with her orb.

    Viola has two major stances, Holding Orb, and Orb-less. As she plays, she starts with the orb in her hands, and has the ability to place it out as she wants; which is usually an attack in itself. Once the orb is out on the battlefield, she can summon it back as she wishes; which is usually another attack. Orb placement can be high as well as low; not only that, she can attack with it from above as a mid.
    Soul Calibur V - Leixia Vs Viola
    Often you will feel like you are fighting against Urien in Third Strike with his Aegis Reflector, or Litchi Faye-ling in BlazBlue with her staff. However, to balance it out, Viola has an extremely low damage output. She appears to be designed for players accustom to 2D fighting games, where a 5 second long 10 hit combo only does 30% damage. But her constant pressure seems to give her many opportunities to reset the opponent.

    Her critical edge super unlike anyone else's in the game. While most critical finishes are simple animated attacks, hers stays out in the battlefield and sucks the opponent in like a black hole. It does low damage, but it keeps the opponent standing, and Viola is free to move around the continue to combo from it. If the opponent blocks, she is able to walk up and force a mixup.

    Leixia2.jpg

    I had the most experience with Leixia, as I've played Xianghua in both SC2 and SC4. First things first, let me get this out there... Someone is crushing hard at Namco, because Leixia is Kayane. You may not see it in screenshots, or low quality videos, but when you sit down with the actual game, her image is undeniable. Of course, this isn't the first time Kayane has been featured, as her play-style and name were replicated in Broken Destiny.

    Moving on... Xianghua players will be disappointed if she remains unchanged before release. Not only have many of her inputs inexplicably changed, Leixia is slow and appears to have many of her basic tools from previous games missing. Most notably, she is missing :3::A:, which was one of her staple lows in previous games. In fact, speaking with MarkMan at the event, we couldn't even think of a single good low besides her WR :A::+::B:.

    But it isn't all bad! As with other characters, for everything bad, there is always something good. Leixia does not have her mother's Silent Xia Sheng stance and charges. But wait, "isn't that a bad thing?" you may be thinking. Nope! With the loss of SXS, Leixia no longer requires charges to be good. In fact, any place where Xianghua would have transitioned into SXS, she instead has a built in guard crush. So, she has a LOT of guard crushes. Now if only she had the speed to match it...

    ===== FINAL NOTES =====

    SC5 seems very focused on character knowledge, very much like Virtua Fighter. Every character operates differently, so if you don't know what your opponent has at their disposal, I wouldn't expect you to make it very far in tournaments. You can't simply rely on basics and eek out wins anymore.

    All things considered, the game looks great, plays great, sounds great. Its clearly the "flashiest" of all the Soulcalibur games with it's constant assault on your senses. At the same time, it also appears that Namco knows who they need to attract. As members of 8WayRun, you already know you plan on getting the game, and you'll probably love it; Namco already has our commitment. It's clear they are trying to directly attract players from the likes of Shoryuken and the 2D community.

Comments

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by Jaxel, Oct 21, 2011.

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  1. thugish_pond
    Learn how to play at least one of the SC's before talking Grendel.
  2. iKotomi
    Sometimes I think that the best way to deal with people is to let their words speak for themselves. As an experiment, I think we should just quote stuff and leave it at that and maybe bold some stuff for them.

    That is all I have to say.
    GrendelsWish likes this.
  3. WuHT
    Pretty much throwing in the towel with comments like this. What is so unacceptable about either just addressing specifically the points (whatever they may be) at hand in a civil manner or admitting you goofed, as opposed to drilling the other parties with meaningless and juvenile questions and comments?

    And i'm not going to respond to your reply with "I knew the answer, i'm just asking because it's rhetoric " because I believe credibility is earned, not self-affirmed through a high volume of bullshit posts.
  4. MONEYMUFFINS
    OFF WITH HIS HEAD!
    Heaton and Reave like this.
  5. WuHT
    Edit your posts to reply to multiple comments.

    I doubt that you are oblivious to this feature, as you'd at least wonder why other forum posters don't post 7 consecutive posts

    Understand that failed humour will likely be taken the wrong way, so if you want to take the risk then you better have a tough skin.

    People don't want you to post because you go on and on about something and it will naturally give off the impression you are trying to sound smarter than you are to cover up for something said earlier.



    could simply be



    Who really wants to hear from someone's who position in an argument is defended solely by their ability to drone endlessly about defining this and that before he actually cuts to the chase. If you like typing so much, go open up a notepad and type to your hearts content. I honestly believe that will be for the betterment of all.
  6. GrendelsWish
    Why would I imply that you wrote an article yourself?

    Yeah i know we are off on a tangent. It's no longer about the balance, but whether or not Idlemind can receive the distinction between fact and opinion when it's clearly pointed out in even a single post. I hope there aren't too many following in his footsteps. I guess it's nice that he can hold onto the victory of pointing out that my text isn't rigidly formal enough to use a hyphen every time it's proper.

    P.S. iKotomi, thanks for reiterating that I knew the balance issues before I attempted the rhetoric inspired by thugish_pond. Funny that WuHT referenced this in the post that proceeded your reminder.

    What is your criteria for having accomplished learning how to play a Soulcalibur? Cause evidently, you don't mean beat all the games with every character. Does one need to become first place in a tournament before this is accomplished?

    To put iKotomi's suggestion to use. I hope you don't mind self quoting.
    Stating something straight forwardly, plus indicating specifically if it's a fact or my opinion in no way constitutes a hiding behind anything like Idlemind suggests. Elaboration is the opposite of vagueness. If something is meant to be hidden, it would remain vague. As I ameliorate Idlemind's perception of my words via elaboration, he sees it all as more shrouded. I guess Idlemind's confusion is what's getting under his skin. It would help if he stopped conjuring meaning to my words and instead read what i actually type. that would help for a few others here too.

    I'm putting your technique to use once more iKotomi
    But I'm guessing a few of you will still have trouble drawing out poor Idlemind's assumptions from this excerpt.

    no. that was my attempt to break the drab atmosphere with humor. I guess I'll try a different approach next time.

    P.S. he still hasn't been able to spell it out for me.

    I want to wrap this up. This is getting old. You want me not to post here anymore, there's just a couple things i am waiting for.
    • thugish's criteria for accomplishment of learning to play the game (i mean, i would think that if one could beat the other guy, and beat all of the games using either character, that would suffice. But thugish_pond has other things in mind it seems)
    • Idlemind's spell-out of why the SC4 4G was more than an attempt at an increased ground game
    • And for anybody who thinks I don't know enough about SC to post here to tell me: What was your procedure for getting the invisible walls in SC1 on the Dreamcast? as in: How did you make it so that none of the players fell over the edge? "oh no! he's talking about SC1 again, he's got nastalgia goggles on!" No, it's called trivia. It's not rhetoric for I want you to answer me, and yes, I do know the answer!
  7. IdleMind
    4G also restores Soul Gauge damage. It has a larger window, can wallsplat and knocks down. Any TRUE SC fan would know that ;)

    Here is the deal: When you state "My opinion is X", it's an opinion and not a position. When you state "My opinion is X because of reasons A/B/C", it no longer is an opinion, its a position, which can be argued and no longer hidden behind.

    Brush up on your debate knowledge before you bring that sophistry in my face again.
  8. MONEYMUFFINS
    Grendel: I want old school GI back, too. Other than that, lol I didn't read all the conflicts people were having with you.
  9. Koz
    Don't forget that 4G also heals your Soul Gauge.

    edit. too late
  10. Nofacekill3r
    1.) By "learn the game," Thugish means learn to play at a competent level against other humans. Nobody cares if you beat the AI.

    2.) 4G has a larger window and thus is easier to land than 6G. It can also wallsplat.

    3.) Nobody cares about SC1 because it's no longer relevant, no matter how good of a game it actually was. Since this discussion is about SC4/Sc5 and the GI system, people expect you to know about those games before arguing a point about said games.

    Don't mean to be a jerk, but that's how it is around here.
  11. MONEYMUFFINS
    Are you serious? I've never noticed the larger window, but it'd make sense. I've read the forums forever and I never saw anyone point it out before.
  12. IdleMind
    Posts seem to be randomly being inserted at weird places in this thread- because I posted AFTER vincent, and so did Koz
  13. ShenYu
    It's also good for setting up positioning and oki.
  14. sWoRD_LoRD
    that's interesting. I don't look at frame data, always just learned from playing, but Zas' 2K isn't the same as everyone else's, if not because of frames, because of spacing, because of the reach it had, it's hard the intercept if he continues attacking afterwards.
    I'm extremely used to 2K not giving advantage though, and since 2K is used a shit load already, it would start getting used even more, which in my opinion could get annoying. That is what 2K, step-in, GI is for anyways, I think that adds more to the depth.
    But I was no pro at sc2, so maybe it was cool having 2K give advantage....

    Grendel, your posts are too long, nobody wants to read all that shit.
    Sef-Zero likes this.
  15. Sp1d3r
    [IMG]
    GrendelsWish and Reave like this.
  16. Sef-Zero
    GrendelsWish likes this.
  17. crow_winters
    It's all good. And you're totally right, in that enviroment it worked for Zas in SC3. I definitely remember the pains of dealing with 2K/2A/BB Zas, haha... But unfourtantely there were a lot of characters that were crippled in SC3 (and 4) without the SC2 style 2K because you could just hold G and react to thier slower lows/throw break option select without much worry. It was a big turn off for myself personally with those games, but without that frame of reference i totally understand where you're coming from.

    On top of that, for me to be totally honest, even though HS +2~+3 was standard, it was not something every character had in SC2. Asty/Rock/X all had -whatever 2ks but had something to balance it out (Asty had small frame throw break windows, X 3A) It was actually the "low tiers" that benefitted from this the most. Yunsung had 2k +1 HS to CH WS K setup, Raph had a monsterous HS +5 on his 2K... you had to respect them. :) It was also something that resulted from delicate care and balancing (afterall, SC2 saw more versions of it's game then any other SC) which I haven't seen from Namco since, well, now. If they can make every character threatening (not nesscarily with generic + 2Ks but it certainly worked in that game) then I am excited. 2012 is so far away..
  18. GrendelsWish
    So, used frame data, learned to play the game. No use of frame data, didn't learn. OK. Got it. You're not thugish, but acceptable.

    SC1 not relavent. Fine. Look up the word trivia. What is relevant is that I am such a fan that I know something you all don't —I'm sure it goes both ways. Unless you do. That's what I was asking to find out.
    Well Idlemind actually stated that my posts were getting shorter as if to imply that it meant I thought I was wrong. But now, he actually made it evident that I was. So I'll back off.

    BTW, I never saw those bugs on SC3 on my console. Explaination? (start a convo with me, i don't want to muck up a thread anymore)
  19. Nofacekill3r
    Who said anything about frame data?
  20. GrendelsWish
    Well i never had the good fortune of coming across somebody that could beat me. No, i never entered a tournament, never had the means to travel. When I said "beat the other guy" you had overlooked it and assumed I only fight AI. The next competent level from what I can do, is to study frame data. You wanted me to be more competent, ergo, I'd need to study frame data to accomplish your definition of learning how to play. If you live near NYC, in a couple of months, you can come kick my ass if you want to try, remember that offer?
  21. greatone1939
    We've got a few guys up there right now, that would be more than happy to show you how to truly learn the game. Don't worry they will gladly kick your ass whenever you are ready for it.
    Reave likes this.

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