SCV: The Butchering of Cervantes...RIP in SC4

SCV: The Butchering of Cervantes…RIP in SC4

I guess this long-ass thread can be seen as done for my own amusement, I needed to rant a bit, and because I felt the issue needed attention…basically it comes down to this: the Cervantes in SCV is an utter shadow/sham of his former self. I will not pretend to be the games designers here but I will question WHAT the hell they were thinking when they decided to take a character and make him so damn underpowered in comparison to the last game…

At first I thought it was the games attempt to “even things out” as far as player power disparity. However, now it seems the median/range is even more screwed than ever. I am seeing even more low ranked(D,E) players with avg records upsetting high ranked (B,A) players by simply using characters such as Natsu/Viola and spamming juggle combos for ridiculous damage.(Algol is banned in tourney play for his juggle/orbs so yeah, lets have a character who 75% of her entire attack basis can be used in juggle combos…with an orb)...annnd Im also seeing much more people who are going like 400-10 or winning at a 90+% rate…it just seems hypocritical and a bit ridiculous, but all that’s just a side point..

Back to the butchering of Cervantes, what compelled the designers to SO DRAMATICALLY DECREASE this characters ability, combo ability with certain moves, power level and just certain moves in general? What I am looking at is certain aspects of his move set from SC4 in comparison to SV5, as well as some combo ability and damage levels (although I am not going to go into deep detail of combos/damage as it is too tedious)…yes, I understand that SV5 was meant to be different from SV4 (gameplay, CEs, BEs, etc) but as I said before the degree that they altered this characters was ridiculous..

Changes/Alterations/Deletions in Move sets SV4 to SCV (the mainly noticeable ones, no particular order)
- Shadow Flare: One of Cervs fast vertical moves, guard break, great interrupter, semi evasive not at short range, slight stun/crouch on opponent block. Knockdown.
SCV: huge ALTERATION; move is very slow as now part of Dread Charge (DC) and is almost unusable, no guard break, very avoidable

- Dark Geo Da Ray> DC: useful enough, avoidable if not caught attacking, guard break, if caught did around 80 dmg with DC
SCV: CHANGE; move is fast so has some benefit, can catch mid-air opponent, avoidable if not caught attacking, around 59 dmg combined with opp. catch

- Flying Dutchman- fast move, great interrupter, in SC4 was input from FULL CROUCH. Knockdown.
SCV: stupid ALTERATION. It may seem small but is now input WHILE RISING. This is actually huge as now there is more frame time between the time the attack is input and when its executed on screen. This means the opponent can block easier and the attack is slightly harder/slower to input…stupid small alteration= sorry Cervantes
- DC Slash: very fast UNBLOCKABLE high attack for 55 dmg. Knockdown.
SCV: huge ALTERATION practically GONE…is now a guard break/slight stun that is practically useless unless combined with a Critical Edge…and oh btw for the CE to be effective the opponent almost always has to block the attack, so that means this attack can only really do dmg on block combined with CE, and therefore can only be used 1-2 times per game….wow thanks…

- DC Tornado Swell: great move for catching opponent when he was expecting theDC unblockable dread slash, ducks, and boom tornado swell for 55. Could also be done i INSTANTLY
SCV: practically GONE. Technically tornado swell still is on his move set for good damage but is now almost useless as it is slow, while rising, and very avoidable

- DC Dread Dash: very good in SV4 for freezing opponent with dread charge and then appearing next to him. Cervantes also disappeared for a frame. Could be done i INSTANTLY
SCV: CHANGED. Cervantes no longer disappears, opponent sees attack coming entire time…I can live with this change but it was annoying and is now less successful for follow up attacks

- Scissor Lifter: great interrupter, fast, and was a LAUNCHER move to where your opponent landed behind you allowing for follow-up combo. If hit just frame, was unblockable and could be used in opponent air catch combo. Did solid 30 dmg w/o any follow combos, just-unblockable did near 40 if combined with air catch
SCV: huge ALTERATION: NO LONGER A launcher, does less damage. Does have a unblockable part but required opponent counter hit to actually work and is hard to execute, especially online

- Wave Break: this was a quick sweeping low attack that was greatly effective. It was great for catching a blocking opponent, could even hit a downed opponent, also could hit a rising opponent and send them down again, had surprising long range and was definitely Cervantes’ quickest knockdown move.
SCV: GONE. DELETED. Why? What was the purpose of taking this move out? It was Cervantes’ one quick 8wayrun counter move? (yes, gibbering torpedo is another but not nearly as fast and can be blocked much easier, even if not expecting because its slow) They say “don’t know what you have till its gone”...that seems damn true as far as this move goes, say goodbye to catching opponents by surprise

- Pirates Scheme: A simple yet very effective move that teleports Cervantes back to where his opponent is if one of his GDR range attacks miss and he is facing away. Blockable yes, predictable yes.
SCV: GONE. DELETED. Again, is there a real reason why? This move was effective at catching some off guard but really it was just to position Cerv back in the fight if you missed. No real harm done, so why delete it? It was actually kind of cool and unique to Cerv….last time I checked that was the POINT of having different characters.

I guess the games way of improving is to make more of the same…kind of like how there are multiple mimic characters now?..Yeah lets get rid of TENURED characters Zas, Talim, Amy, Yun-Seong, etc but thank god we have multiple MIMICS…YEAH!...

- Full Sail Hoist/Fregata Slicer: Now this is sometimes a sensitive topic because these two were Cervantes’ main stun moves. People like to wine about players overusing these moves, and they are half-right…to a point…Spamming just these yes, annoying. However, a Cerv player that could incorporate these stuns into combos, kicks, iGDR, grabs, or cannonball lifters is a different issue and there is A DISTICNTION….(Cervantes was a character that relied on launchers and knockdowns, his stuns greatly helped execute this. It’s just part of being an integral aspects of his move-set and honestly if you say no, that being ignorant for the sake of being ignorant …Where would Kilik be w/o his range/effective lows, Astaroth w/o his low/high/mid-air grab combo, Ivy’s Know Thyself, Hilde’s charge techs, the list can be made to go on…)
That said back to my actual point,SCV: GONE and ALTERED into a two part move that is a bit slower. The Full Sail Hoist input has been changed to a special Guard move that is useless unless timed perfectly, specifically to a horizontal attack…psh wow, uh thanks…Fregata Slicer is not a total loss by any means and can be combo’d, but I still say its quickness is down as and is only effective when catching an opp. in-between doing a move that takes a LONG time to execute or maybe a rising opp.

Basically, that sums it up. The sad part is I probably missed some move that they screwed and could probably have made a further argument about his damage. Yes, I understand some new moves are added for compensation but the ends don’t justify the means. I still use Cervantes am a B2 at near 75% after only having the game for almost a month. But the more I play the more I am aware of certain flaws, especially when I lose to people who I would have dominated in SC4…Bitter, Sour Grapes? Not really, I still like the game/character but simply in comparison it’s not even close. Was he over overpowered in SC4? Again, No he was not…I lost (not as much obviously) to good Siegfried’s, ivys, and never-ending combo nightmares.. .some changes yes, I can accept and would even welcome but I JUST NAMED 10, 10!, that were all pivotally EFFECTIVE and are now gone or shams of what they once were as I have shown. What where they thinking?...done

Poor Cervantes. He got nerfed hard like no one's business. We should also make a R.I.P. post for the characters in SCV that got the nerf axe bat.

"Poor Cervantes. He got nerfed hard like no one's business. We should also make a R.I.P. post for the characters in SCV that got the nerf axe bat."



...true that

Holy shit one of the best scrub posts i've read since quite a time. I skipped through your post,I like how you know all the moves by name, thats a huge scrub indicator. Excellent choice.

Seriously a good start would be to learn the game. Cervantes is stronger than he ever was, most of the moves are better than they were in SC4. Also its a new game.

I just learned how to describe moves, i think thats enough. That upwards slash where he uses his gun sword is pretty good in SCV. In Sc3 i liked his fast tornado into that downwards hammer. I always beat my friends with that. But in SC3 X and Sophie had those fast low hitting moves and unblockables from standing up, also Taki was pretty annoying with her fast lighting strike on the opponent and her pressure from possesion. Not mentioning Asta and his cheap throws or his Bear Head Move range...while Cervy was good in SC3, there were better imo.

In SCV i only see Omega and Alpha on his level. So relatively to the rest he is quite good :)

These parts are my favorite.

aaargh his headshot was the first thing i tested in SC5...but too late to discuss SC3 i guess :)
OP made a serious statement and thread about SC5 Cervantes so people need to respect his thread. We shouldnt go too off topic.

Possesion? Is that the same as glowy-mixup-crouch?

This was more amusing than reading about Rick Santorum's flawed ideas on how to fix the country.

Algol is not banned in tournament play. My ranked percentage is 100%, I must be a Viola player right?

As a serious Pirate player in 4 and now 5 I just have to ask...WHAT THE FUCK DID I JUST READ

1. Direct from the SoulCal wiki on him ..."is considered banned in most tournaments due to his fighting style of over used juggles & combos that frustrates or annoys the player."

...just in case, I wasnt talking about the Global Colosseo tourneys, but official tourneys...Gamefaqs has alot of threads on this as well

2. Did I saw all Violas were successful? no, I stated that I have seen people be upset by Violas/Natsu who win by overusing juggles/air controls (in natsus case ground bombs)...no you do not HAVE to be a viola player, however, if you are Im simply saying it would not surprise me...

no offence bro, don't reference calibur wiki as a source of competitive info.

Right because there's clearly a direct relationship between researching/knowing the attack names and somehow being a "scrub." Right, great argument you have there, completely validated with factual evidence just like mine......If anything it actually says the opposite...make an opposing post if you want except I hope you back up your arguments better than "you know all the moves by name, thats a huge scrub indicator"...good one...

Also no they are not better, I just showed that. Then again how?/you wouldn't know that because you, and I quote again, "skipped through your post." Next time try not to contradict yourself hypocrite....