Setsuka match-up chart

but Belial and other french guys
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yaay!! I'm officially a frenchie now! xD

Good list Maxou. About Hilde, and this regards Amy too. This characters ARE broken. (I told people about Amy, but they just wont listen) but I think you lack experience against those chars (I know you think you know amy, but come on, whos good with her in france?) and thats why they seem so fuckin hard. Its exactly where brokeness shows the most, you make a mistake - it costs you too much. But actually Setsu is one of the best suited characters to deal with those. Well, vs Hilde it also depends on stage select heavily.
 
I've always thought Sets vs X is really hard for X.

X does not have much tools to deal with 4A.... the best poke to beat it is aK but if sets steps it, the risk is very high. This is only one of the problems. Maxou has generally covered the rest.

X's bad matchups have 2 things in common IMO.

1. The characters have more range than her. She plays your game FIRST.

2. The characters do a lot more damage than her.

Setsuka, together with Sieg, Ivy, Asta fit the bill perfectly.

I read somewhere that Sets cant step X. True. But the issue is in the lateral spacing... 66A turns it into a 2D game. Ducking it preemptively isnt so good either since 33B is very dangerous. But sooner or later X maybe driven to commit 100% to step or ducking because Sets gets the gauge flashing fast.

Sets vs Hilde is in Hilde's favour.

At least for the way I play her, normal pokes like 1K and 2B, force crouch sets and from FC, her moveset becomes very limited such that a sidestep G to her weak side or her backstep G safely makes many options whiff... or allows many of them to get blocked. Sets is also ridiculously easy to doom combo.

I know its in her favour but Im not willing to commit to how much. The most important type of moves vs Hilde are slow and mid/long range horizontal mids/lows. Sets SEEMS to me to be lacking in this department so that makes it really hard already. Maybe she has something, but I haven't seen it yet.
 
For Hilde, I am pretty confident on my numbers. I know Setsuka's strengh... and I know her weaknesses :( That you probably wouldn't know if you aren't a hardcore Sets player :)

Every tool I NEED in this match up is insanely risky.
I need :
- 1B:B > in order to damage her the most, it's even better than B+K. Alas... 1) it can be stepped > doom combo I die 2) if Hilde has C3 A, she can release the C3 A between the first and second B ... you guessed it ... autoGI > doom combo I die (it's not even hard to do :/ )
- 11A > works in the same way as Ivy's SW 2A+K... except it isn't as good in every part. 1) hilde can step it > doom combo I die 2) it lacks range.
- I need A+K A (one of her best tool against Hilde actually, Malek said RTD punished me everytime I used that move and ... when I watched the vid again, even if I played poorly, I didn't saw that)
- I need throws because it's my best antistep tools but... what if she ducks (risk/reward for Hilde isn't the same as for other character, as you know it)...
- Her 7K is a real pain to deal with ... it evades a lot of my damaging options at close range, in order to punish it, I need to backdash (in order to whiff punish her) but ... it's counter productive ... since I want to be at close range...
- can't zone her at all 33B/66A is useless.
- 6K is a good move upclose but it lacks range and can be stepped.

If I had a move that could put me OTG (like Ivy's 44K) I would have put 7-3... but I haven't ... so IMO it's a fucking 7,5-2,5.

....

As for Amy, I kinda agree with you... but IMO it's even. Even if I completely choked in the GF, Thugish doesn't know Setsuka at all... if he did, the beatdown would have been even more harder for me :
- B+K can be WS B punished
- 1B:B can be freely B+K K autoGIed (no timing at all, very easy... could confirm it against Human Typhoon)
- After A+G, A+K B can be rolled and completely avoided ... and although I have answer against this against X, Astaroth and Setsuka (yeah Setsuka is completely lacking in her mirror match), it doesn't fucking work against amy ... you need to do a JF in order for it to work (she's too small > it should allows for a free side grab but it doesn't connect). Insanely hard to time right.
- 1A:A:A can be 33B punished
- 8B doesn't connect everytime :/ When it's her best jumping move (this moves is TJ, tracks and it's a mid...).

Amy has a better step than Setsuka, and can lock down a character (of course that's only if you don't guess right > KD > startover) preventing her from getting back the momentum. With this IMO it is even. The A+G thing is INSANELY horrible when you play Setsuka.

Of course you have your own tools against Amy (that I used so poorly in the GF) : 4A is insane against her, 11A is a good move, A+K B is very good too, when you step she just cry, etc...

If Setsuka has the adv. it is only 5,5-4,5 IMO. Just like against Ivy.

Yuan :
Even if I love it, your way of playing X is especially bad if Setsuka starts to turtle. I like to rushdown with her, but she is probably more of a turtle character (I know I win more when I turtle haha).
My match against Kayane was much harder for me because she attacks so much (even if I lost the first match stupidly -my fault entirely - it was my most stressfull match in the entire tourney actually). Attack more, and it should help ;)
When people say "X cannot be stepped with Sets" it is not really true. Sets can step very good tools like FC 3B, 44B, 3K, WS K, aK, etc...

And you're right for Hilde against Setsuka. But not really because of her FC options (she still can 236 you in order to get more range or other things like that). More 1K and 2B is actually good for Sets since it allows for more damage options (more step opportunities = more free damage).
 
Maxou: well what you said about hilde stay true for everyone. Actually, I think its useless to even bother figuring out this matchup xD

As for Thuggish I think he knows Setsuka since he plays HymanTyphoon a lot. and even then Amy doenst really need all this matchup knowledge, its pretty damn simple with her. But you need to know her perfectly to even hope to fare well against her.
Thats the main trouble with broken bitches imo, you gotta be perfect against them, while they dont even need to bother most of the time. You lose your concentration for a second - round lost. And yeah aGI is annoying really, yet Amy (and Hilde) are weak to throws and setsu has many good tools like you mentioned in this match. And main advantage that can balance it out is her ability to deal damage thats' totally insane. She only has to guess a few times correctly to win. Where other characters almost cannot win against amy without heavily outguessing her. which is right next to impossible.
 
Belial said:
Maxou: well what you said about hilde stay true for everyone. Actually, I think its useless to even bother figuring out this matchup xD

As for Thuggish I think he knows Setsuka since he plays HymanTyphoon a lot. and even then Amy doenst really need all this matchup knowledge, its pretty damn simple with her. But you need to know her perfectly to even hope to fare well against her.
Thats the main trouble with broken bitches imo, you gotta be perfect against them, while they dont even need to bother most of the time. You lose your concentration for a second - round lost. And yeah aGI is annoying really, yet Amy (and Hilde) are weak to throws and setsu has many good tools like you mentioned in this match. And main advantage that can balance it out is her ability to deal damage thats' totally insane. She only has to guess a few times correctly to win. Where other characters almost cannot win against amy without heavily outguessing her. which is right next to impossible.
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ya i just dont see a downside to amy.
 
Belial : I do agree with you entirely ! I can only admit I am lacking against Amy, although I learned a lot against Thugish Pond and will try to return as better as I can against her :)
My biggest regret is missing a lot of imputs against him, lack of match up knowledge can be excused, missing imputs cannot (especially when you guessed right and it should have saved you haha) :/

Babalook : actually there is no downside in playing any character... except when you play Hilde since you actually don't play the game anymore ... :)
 
IMO Setsuka wins against Vader because he has highs that can be punished with umbrella or ws B or fc 3B:B. You can also step his UB's for some combo setups (1b:b/33B/Whatever). I play against my brother offline who has a decent Vader and I always give him trouble with Sets cause I know how to punish him pretty well.

BUT, I'm probably wrong.
 
Hi! Do you have any tips for the Amy VS Setsuka match-up? is really annoying to face Amy with Sets, I´m having a lots of problems to defeat her... listen to me.

The main problem is that I can´t find a solid mix-up against her, when I do 1A:A:A the last hit use to whiff, and if I get to close, If I do 1A:A:A Amy blocks it and I got punished by Amy with a 33B (lots of DMG T__T)

I can´t abuse of the grabs too, cose A+G grab doesn´t works correctly on Amy, also, if I spam 1B:B I get interrupted with Amy´s B+K aGI, she also can punish 2A+B and have a good steping to avoid my 33B and most of Sets options, if I try a bA to beat steping and she blocks it I have a 33B no matter the distance I did the bA... I can´t go back cose Set´s movement is so bad, and if I step trying to avoid Amy´s 33B several times I got hit even when I´m steping to the right side because of the incredible huge tracking of Amy´s 33B and Set´s shitty movement.

So please! I need help, Amy is safe as hell and most of Sets options doesn´t works on her... is very hard to beat that little bitch...
 
Trace_afj said:
Hi! Do you have any tips for the Amy VS Setsuka match-up? is really annoying to face Amy with Sets, I´m having a lots of problems to defeat her... listen to me.

The main problem is that I can´t find a solid mix-up against her, when I do 1A:A:A the last hit use to whiff, and if I get to close, If I do 1A:A:A Amy blocks it and I got punished by Amy with a 33B (lots of DMG T__T)

I can´t abuse of the grabs too, cose A+G grab doesn´t works correctly on Amy, also, if I spam 1B:B I get interrupted with Amy´s B+K aGI, she also can punish 2A+B and have a good steping to avoid my 33B and most of Sets options, if I try a bA to beat steping and she blocks it I have a 33B no matter the distance I did the bA... I can´t go back cose Set´s movement is so bad, and if I step trying to avoid Amy´s 33B several times I got hit even when I´m steping to the right side because of the incredible huge tracking of Amy´s 33B and Set´s shitty movement.

So please! I need help, Amy is safe as hell and most of Sets options doesn´t works on her... is very hard to beat that little bitch...
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I have lots of info on that match! With my girl now but will post when she leaves
 
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