Soul Calibur VI: General discussion

sytus said:
You mean a counter hit from an opponent stepping who then attacks straight afterwards. Then there's zero point to 66A when there are better moves that do more damage that leave you at greater advantage at the cost of being unsafe on block. 6A+B is i14 vertical mid that has enormous range and tech crouches, or the i20 bA which is a horizontal mid with massive range (BTW it's also the bane of Voldo's Mantis. Getting Voldo players to rage quit on you because you've shut down their Mantis flowchart is hilarious). You've also got her 66B (her most iconic move) which is basically the same as 66A but is a mid, tech crouches and stuns on counter for big combo damage, so you can either make a read by counter hitting a high, or step and then 236B to get the launcher for big damage. Either way this move is far superior to 66A if safe step was in the game. There's also 66K which has better tracking, is a mid and if lands, puts her into her airborne stance for a mid/low mixup. Say we do change her 66A to a mid to better fit safe step and the moves that I've listed, that would mean 3A+B and 66A+B would be obsolete making Setsuka more and more simplified, which is kind of a problem for Setsuka as she's already pretty simple (most of her brand new stuff is incredibly circumstantial), albeit with execution. Then you come to 8B+KA which you would avoid using with everything thing I've just said is all that you would need.

Now I'm not saying that I'm against safe step because I know all to well how frustrating it is when all you want to do is reset the neutral, but I can actually see the reasoning behind making step unsafe and it's because the developers want to make character tools more interesting. My only major problem with safe step is that some characters get way too much reward, like Amy who by the look of things gets stun from fast mids that lead to a high damage combos as well as lethal hits (she's still the best character in the game even though she's more manageable now).
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MY ISSUE ISN'T THE FACT THAT STEP IS SAFE OR UNSAFE, IT'S THAT TURNS CONSTANTLY GET STOLEN IN SC6'S CURRENT SYSTEM BECAUSE OF SOUL CHARGE AND YOU KEEP ZONING IN ON 2 FUCKING MOVES BECAUSE YOU HAVE A FETISH FOR LOOKING AT THE SMALL PICTURE.

YOU'RE ACTING AS IF STEP KILLERS DON'T MATTER IN THE NEUTRAL GAME. GUESS WHAT, YOU CAN'T RELY ON ANY ONE MOVE IN ANY SCENARIO UNTIL YOU KNOW WHAT THE OPPONENT IS UP TO.

PROJECT SOUL HAS BEEN GREATLY REWARDING THE SAME ROBOTIC "LOOK AT MY WORLD CLASS REACTIONS" PLAY STYLE AT THE EXPENSE OF EVERYONE ELSE FOR THE PAST 3 GAMES WITH SC4-6. MEANWHILE, YOU'RE ULTIMATELY TOLERANT OF THIS FUCKING TRASH AND ACTING LIKE I'M OUT OF LINE TO SAY THAT THEY'VE LOST THEIR WAY AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SOULCALIBUR EVEN IS ANYMORE.
 
Foot said:
Long story short the game has too many pointless mechanics that theoretically provide "depth" but actually just turn everything into a huge mess and caters way too much to "oh look so many cool effects" than actually having a fighting game that rewards you for understanding what you are doing.
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This is the main problem with SC6. There's a decent fundamental gameplay, but it has been buried under layers and layers of gimmicks. CE:s. while varying wildly between characters I still find are the least objectionable. Reversal edge has no place in the game whatsoever and PS should have realized this from the start. Soul Charge is just unnecessary complexity in having to learn two variations of movesets for each character (I'm a pretty casual player, some competitive players maybe like this challenge but I sure don't). And then there's the character specific gimmicks, where it seems PS were afraid of the whining about clones and therefore decided every character must have some different convoluted collection sidequest to turn in to get access to OP moves. Some of the original cast gimmicks are more balanced and maybe even fit in the game, but through the season passes we have been getting more and more wild and implausible extensions to characters. If we get a SC7 I hope PS can have the courage to just build solid game mechanics and let them stand on their own.
 
sytus said:
It's not, it's a great way to negate the damage from Nightmare's soul charged attacks.
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I agree for some very specific situations like playing against nightmare or taki to avoid chip damage it has its uses. But it is not nearly strong enough. Using perfect guard should just be exactly like using just guard without the frame advantage (and maybe not against unblockables). Meaning no chip or guard damage at all (or even restoring a bit of guard gauge. And being able to avoid a guard break while flashing red. The way it is right now it is jus a very niche mechanic that doesnt really matter a whole lot unless you are in a specific matchup. And being able to avoid guard breaks and guard damage by having a good defense and using perfect guard at the right time or often during the match would be a good balance to all the agressive mechanics that encourage mashing.

And about the other stuff i definitely think there are some characters that are in a good spot for example voldo, astaroth haomaru geralt hilde. Basic characters without too many mechanics. But in general they just overload characters with character specific stuff which was interesting at first but turned out to be a huge mess. (not to mention that it pretty much turned into "everyone gets a stack mechanic" after a while).
 
MONEYMUFFINS said:
MY ISSUE ISN'T THE FACT THAT STEP IS SAFE OR UNSAFE, IT'S THAT TURNS CONSTANTLY GET STOLEN IN SC6'S CURRENT SYSTEM BECAUSE OF SOUL CHARGE AND YOU KEEP ZONING IN ON 2 FUCKING MOVES BECAUSE YOU HAVE A FETISH FOR LOOKING AT THE SMALL PICTURE.

YOU'RE ACTING AS IF STEP KILLERS DON'T MATTER IN THE NEUTRAL GAME. GUESS WHAT, YOU CAN'T RELY ON ANY ONE MOVE IN ANY SCENARIO UNTIL YOU KNOW WHAT THE OPPONENT IS UP TO.

PROJECT SOUL HAS BEEN GREATLY REWARDING THE SAME ROBOTIC "LOOK AT MY WORLD CLASS REACTIONS" PLAY STYLE AT THE EXPENSE OF EVERYONE ELSE FOR THE PAST 3 GAMES WITH SC4-6. MEANWHILE, YOU'RE ULTIMATELY TOLERANT OF THIS FUCKING TRASH AND ACTING LIKE I'M OUT OF LINE TO SAY THAT THEY'VE LOST THEIR WAY AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SOULCALIBUR EVEN IS ANYMORE.
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I think SC6 is a HUGEEEEE improvement over SC5 so ehhh....

To each their own.
 
lightcycle said:
This is the main problem with SC6. There's a decent fundamental gameplay, but it has been buried under layers and layers of gimmicks. CE:s. while varying wildly between characters I still find are the least objectionable. Reversal edge has no place in the game whatsoever and PS should have realized this from the start. Soul Charge is just unnecessary complexity in having to learn two variations of movesets for each character (I'm a pretty casual player, some competitive players maybe like this challenge but I sure don't). And then there's the character specific gimmicks, where it seems PS were afraid of the whining about clones and therefore decided every character must have some different convoluted collection sidequest to turn in to get access to OP moves. Some of the original cast gimmicks are more balanced and maybe even fit in the game, but through the season passes we have been getting more and more wild and implausible extensions to characters. If we get a SC7 I hope PS can have the courage to just build solid game mechanics and let them stand on their own.
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well i disagree about RE on some points

some characters are built around RE like talim, if they just remove RE they'll have to redo her entire moveset
and talim with RE cancels in SC6 is much better than any previous versions of talim on past games

Angrel-San said:
I think SC6 is a HUGEEEEE improvement over SC5 so ehhh....

To each their own.
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NO fucking way... SC5's only flaw was the short and dumb movelist and the lack of free GI's

the rest is better than SC6 in every single aspect, quick step was the best mechanic i've seen and the meter attacks were way more useful than soul charge
the main flaw of soul charge is that some characters have completely useless charges while others (Ivy-sophitia-astaroth) have a completely absurd and spammable soul charge attacks

seriously whoever the fuck brought cassandra's thunder attacks to sophitia should be fired
 
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People complained about these things since the game came out. Its nothing new its just now after 2 years barely anything changed positively. It actually got worse in s2.

Its a good game if you are into anime fighters i guess. But it isnt really Soul calibur
 
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Foot said:
People complained about these things since the game came out. Its nothing new its just now after 2 years barely anything changed positively. It actually got worse in s2.
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C'mon you can't say that when in Season 1 you couldn't block RE from activating. Project Soul also said that they couldn't remove RE from SC6 because it's too integral to the game, but the changes to RE itself as well as Mitsurugi, Ivy, Voldo and Tira having their auto RE strings removed and replaced with normal moves have been fantastic changes that have significantly affected battles overall.
 
Voldos and Tiras RE cancel were the least problematic ones in the game. Talim and raph had their cancel way longer who were the ones that actually had the good cancel. And even then when they removed talims cancel they gave her a ton of new stuff to "compensate" for not having a broken mechanic anymore.

Re being integral to the game i dont see it. How often do you see RE in competitive play nowadays you could easily remove that mechanic with GI/RI/JG in the game.

But mainly what im talking about is how the balance has been complete ass in S2. The toptiers were more stupid than ever before. We lost azwel just to get Raph and Amy instead who have been significantly worse than azwel ever was. (but dont ask our amy apologist angrel about that).

They kept buffing characters that were already top and ignored the ones that werent or they made some weird ass changes made no sense whatsoever. They threw in yet another mechanic "soul activation" which is the same thing as SC for some characters its amazing for some its terrible.
 
Foot said:
Re being integral to the game i dont see it. How often do you see RE in competitive play nowadays you could easily remove that mechanic with GI/RI/JG in the game.
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Integral to SC6, not Calibur itself (I'm sure we're on the same page here, but I'm just pointing this out for clarity). I want RE gone, but Project Soul had built SC6 with RE at it's core, it would take substantial changes to the game that it would be better to make a new entry. I would love for SC6 to have RE completely remove instead of waiting for a new entry because for the first time ever, there are guest characters that I actually like to play and fight, but like all guest characters they won't appear later entries. Also the problem with removing stuff from a game that's been there from the start is that it's way more controversial to do that than adding more stuff (even though I think RI shouldn't exist but I never hear anyone complaining about it) and this doesn't just apply to gimmicks but moves themselves. I do not deny that SC6 is a flawed game, but it gets more things right than it does wrong.
 
Foot said:
Re being integral to the game i dont see it. How often do you see RE in competitive play nowadays you could easily remove that mechanic with GI/RI/JG in the game.
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What he means is that RE was one of the designed core mechanics of the game (ie like soul charge, LH) and removing it entirely is too drastic a change. There's an entire section in the command list dedicated to RE (its literally the 2nd tab right after "main attacks") for example and the project soul team actually has unique LH RE combos. RE is heavily featured in the announcement trailer, and in every character's reveal trailer as well.

If there's a lesson for Project Soul to learn, is that it isn't that RE is too powerful at low level gameplay and barely used at higher level, but rather that it's not popular because it breaks up the flow of the game with the RPS cutscene.

But mainly what im talking about is how the balance has been complete ass in S2.
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SC6 is still way better balanced than any other version of the game. Its not absolutely perfectly balanced with 5:5 matchups, but if you think S2 is "ass" then I'd hate to see how you viewed the skewed matchups in older games.
 
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