Soul Calibur 6 Discussion

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Here is my idea to bring back classic characters without overloading the game with too many characters/ not enough quality.


In SC VI, each style has its own "default" wielder. After completing some challenge, that character's P2 costume is unlocked. After completing a harder challenge, that character's counterpart (1P costume) is unlocked. After completing the final challenge using the counterpart character, their 2P costume is unlocked. For characters with no logical counterpart (IE: Algol), the character will simply have some cool 3P and 4P costumes.

Example:

Leixia is unlocked at the start of the game. I win 10 fights with her to unlock a 2P costume. After unlocking 2P, I complete her story mode to unlock Xianghua (1P). If I complete arcade mode with Xianghua without using a continue (on normal or harder), I unlock the final costume for that style, Xianghua (2P).

The actual requirements for unlocking a style's next costume can be virtually anything. The point is that there is some kind of progressive reward for using a style a lot.

Characters with counterpart:

Natsu -> Taki
Yeon-Seong -> Hwang
Pyrrha -> Cassandra
Omega Pyrrha -> Sophitia
Raphael -> Amy (grown up for hitbox reasons)
Xiba -> Seong Mina (or Kilik)
Kilik (or Olcadan) -> Edge Master
Astaroth -> Rock
Cervantes -> Shura
Setsuka -> Alpha Patroklos (maybe the other way around?)
Maxi -> Li Long
Zasalamel -> Abyss
Siegfried -> Siegmare (Evil Siegfried, ala Soul Calibur 2)
Nightmare -> Inferno
Lizardman -> Berserker
Talim -> one of the 3 Shopkeepers (Lynette/Valeria/Hualin)
Mitsurugi -> Arthur


Characters with 3P and 4P:

Algol
Dampierre
Hilde
Ivy
Patroklos
Tira
Voldo
Yoshimitsu


Characters who don't get anything because they don't belong in the Soul Calibur universe in the first place:

Z.W.E.I.
Viola
All Star Wars characters
Kratos
Ezio Auditore
The rest of the guest characters
 
Habast said:
Also, god-tier Raph. Justice.
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While that is mouth-watering, Im happy with a high mid tier Raph. I fear all the crying and condemnation from certain people when they encounter a top tier Raph (remember his SC4 BB dilemma...yeah). Just listen to people who call him cheap and overpowered in SCV lol. On the other hand, all of the Raph fans would be revived if they were given a buffed Raph. The Raph SA does need this.

Well I guess as long as he has 6BB series and haughtiness, he will always get on some people's nerves.
 
Lasercakes said:
I don't think there's anything more offensive to me than a wall of text with a fan gushing about how the next Soulcalibur should be.
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Is this directed towards me? If you have a problem, come right out and say it.

It's not like Project Soul is going to come along and read this thread for ideas anyway. They'll develop the game their way, like they've always done.
 
Fendante said:
While that is mouth-watering, Im happy with a high mid tier Raph. I fear all the crying and condemnation from certain people when they encounter a top tier Raph (remember his SC4 BB dilemma...yeah). Just listen to people who call him cheap and overpowered in SCV lol. On the other hand, all of the Raph fans would be revived if they were given a buffed Raph. The Raph SA does need this.

Well I guess as long as he has 6BB series and haughtiness, he will always get on some people's nerves.
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I personally think it's retarded when people get used to a character being at a certain tier placement then they bitch when that character isn't at that placement.

Ex. When people found out Leixia wasn't high tier after patch(first time in forever that style could even be considered mid or below), the bitching about Sieg before the game even came out(look at page 1 of the SCV Sieg SA), the bitching people currently do about Maxi because he isn't lower-mid(because they can't get over a few tools he has), the bitching people would do if Raph was even mid-tier(since they're used to him not having enough tools to compete).

That's not even mentioning that SC pretty much has predetermined tiers anyways. Take Mitsurugi, Cervantes, Sophitia related styles, and styles based on Setsuka for example. They've never been below upper-mid tier because when those characters are made they aren't purposely made with a flaw like other characters(IMO). Inversely characters like Raphael, Talim(while she was in the game), Nightmare, and Sieg. These characters where good at the game of their introduction then they where always mid-tier or below. These characters are also made with a flaw in mind(linear for Raph, unsafeness for NM & Sieg) so even in the beta of games flaws are built into characters like this because they're defined by those flaws. I can so that there are a few characters that don't fit either mold. Taki related styles, Lizardman styles, Maxi, Tira, and Voldo.

This is my opinion though, take it as it is.
 
I get you Solo and I agree with a lot with what you said. I personally believe Raph is a mid tier in SCV and I even feel Namco wants him to be a defensive character in this tier placement. He can stay in the tier but I want some glaring weaknesses and flaws to be fixed if you know what I mean. That's what I was trying to say through the phrase "high-mid tier".
 
Theres nothing more offensive to me, than people that arent high level tourney players and showing up to every major there is and placing top 8.....that gives a shit about tiers like it matters to them.
 
Fendante said:
I get you Solo and I agree with a lot with what you said. I personally believe Raph is a mid tier in SCV and I even feel Namco wants him to be a defensive character in this tier placement. He can stay in the tier but I want some glaring weaknesses and flaws to be fixed if you know what I mean. That's what I was trying to say through the phrase "high-mid tier".
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With a glaring weaknesses he will never be above mid tier unless he comes with some crazy gimmicks people can't figure out. The upper-mid and above characters will have slight issues in an area but it's never enough to be considered a weakness it's just a part that is average compared to the rest of the cast(IMO). For him to be upper mid he needs better options in his stances, a good step killer that is a mid, and better damage. To me at least.

Hot Rod Dave said:
Theres nothing more offensive to me, than people that arent high level tourney players and showing up to every major there is and placing top 8.....that gives a shit about tiers like it matters to them.
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Why so harsh? :P
 
Solo said:
With a glaring weaknesses he will never be above mid tier unless he comes with some crazy gimmicks people can't figure out. The upper-mid and above characters will have slight issues in an area but it's never enough to be considered a weakness it's just a part that is average compared to the rest of the cast(IMO). For him to be upper mid he needs better options in his stances, a good step killer that is a mid, and better damage. To me at least.
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I agree with the mid step killer and I have an idea for it (won't share it here cuz not the right thread). As for damage, Raph's was always slightly lower than the rest of the cast in all of the games. I don't really mind because he has ways to do decent damage. They should, however, fix the moves that do piss weak damage lol.

Also, wuht noticed that it seems they don't want Raph to have decent stance options. Perhaps he'll be "stronger" with less reliance on stance for damage, meaning he can combo through stun chains without relying on Prep. Currently, Prep in SCV is "high risk, high reward". I would like it to be "moderate risk, moderate reward".

PS: Raph's biggest weakness is not step, but TC.
 
Solo said:
I personally think it's retarded when people get used to a character being at a certain tier placement then they bitch when that character isn't at that placement.

Ex. When people found out Leixia wasn't high tier after patch(first time in forever that style could even be considered mid or below), the bitching about Sieg before the game even came out(look at page 1 of the SCV Sieg SA), the bitching people currently do about Maxi because he isn't lower-mid(because they can't get over a few tools he has), the bitching people would do if Raph was even mid-tier(since they're used to him not having enough tools to compete).
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I agree with you about player attitudes towards tiers. Change is the bane of players who have grown content with how things are. New players often gravitate towards higher tiers when picking up a game. When they start to get some experience with their character, they fret and panic when something changes in the sequel.

The funny thing is that many (not all) of the most vocal tier-complainers can't play their characters well enough that their character's tier even matters. This game has its problems, but the difference between top and bottom
tiers isn't nearly as bad as some would have you believe.

When the game was new, I was pretty displeased by Leixia's drop in overall strength, but I've most definitely become a better player for it. If I wanted things to be easy, I would have switched characters a long time ago.

Solo said:
That's not even mentioning that SC pretty much has predetermined tiers anyways. Take Mitsurugi, Cervantes, Sophitia related styles, and styles based on Setsuka for example. They've never been below upper-mid tier because when those characters are made they aren't purposely made with a flaw like other characters(IMO). Inversely characters like Raphael, Talim(while she was in the game), Nightmare, and Sieg. These characters where good at the game of their introduction then they where always mid-tier or below. These characters are also made with a flaw in mind(linear for Raph, unsafeness for NM & Sieg) so even in the beta of games flaws are built into characters like this because they're defined by those flaws. I can so that there are a few characters that don't fit either mold. Taki related styles, Lizardman styles, Maxi, Tira, and Voldo.

This is my opinion though, take it as it is.
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I'm not sure I agree on the design strategies of the styles you mentioned. Every character has some weaknesses; the problem lies with how the developers budget the damage/speed/range of the moves for these characters. They don't see the game the same way as the players, thus they don't see just how powerful they've made certain characters until they see the tournaments for themselves.

With this game in particular, the way patching was handled has a lot to do with the present tier status. The first patch had lots of changes, the second had a fair number of changes, and the third patch was shoveled out with almost nothing being accomplished.

This says to me that the developers and/or their executives decided to cut and run right around the time the second patch dropped. If we had seen 3 fully realized and complete patches, i think there's a very good chance that the developers would have addressed some of the key issues that players have been complaining about.

I think the tier history of certain styles is more a product of the cookie crumbling, rather than intentional tier placement by the developers. That's just my opinion though.
 
Solo said:
Why so harsh? :P
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That wasnt toward you homes. I know what you were trying to do.

So instead of a bunch of people already talkin bout tiers this and story mode that. Can we just be happy that there is a glimer of hope for a new game? Or should we just start shitting on Namco's chest right now?
 
Hot Rod Dave said:
That wasnt toward you homes. I know what you were trying to do.

So instead of a bunch of people already talkin bout tiers this and story mode that. Can we just be happy that there is a glimer of hope for a new game? Or should we just start shitting on Namco's chest right now?
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Oh alright. I was going to say, when I played I actually had plans to travel to tournaments and such. It's just hard to do so when you don't have a job or have rich parents that pay for all of your shit. I'm glad I have a job now though. Lol
 
Hot Rod Dave said:
Theres nothing more offensive to me, than people that arent high level tourney players and showing up to every major there is and placing top 8.....that gives a shit about tiers like it matters to them.
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Calm down, man.

We were just talking about how it would be nice if some of Raph's weaknesses were made less crippling and his strengths played to more effectively. No reason to blow a gasket.

There's plenty more offensive to me, but it still annoys me when people act so superior to others... especially over something as trivial as a video game (as much as I love SC).
 
Hot Rod Dave said:
Theres nothing more offensive to me, than people that arent high level tourney players and showing up to every major there is and placing top 8.....that gives a shit about tiers like it matters to them.
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There's an exponential curve to how tier placement affects a player, based on the player's individual skill.
Up until some threshold, tier placement truly is meaningless. The problem is, there are plenty of players above that threshold that aren't the top 0.01% of players who consistently place top 8 in majors.

Tier placement certainly affects these elite players the most, but they aren't the only ones with a right to be concerned about how their character stacks up with the rest of the cast.

Hot Rod Dave said:
That wasnt toward you homes. I know what you were trying to do.

So instead of a bunch of people already talkin bout tiers this and story mode that. Can we just be happy that there is a glimer of hope for a new game? Or should we just start shitting on Namco's chest right now?
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Who is shitting on Namco here? The fact that we're all here in this thread discussing a sequel shows that we're all excited for a new game. Most everyone wants to be ahead of the game, and for some, that means discussing the future meta game, even if it hasn't even been announced yet.
 
Solo said:
Ex. When people found out Leixia wasn't high tier after patch(first time in forever that style could even be considered mid or below), the bitching about Sieg before the game even came out(look at page 1 of the SCV Sieg SA), the bitching people currently do about Maxi because he isn't lower-mid(because they can't get over a few tools he has), the bitching people would do if Raph was even mid-tier(since they're used to him not having enough tools to compete).
.
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Wow I never really thought about it that way. I can see your point about the same "pre-determined" tier list at the highest level of competition, simply because of the way the character is designed (and the ability of players to exploit/leverage the designed advantages/weaknesses).

I do notice that Algol/Hilde dropping to "barely mentioned" in SC5 after the general player consensus of their abilities in SC4 and project soul's acknowledgement, so I do trust project soul to do the thing about the OP'd stuff. Too bad they have to wait to the NEXT game to do so.

And HotRodDave i'm pretty sure wasn't trying to be offensive, but sometimes poorly executed humour ends up stinging and being more hurtful than intended. The concept of tiers affects any level of competitive player (whether playing to win or SC5 world grand finals), so as a forum habit I don't think we should be so blunt about "elitism" and be more welcoming to the playerbase.

Lets not derail this thread about top 8 vs not top 8s.

SC6 doesn't appear to be a launch title for the ps4/xbox1, and given the timeline I certaintly dont' think there is enough time. Thoughts?
 
WuHT said:
SC6 doesn't appear to be a launch title for the ps4/xbox1, and given the timeline I certaintly dont' think there is enough time. Thoughts?
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I'm sure I speak for a lot of us when I say I really hope they don't rush it to be ready for launch. As much as I'd like to have the next SC as soon as possible, I want them to spend as much time as they can on it to make it awesome. I'm cool with waiting longer for a more complete, polished game.

I also hope that when it is released, it's for current gen systems as well. I don't have the income, or particular desire, to upgrade for... probably a few years. If there was a game that would convince me to buy next-gen, though, it'd be SC6.
 
I'm a bit mixed over next-gen. It's gonna take a while for developers to be comfortable and speedy about making a game available for both major consoles, and I'm not sure I want them using that much time and money just making sure it's available for both platforms.

I'd prefer SC VI to be either PS4 console exclusive, or kept on current gen consoles where porting back and forth is a well-established process.
 
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