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[14] Master
Earthworm Calibur. Sounds like a legit crossover.we are getting earthworm jim in season 2 no normie shit like cloud or sephiroth get outa here
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Earthworm Calibur. Sounds like a legit crossover.we are getting earthworm jim in season 2 no normie shit like cloud or sephiroth get outa here
Yes, but there are a number of differences there: 1) Cloud had already previously appeared in that franchise previously, and B) Nintendo was dead set on re-compositing its entire cast for the franchise and was willing to spend Nintendo money / throw around Nintendo licensing leverage to get it done. That's something that Namco cannot do at the same level, even if it felt inspired to do so. More to the point, Nintendo had a reason to want to have Cloud integrated into that game regardless of timing; Namco's only going to negotiate that licensing fee, if at all, when FFVII remake anticipation hits a fevered pitch....they loaned out Cloud for "Super Smash Bros. Ultimate" (came out in December)...
Well, except Cloud is already licensed to another fighter right now and it's possible, if not probable, that said licensing agreement included provisions expressly locking him out of explicitly enumerated competitor's products for a time. Tifa, meanwhile, is an untapped resource and the second most recognizable protagonist of the FFVIII sub-franchise (Aeris doesn't command the same loyalty from fans, I don't think, and anyway is the least ideal fit for a SC game out of all of FFVII's protagonists. I still don't think anyone is likely from FFVII (aside from the timing not being right, there's already as licensed Square Enix character in the game), but if there was, I'd bet on Tifa. Then again, i will admit to a little bit of bias in this: I'd really love to see her in a modern fighter, any fighter, aside from Dissidia.As for who they would pick if this happened, it would probably be Cloud again. While Tifa would be more interesting from a diversifying-the-moveset perspective, Cloud is the more obvious choice for marketing purposes -- and Project Soul has wanted him since "Soulcalibur II."
Yes, but that's precisely the point, really: not all E3 announcements are created equal. And individual characters/season pass content for fighters being announced at E3 are a relatively new occurence because...well, those products simply never existed in the market until recent years: it's only been in the last two years or so that fighter developers have started to dip their toes into the idea of ongoing DLC support for a game at this level, such that marketting pushes for such products are worthwhile. Up until about 2015 (and into the last year for most franchises) you could expect maybe one or two characters at best as post-release content for a game. That's changing and so will marketing priorities, with time, if companies are finally making some headway in getting consumers to adopt that model.That's an exception indeed, but i honestly don't feel there much hype about that announcement and got (obviously) overwhelmed by the other huge E3 announcements.
I mean, I personally think Noctis fits like a glove (or at the very least, Noctis fits better into SC than do most other FF headliners--and without question is a better aesthetic match for SC than Tekken). But even if we stipulated that he's a bad fit, the bullet was most assuredly not dodged, because we just ended up (as a consequence of developer's remorse) with a shitty off-brand version of the same basic concept (Azwel, or Knock-off-tis as I like to call him in this context).More like dodged a bullet.
First off, they are remastering FFVIII!? Fucking-aye, that's great news: that's arguably the best game in the franchise, even with all its game-able flaws in the battle and leveling systems. But at the same time, no way anyone has any interest in licensing Squall for anything, lol--there couldn't be less buzz around that character if he was the main protagonist from Mystic Quest, lol. Which is a pity--that game deserves so much more love-- but very much a reality.They could also choose to promote Final Fantasy VIII Remaster instead, and we could get Squall for SoulCalibur VI, which might be pretty interesting.
I'm pretty sure you're going to get your wish. I'm as confident as I can be, given how long we've gone without official confirmation on anything pertaining to the supposed "leaks" (which I think were plants for the purpose of free viral marketing), that our six Season 2 characters are likely to be the six remaining classic era SC characters: Aeon/Lizardman, Hwang, Li long, Rock, Setsuka, and Yun-Seong.NO MORE GUESTS, NOOOO....
Give me the regs.
Yes, but there are a number of differences there: 1) Cloud had already previously appeared in that franchise previously, and B) Nintendo was dead set on re-compositing its entire cast for the franchise and was willing to spend Nintendo money / throw around Nintendo licensing leverage to get it done. That's something that Namco cannot do at the same level, even if it felt inspired to do so. More to the point, Nintendo had a reason to want to have Cloud integrated into that game regardless of timing; Namco's only going to negotiate that licensing fee, if at all, when FFVII remake anticipation hits a fevered pitch.
Rusted said:Well, except Cloud is already licensed to another fighter right now and it's possible, if not probable, that said licensing agreement included provisions expressly locking him out of explicitly enumerated competitor's products for a time.
Rusted said:Tifa, meanwhile, is an untapped resource and the second most recognizable protagonist of the FFVIII sub-franchise (Aeris doesn't command the same loyalty from fans, I don't think, and anyway is the least ideal fit for a SC game out of all of FFVII's protagonists.
It remains one of my favorites (along with X and XV).Rusted said:First off, they are remastering FFVIII!? Fucking-aye, that's great news: that's arguably the best game in the franchise, even with all its game-able flaws in the battle and leveling systems.
Yeah, but i think Aerith's use in the marketing materials is somewhat an artifact of how the remake is being presented, more than anything else. Aerith only survives the first half of that game, and though her death was a kind of watershed moment for storytelling in games, as consequence, she barely plays a part in the broader FFVII sub-franchise, aside from Crisis Core. She shows up so heavily in marketing materials for FFVII Remake so often because she is heavily featured in the (at the time, extremely eye-catching) cinematics towards the beginning of the original game and, unsurprisingly, it is remakes of those moments that Square Enix has focused on for promotion to date--both because those moments are so very iconic and because they have (very obviously from what they have revealed so far) mostly only made headway on the earlier portions of the game in terms of development on the remake, so it's what they have at hand to build marketing assets out of.Aerith certainly is a less ideal fit, I agree, but for the record, she absolutely commands the same loyalty -- and I would argue is the more recognizable of the two. She is definitely -- inarguably even -- utilized more in promotional and commemorative material, merchandise, and whatever other iconography.
The problem with Sephiroth (and to a large extent this applies to Cloud as well) is that they don't fit the mold for SC guests, whose abilities have to scale to the realities of Soulcalibur's game mechanics. At this point of his representation in his "native" universe, Sephiroth can fly like superman and each swipe of his ten foot sword hits with the force of about 10,000 kilonewtons--if he's not really putting much muscle behind it. That means one of two things happens if you put him (or Cloud, who is two up on him in personal combat at this point) in a Soulcalibur game: either he looks like he is fighting at one one-thousandth of his usual capabilities (which will make him look silly, particularly to fans) or he completely annihilates everything in his path, given nobody native to SC has anything approach his strength and capabilities. Obviously neither option is really viable for a fighter like SC. It's much less a problem for a game that is both 2D and more fantastical/catering to OP characters, like Smash Bros. or even games like DBZF or Marvel vs. Capcom. Their story, visuals, and particularly their game engines just cater much more towards that over-the-top, high-flying action presented from more of a distance.Sephiroth trumps either of them in these regards, of course, but I don't see him as a likely choice for multiple reasons. I'm happy to be wrong about that, though!
All this talk about guests is depressing.
NO MORE GUESTS, NOOOO....
Give me the regs.
Soon, if possible.
No more guests, please (And certainly no FF characters for the love of GOD). We have two already. That's good enough. Old favorites and new characters from now on.
weaponless
I miss her and the rest of the bonus characters from SCIII. Project Soul and Bandai Namco have to really bring those characters back and/or their styles. The latter needs some tinkering to be complete, balanced fighting styles.but cestus could never top this...
Yeah, but i think Aerith's use in the marketing materials is somewhat an artifact of how the remake is being presented, more than anything else. Aerith only survives the first half of that game, and though her death was a kind of watershed moment for storytelling in games, as consequence, she barely plays a part in the broader FFVII sub-franchise, aside from Crisis Core. She shows up so heavily in marketing materials for FFVII Remake so often because she is heavily featured in the (at the time, extremely eye-catching) cinematics towards the beginning of the original game and, unsurprisingly, it is remakes of those moments that Square Enix has focused on for promotion to date--both because those moments are so very iconic and because they have (very obviously from what they have revealed so far) mostly only made headway on the earlier portions of the game in terms of development on the remake, so it's what they have at hand to build marketing assets out of.
Rusted said:And don't get me wrong, I love Aerith, I thinks she's a great character in her own right; one of the themes that the classic Final Fantasy games really liked to lean, and which infused so many of the story arcs for particular characters with emotion, was the notion of self-sacrafice, and Aerith's story is almost completely about that concept.
Rusted said:... I just could not get over that Cloud was mopping around about the same shit all over again ...
Yes.Rusted said:Anyway, all of that nostalgia-wrangling aside, I'm sure we agree that as a fight-mechanic/style matter, Tifa's infinitely better positioned to be a guest in a fighter than Aerith.
Much as the hyper-fan in me would like to see every style return eventually, I have to say that not all of those styles are ripe for return. Arthur I feel is the character who most deserves a full moveset in a forthcoming game; of the four bonus characters in SCIII who had existed in the plot previously, only Arthur didn't get a full moveset for SCIII:AE. I've always felt that was a shame, as I think SC could accommodate another katana moveset. So he goes to the top of my list. After that, if we put Arthur, Amy, Hwang, and Li Long to the side, there were really only a few movesets that showed real potential, if you consider weapons that weren't too terribly goofy or redundant on those of other characters: Valeria, Miser, and Greed. I think Abelia, Luna, Aurelia, and Strife have some great moves and potential over-all, but they are pretty redundant on weapon/moveset themes that already have multiple characters representing them in most entries. Hualin and Giradot, on the flip side, have interesting qualities and unique weapons to say the least, but their moves are just too gimmicky and I don't see them translating well to a full moveset in a contemporary SC game. And I could give or take the remaining four bonus characters: Chester, Demuth, Revenant, and Lynette.I miss her and the rest of the bonus characters from SCIII. Project Soul and Bandai Namco have to really bring those characters back and/or their styles. The latter needs some tinkering to be complete, balanced fighting styles.
I would of course want the bonus characters from SCIV to come back with unigue fighting styles like Astaroth, Kilik, Cassandra, Yun-Seong, etc did. Though, seeing how they were designed by guest artists the chances are sadly slim of them ever making it back.
I agree, and for largely the same reasons, and you're right, insofar as FFVII is concerned, Aerith is arguably the more central character. But Tifa's just dominated much more of the story since the original game. I think at the end of the day, people remember her as the primary FFVII female protagonist. She certainly seems to make her way into a lot more games, movies and such (both within the FFVII franchise and outside it).There's also the not-insignificant matters of the game beginning and ending with memorable shots of Aerith's face, and her being the one who made a generation of gamers cry. It's just to be expected that she would be more iconic.
Really? That's interesting: do you recall where you read/heard that? If that was their goal, it wasn't well realized. I mean almost any meaningful sacrifice in a story is avoidable to some extent, if you just backed up from a certain point of time. But Aerith is killed making an attempt to counter Sephiroth (an attempt he couldn't allow if his plans were to succeed), so I don't see how her opposing him was and dying in the effort was framed as pointless as a story matter, particularly in that her original plan almost worked and her death ultimately put her in a position to stop mitigate the meteor disaster. And if her death was meaningless, its worth noting that it happened largely because she didn't wait for everyone to come along with her to watch her back, so that's...kind of weird message to send/ point to emphasize if the pointlessness of her death was intentional.This is mostly an academic quibble, but Aerith's memorable moment was actually conceived as the opposite of that notion: as something awful that happened for no good reason. It was meant to be a subversion of the dramatic self-sacrifice trope because it didn't need to happen and she didn't know it was going to.
Ehh, the thing is...survivor's guilt is a real and relatable psychological condition here in the real world when someone is dead and just gone as a person. Less so, when you consider that Cloud saw that Aerith is still alive in some sense in the lifestream. Alive and kinda-sorta godlike, and still acting to protect the world she loved. I'd have more appreciation for that aspect of Cloud's story in AC, if it weren't for the fact that we saw him battle those emotions throughout the last act of the original game, only to have that triumphant moment at the end where the lifestream saves the whole world and its heavily implied that Aerith is a part of it. Watching him reset to square one for AC seems artificial and forced; so much of AC feels like they couldn't figure out what to do to move these characters forward, so they just had them re-live the last disc of FFVII, complete with a showdown against the same exact villain. Shit, Rufus and the Turks are the only ones who have shown any character growth before the very end of that movie!!He doesn't deal with survivor's guilt or a terminal illness in the original game, though. These were very much new problems.
Hahaha! Kind of wish they'd do some kind of crazy hand powered melee berserker dude. Their armor could be all close range bludgeoning tools and they upset the magical long ranged characters.
Sounds like you are making an argument for Jack as the next Tekken guest character. ;)Hahaha! Kind of wish they'd do some kind of crazy hand powered melee berserker dude. Their armor could be all close range bludgeoning tools and they upset the magical long ranged characters.
But that rather begs the question, which guest and which bonus character are we comparing? Because if the choice is between Demuth and Tifa or an updated Kratos, or Kazuma, or an updated Link or...well, some of these are more realistic than others, but you take my point. Some of those SCIII bonus styles are real duds and just about any guest would probably prove to be a more worthwhile addition to the roster.SC doesn't need more guests, we just need legacy characters and new ones. Though I like the idea of having characters from franchises I like in the game, I'd choose a more fleshed out SCIII bonus character over "famous" characters.
But that rather begs the question, which guest and which bonus character are we comparing? Because if the choice is between Demuth and Tifa or an updated Kratos, or Kazuma, or an updated Link or...well, some of these are more realistic than others, but you take my point. Some of those SCIII bonus styles are real duds and just about any guest would probably prove to be a more worthwhile addition to the roster.
(Amy>Hwang>Li long)>Arthur>Valeria>Greed>Miser>Abelia>Strife>Luna>Aurelia>Giradot>Hualin>Chester>Revenant>Demuth>Lynette.
I have zero hope that any character will come. That being said, I dread this patch.