Raph confirmed as SCV Nightmare :D

soultruthgemini said:
it was already revealed that cervy has a new body. hence him looking younger. or rather not as old as he should be. the puzzle pieces fit to me. i could be wrong but the way i see it, why in story mode would they use the art of cervantes whenever Dumas was there.
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I don't think cervy was used as a host for nightmare honestly. Anytime he's been shown with the blade he commands enough strength of personality that it adheres to him, rather than him to it. He may have originally been a half-decent guy that went nuts upon picking up the sword, but his crazy persona has always had its own free agency with the sword. This is especially true as he is the boss for the original game, and only turns into inferno after you defeat him.

As for getting a younger body it is never explained how really. We do know that Ivy destroys him completely in SC4. We do know that he was a crazy enough bastard to attempt to reclaim soul edge and invade the "realm of the gods" personally if you play through SC4, so it's easy to see him as a spirit that was tenacious enough to find a way back to the realm of the living on his own terms.

The raph thing makes a lot of sense though. His vague backstory is similar to siegfried's bio from his possessed days, as if he is just finding his way out of a deep illusion he has been wandering in for 17 years.

I'm guessing at some point in SC4 he was defeated and preserved as a backup host for soul edge. Meanwhile Amy goes out, chases after him, is intercepted by kilik and detained/cured like in one of raph's endings for SC3. At this point she still has too strong of an attachment to raph though, so kilik uses his magic BS to frag her brain thinking she's better off with amnesia then chasing after an evil vampire lord.

or something
 
No no no. You said that the Nightmare now used Cervy's new body. If that were true, then where is Nightmare's beard? o.O
 
I think more likely they just used raphs model to put nightmares armour on to and didn't give much thought to nightmares face underneath.
 
soultruthgemini said:
it was already revealed that cervy has a new body. hence him looking younger. or rather not as old as he should be. the puzzle pieces fit to me. i could be wrong but the way i see it, why in story mode would they use the art of cervantes whenever Dumas was there.
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Cervantes is a full four inches taller than Dumas.

His new body is three inches taller than the old one.
 
Remember a few months back when people were hyping about Nightmare Sophitia? Even when Nightmare´s art was revealed and it wasn´t Sophitia at all yet some people were still insisting because his eyes in the art were "softer" and more "femenine". In the end we got tit angel Sophie and Nightmare Pyrrha and the general response was like nevermind.

This very thread is just like back then.
 
Oh how I wished it had been that.

Oh well, yay nightmare Pyrrha. She just better keep that damn arm, and have some neat moves with it.
 
I'm not sure if this was mentioned but Raphael also has a special quote to Voldo. "Begone Guardian" or something like that. I think that also connects him to Nightmare since Voldo is the guardian of Soul Edge and working for nightmare. Just found it odd that Raphael has a special saying to Voldo as well as Viola...or perhaps its a joke that Raphael only has special sayings to characters that have names starting with V.

I don't really care what people believe but to not see Raphael and Nightmare being connected simply makes people blind. I mean hell look at Raphael's art...he's a spirit/soul. Which would make sense when he says to Viola to stop looking into his soul.

whatever
 
This is my favourite thread in the entire forum. A good mystery keeps things interesting.

I believe for sure that Raphael is Nightmare. It only makes sense.

All this dead, undead, angel, demon, possessed stuff is starting to get to my head.
 
I do think in the original plot he was intended to be Nightmare. The "waking up in a cell with the world changed around him" thing in the plot is probably set after the new nightmare is defeated. Most probably nightmare possessed Raph soon after Soul Calibur IV, hence why Raphael doesn't know anything.

I always thought that Amy was a vampire who couldn't age thanks to Raphs corruption from the blade in SCII, the fact that she did age suggests that maybe she lost that ability when Raph turned into Nightmare, and that may have also erased any memory of her life before that.

I don't really care much that there wasn't a story mode in the game, story mode will always be half hearted and lacking in a fighting game (I don't see the big deal about MK's story mode, it was a bunch of fights strung together with a paper thin plot too similar to the original movie), but I do think the plot for SCV had a lot of potential, and it should be released separately in an rpg or anime or something.
 
Um, Vercci was a little guy with dark hair and an awesome goatie.

Vercci.jpg
 
So I tried with the prayer helm, which reveals his face lol. Took him into a match got the helm beat off of me only for the mask to reappear. It's a ghost mask I tell ya. A ghost
 
At first i was thinking this is absurd, Raphael has those wisps because he had them in 4, with his teleporting moves. But now all the signs line up.

Dumas has a body chained up in his castle dungeon
Raphael wakes up in a dungeon in his bio
Nightmare has an alt with an iron mask on it
Iron Mask, Dumas, and Raphael are all characters from the musketeers.
Same height
Same voice Actor!

In 5 one of nightmares victory quotes is "Soul edge grant your master his wish!" When before he never said such a thing. Raphael's wish for soul edge is to make the perfect world for Amy and himself. In Raphael's endings for 2 and 3 he is seen dragging soul edge in it's two handed form rather than turning into a weapon familiar to him like it should for everyone. In his ending in 2 he also practically turns into nightmare with the hair and arm and everything.

Then again these are same people who apparently told us Viola isnt Amy so anything is possible. Which is still think is bull, Viola is definitely Amy.
 
Just to be a devil's advocate: In Amy's ending she rings out Raph down into the castle. Nightmare's spare body was down under the castle. Just another thing to put two and two together.
 
ZionOAS said:
Just to be a devil's advocate: In Amy's ending she rings out Raph down into the castle. Nightmare's spare body was down under the castle. Just another thing to put two and two together.
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no one bought it when i pitched that idea before :(
 
Raph is the new nightmare and Viola (Amy) is going to become the new siegfried.

You heard it here folks. This is all leading up to Amy either killing or freeing and somehow bringing Raphael back.

Shit is going down.
 
I thought about like this, Zwei is going to get forced to kill viola because she becomes Amy again and sides with Nightmare. She doesn't even appear anymore when Pat turns alpha, Zwei could be on the same desires as Raph and wanted Soul Calibur himself, but ends up loosing so he goes to kill Nightmare himself. But after Nightmare/Raph is destroyed Zwei is killed and they all live happily ever after in the afterlife.
 
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