[Toronto] The Race to 10,000 Mountain

Iron Sheik for SC6 guest character!

I don't understand how Americans are so contradictory.

They bitch, whine, and criticise about some imaginary balanced game of 26 options, and act like it's entirely within ordinary to policy auto-ban some of those characters to 'avoid headaches'. I am talking about Devil Jin.
In Japan, balanced means having everything there to 'stay afloat'. A game will have its not so good characters. A game will have characters with absolute flaws. A game will have its Dan Hibiki - either the comedy element, the weak-as-shit element, or both in one (as Dan is). I claim: a game is better when it has the Dan Hibiki than when it doesn't. But that game isn't American "balanced" - Dan sucks! And so, is it too hard to imagine the other choices actually making a game better, putting aside the logical possibility of the American ideal?

What angers me is the contradiction. Everyone accepts that of moves there are better and worse. You can't do whatever you want there and expect victory. If character choice is privileged in some special way - where, unlike moves, everybody has an inalienable right to dispense whupass donning whatever avatar they wish - then how can you in the next breath say "[X] character needs to go, and we have to not let the opinion against that get too much momentum" I've even seen the following part expressed, along the lines of, "because, it's obvious, but going into arguing this opinion is annoying", which looks to me like "because my opinion is baseless, I am stubborn, and have no idea how to handle an argument, or balancing values with my own."
There may -be- a way to reason to ban Devil Jin from SCV. But I can't stand to hear it aside such obvious contradictory framework.

Aside on unviable charcters (strong unviability: informed players can curbstomp theory-perfect users of the unviable option)

At the end of the day, there is the fact that "equal" rosters beyond ... 5 characters, being generous, are a pipe dream. Development time is finite and games are complicated. But let's grant infinite development time. Balance is still impossible. The reason why for that, is because the characters are different. The very thing that makes the game attractive is exclusive of this ideal that people have derived from nowhere. I have come to believe that , actually, when the attention to balance and break-safety is painstaking, a spark of some kind is lost in a Fighter. When the players can see what makes the game balanced, the pursuit of exploiting the system is quieted, and I think that bores people. A contest of minds is brilliant, and there is much to be said of the learning curve, but I honestly believe players greatly value the idea of finding and proving that some aspect of the system can grant an advantage, but only with some choices.

If the system, pushed to its extreme in competition by players motivated to win, is consistent everywhere you go, then the game tests Skill, and it passes the litmus test for being a decent Competitive Fighting Game. That's always my bottom line.

When a person expresses recognition of the impossibility of this faux ideal, American balance, then they can come back to me and make sense to talk about headache-prevention bans. Only when you admit that there are some things that do not belong, when you don't in one breath say "every character is the same" and in the next say "This character, uniquely, is a cancer upon us all", are you talking sense.


TL; DR Amaury is right (about balance), and only if you agree with Amaury part of the way are you allowed to disagree with Amaury.
It's unfortunate that Devil Jin does not have a preset character avatar. That -is- a legitimate reason for ban possibly, depending on how CaS works, because the game does not provide any setting clearly identifiable as default. It's something we can inject, but not in the Versus Mode screen.
But this logic may be extended to Edge Master, and even settling the -idea- of Devil Jin (if he was a locked CaS on every machine, say) is important to me.

TL; DR Amaury is right (about balance), and only if you agree with Amaury part of the way are you allowed to disagree with Amaury.
It's unfortunate that Devil Jin does not have a preset character avatar. That -is- a legitimate reason for ban possibly, depending on how CaS works, because the game does not provide any setting clearly identifiable as default. It's something we can inject, but not in the Versus Mode screen.
But this logic may be extended to Edge Master, and even settling the -idea- of Devil Jin (if he was a locked CaS on every machine, say) is important to me.


STILL TL;DR........

I disagree with some of the rules in 8wayrun but I can still abide by them.

So much bigotry and unfounded rudeness in this thread. STD, you're a dick. If you had no interest in the effort Mandritti put forth, why spend time quoting and shitting on it. I've only been part of the forum a few weeks and already I'm questioning the maturity of the T.O. SC scene.

On a brighter note, I hope to see you guys @ A and C this Wednesday. I have so many questions regarding basic match theory, and I want to play IV and get into the SC mindset before V drops.

Better optimistic fanboyism than pessimism devoid of empirical data and any REAL reason. The scene's general disapproval of a few of Namco's minor decisions shouldn't make people give up on the series. The implications of these decisions might affect some more than others, but there's no reason to cry about it. Its much easier for people to dismiss something they haven't experienced. Also, considering the absolute trash Capcom has released in the past few years...I'd say SCV isn't looking half bad.

This is completely off topic.

Can anyone recommend a small TV for Soul Calibur? I'm going to play other games on it too, but I'll probably get a 19 inch one for my desk. Any recommendations will be appreciated.

But sometimes ppl are being blinded by over optimism that they just don't see the fault in the game and acknowledge to themselves that it's already perfect.

Now it's true that game play should be the final verdict but there are times when having a good impression is just as important and there are those pessimistic bunch who would walk away from that. Now I like to meet more players but it's a shame that I don't get to face these type of audience.

I'm just one of those ppl who still has a lot of optimism only to acknowledge with some pessimism that there are some faults with this game.

For anyone new to the Soul Calibur series and live in Toronto... please don't mind these guys! I'm not sure why they're so rude/mean/aggressive/ect., but please don't be discouraged to come to get-togethers. I'm pretty sure they don't act like this offline...

Noone is a dick here, and noone is really hate filled... Just stating thoughts, opinions and venting uhh and random trolling going on.

Believe it or not the community is a pretty tight, mature, and welcoming community. People just want the best for the game they are passionate for, so the attitude is expected.

Also keep in mind that not every0ne is complaining and not everyone is trolling. A few people here do not speak for an entire community.

People will be talking on a more serious level when the game is around to discuss. You will also begin to see more members of the community posting rather than what appears to be the regulars....

Love you 2

I just can't stand it when people who form sound, structured, logical posts are insulted by trolls like that. All of the SC players I've met so far have been awesome to talk to, so I have a good feeling you're right in that the community is chill. Just got riled for a moment, my bad.

Now that I can agree with. Accepting the game's faults while looking positively towards the future is the way to go.

Also even the fans who are buying the game still complain about its faults; besides it's a forum anyway. Thoughts are shared in a way that seem to be pessimistic.

In other words they are willing to deal with it but they use the forums as means to express their anger.

Also there are fans (yes I said fans) who don't want to buy further iterations of SC and that's because they don't like the direction SC is turning as this direction is thought to be damaging the reputation of SC, thus they lost hope and stick to old school SC. To them it's better for the series to die than to support and get the SC reputation further ruined while the others continue to support the series in hopes of finding a better chance for SC.

guess DJ is a no go unless a bunch of TO's really want to fight for it. I would laugh if the style was available on the mimics.

That Commentators and CaS thread gave me the chills, though..

And thread closed.

I knew 8WR was the biggest SC community site, thats why I came here.. but I didn't realize it was an oligarchy that decides the path of the entire community. Interesting ;)

j1yeon - Bro. Ask our Good friends Wallace and Russel what happened during Calibur Forums when Canada was dominating and WCMaxi Chicago et al were butt hurt.

Abyss doesnt get Banned. Russel takes advantage of said non-ban. Russel runs the train through Chicago Regionals.
Russ 1st
Vints 2nd
Oof 4th
Dino T-7th

out of 48 people.

WCMaxi comes to defend his butt hurt community. Ban-Hammers Abyss. Wallace asks what the problem is, in his English as 2nd language. WCMaxi insults Wallace's English. Wallace makes the GREATEST AVATAR EVER. WCMAXI FINAL BOSS (with WCMs Face over Abyss).

WCMaxi lays down the Ban Hammer on WALLACE of all people. I come in to defend Toronto against Butt Hurt Community, I got Banned. Twice.

Fast Forward, we are all very accustomed to being shit one for being from Canada or having an opinion. Just ask OOF. Anyways, its something to get used to (Admin Powers Corrupt Absolutely) so thats why we tend to do our own thing (or try to) without alienating ourselves from the rest of the community.

Unless Your Oof.

Oh Good Times.