Favorite Taki

D.I.N.O said:
I'm not trying to start a Flame War (k maybe just a friendly rivalry) but it really just doesnt makes sense, of how you say I play online, when I KNOW how I play online.

How could I land AB after WindRoll K?! Or did you mean While Risign K? Regardless I would have no reason to press AB, even by accident. And If I did WR K, it must have ONLY been after a 6A+B Bomb....and I messed up the WR BKB.

Attacking at disadvantage? Again I dont know where to start which is why I INSIST you're thinking of someone else...I use EVASIVE moves on disadvantage...since thats how they're used...ie 33B tc.....44B back step....etc

CH A6~A+B bomb tech trap. Try it.

Oh and If I got hit by WR BBB, it was likely becuz I wanted to AIR Throw you out of it....Cuz I like to have fun when I play...

Sucks that you're PS3 got Jacked....I really wanted to teach you how to properly play Taki.

I guess I hafta play Triple T??? and show him whats up....but truly If I haven't heard of him he cant possibly be good.

And to LP? I play Taki in tourneys here and there, depends on who I'm playing or what kind of Tourney.

What most people forget (becuz not many of you were around in previous games) IS that I used Taki HEAVILY in SC2 SC3. This new Taki is a toned down version, so using her in this game is not that different.


A Truly good Taki will know how to utilize her Every Move. Especially her BT stuff, which is how I think Namco designed her.
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Ok now i'm back and can respond to this status properly.

I can point out on a lot of things where you wrong but I said I'll save that for PM's.

Also how long you play a character doesn't always mean that your better than others. Of course experience carries you further, but it's how fast your learn with the time you got, and how far it can take you.

But if I were to go by time.........then I've been playing Taki since Soul Edge when she didn't even have mekki maru. In fact, the very first game tournament (I was 17) that I went to was a SC 2 tournament and I got first place. I still have that trophy in my house lol.

So in the great words of my cousin, "I ain't new to this, I grew to this!" lmao.


Edit: I do agree with you though, Taki does need to know her whole arsenal like the back of her hand to be good. Alot of characters are like that.

Asta and slower chars don't need to know their full move list as often becaues they usually don't have a chance to use it imo.
 
Hawkeye - No offense but they don't know what they're talking about. My Taki does the same as my Voldo against Eli. And Oof was struggling against my Taki last time he had to sit up and couldnt talk and shyt...hahah but none of this matters I know where I stand....
 
Dino....... Im only going off wat i was told..
Me personally dont trash on other player's skills...
Everyone play style is different..
Sum r jus more effective den others..
I love n embrace all Taki users...
Also I bn using taki in all da series as well as in soul blade/edge.
 
Fleshmasher.. I jus checked out ur matches on youtube
And yea, u can use some work..
Dis is not a diss or a roast by any means
I jus like to help other taki users.
Shogun... If possible, could u get sum offline matches recorded.. Instead of thos online matches...
I watched ur match against Asta. And alot of thos fake frame traps was do to online..
 
hawkeye said:
Fleshmasher.. I jus checked out ur matches on youtube
And yea, u can use some work..
Dis is not a diss or a roast by any means
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It's true i play way too much online and my problem seems to be that i value style over effectiveness.
I was quite disappointed myself but it' not really a surprise.

About Windroll B it's the only Windroll Attack that, after 3KK on hit, beats a 2A from the opponent.
It is of course quite unsafe. But for Taki it's a move with a good risk/reward ratio.
 
Actually Fleshmaster is right, Wind Roll B will beat out any 2A on the game if 3KK hits previously. 3KK is only -2 on block if the Wind Roll is not initiated so if you initiate it then it beats out anyones 2A. In fact, WR B beats out any attack on the game after a 3KK hit. Don't believe me? Test it yourself in practice or against actual human players.

What people fail to realize is that even if 3KK into Wind Roll was still -2 on hit, the B portion of the wind roll is only like i8, it's the wind roll itself that's slow as fuck. So 3KK on hit you get enough frames to pull out the Wind Roll (about as many as Taki gets from doing a Standard 3KK) and if it was -2 on hit, that would bring Taki's Wind Roll B to i10 at most, the fastest while rising on the game.

So what other option on the game has i8? Taki's Mekki-Maru cancel attacks that are high and horizontal. And if you know anything about this game, everyone knows vertical beats out any horizontal on the game when the frames are the same. If the attack is i10 on block what option do you have? Taki's A is i10 but it's high/horizontal again. Anything else will be too slow and Taki will get the counter hit, for up to 118 damage (22 damage from the 3KK and the other 90 or so damage from the Counter Hit Wind Roll BBB). And going back to my gaming style, after awhile people are not gonna risk that damage taking, and puts more pressure on the opponent.

Anything else that could maybe get close to beating out Wind Roll B after 3KK hits is Amy's i11 6BB, which would still lose cause it's high and Wind Roll B TC's.
 
Also i'll update my playstyle whenever I can get a playstation/find someone who will actually record with me. I've been wanting to do this for awhile now but meh oh well we'll see how it goes.
 
hawkeye said:
WindRoll B after 3KK definitely doesnt beat out a 2A...
3KK is -2 on hit not even counting da frames 2 do da WindRoll into B.
2A does beat out 3KK on hit into WindRoll B.
I kno SUX!!!! I wish Taki still had her PO B GB..
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When you do a natural string, any part (input) of the string after the first move might begin at any time from the startup of the preceding input. Frame values are time until you can guard (except for some stance data in some parts of the wiki). If you change :A: to :A::A:, you don't wait for :A: to finish but interrupt the first move with another. For AA, the second attack is fast enough to show up during :A:'s blockstun, making it a blockstring even though A is -8. That attack shows up at least 9 frames before the end of just :A:.

3KK being -2 on hit implies nothing about how 3KKB+K comes out. The same goes for 3KKK. You Windroll before you would have been able to guard. You have to check the move to see the time gap between that second K and anything you might do after it.
 
Oh hit 3KK WRO B does beat out i14 2As. It'd take an i13 or faster mid/SL/SM to beat that situation. And since WRO TCs she can be crouch thrown out of it (crouch throws are i13).
 
How dare you questioning my wisdom?
I've forgotten more about Taki than you even know.
:P

Ok i did some testing and actually what i said was not completely right.

When you hit a crouching opponent with 3KK you leave the opponent fully crouched and a fully crouched 2A (FC 2A) is 1 frame faster than a normal 2A and in this case just fast enough to beat the WR B.

When you hit a standing opponent with 3KK your WRO B WILL beat their standard 2A. I tested this with Amy's, Yoshi's and Taki's 2As.
If you know a faster 2A tell me.

Funny enough Taki's own 3K seems to be faster than her 2A because in a mirror after Normal Hit 3KK the opponent taki's 3K will trade with the WRO B. It's not a fair trade damage wise though.

@ the guys who referred to the Wiki and 3KK being -2 on hit: 3KK to WRO is a stance transition.
Like AB PO.
And 3KK to WRO is in the Wiki as 3KK B+K, without hit frames because stance transition hit frames are a bit complicated to test.
That's also the reason why i don't really have many WRO transitions in my sticky frame list yet.

So please before you call someone wrong because of data from wherever make sure you understand it.
Or even better test it out yourself because the data can be wrong or incomplete.
Thank you.

EDIT: Forget that red part: 3K is not faster than 2A it's just that 2A get's beaten by WRO B because As get beaten by Bs.
And 3K trades because it's a vertical too.
 
FleshMasher said:
@ the guys who referred to the Wiki and 3KK being -2 on hit: 3KK to WRO is a stance transition.
Like AB PO.
And 3KK to WRO is in the Wiki as 3KK B+K, without hit frames because stance transition hit frames are a bit complicated to test.
That's also the reason why i don't really have many WRO transitions in my sticky frame list yet.

So please before you call someone wrong because of data from wherever make sure you understand it.
Or even better test it out yourself because the data can be wrong or incomplete.
Thank you.
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I want to ask you about this, but the indirectness of your post is making it difficult, so bear with me:

Should I change some part of my previous post? Maybe, change the "3KK being -2 on hit" to "If 3KK were -2 on hit, even then"? Hopefully users can still get the understanding of frame data from my post that I intended. I don't need to affirm 3KK's data as being anything to make the point I made there.


My remark about stances in the wiki, I meant that some SAs have directed their wikis with putting the first frame at which you can do something in stance, listing moves like Raph's 22 as -6 12 STN, even though by convention it's more like -40~ -20~ -??~. It is an exception to what I said, so I had to deal with it.
I do appreciate the complications in testing the frames for going into a stance, and doing a move from stance. I have a lot of free time though, maybe I could get data up for Taki's wiki.

In return for explaining myself, perhaps in return you could tell me what you meant by "3KK to WRO is a stance transition."? Is there something about stance transitions other than the obvious which you are saying about 3KKB+K, or were you pointing out it transitions to stance?
 
Mandritti said:
I really like to talk a lot. In return for explaining myself........
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What is this? People have to trade/deal now on 8wayrun to get information in the Soul Arenas?

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Anyway, Dreamkiller is my favorite Taki. Hot!
 
Mandritti said:
I want to ask you about this, but the indirectness of your post is making it difficult, so bear with me:

Should I change some part of my previous post? Maybe, change the "3KK being -2 on hit" to "If 3KK were -2 on hit, even then"? Hopefully users can still get the understanding of frame data from my post that I intended. I don't need to affirm 3KK's data as being anything to make the point I made there.
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I guess the point you were trying to make was that: Because on NH, 3KK is -2 and that disadvantage, plus the time you need for a normal WRO, would make WRO B come out too slow to beat the opponents 2A.

But: (Now i'll explain what i mean with 3KK B+K is a stance transition)

Unlike most other attacks (for example KK), 3KK has the built in possibility to go faster into WRO than usual by pressing B+K.
After 3KK the duration of the shift into WRO is shorter than it would usually be if you just pressed B+K out of nowhere.
So 3KK B+K gives you a faster transition into WRO than KK B+K would although KK gives +frames on hit but KK just doesn't have the built in "fast transition possibility" 3KK has.

Because 3KK has this special "fast transition possibility", you can't just add the recovery frames of 3KK and the impact frames of a Normal WRO B when you wanna know if it beats this or that.

i hope i explained it right and didn't just state the obvious again.

Anyway, after 3KK on hit WRO B beats a normal 2A, just test it yourself already so that i can say i told you so :)
 
FleshMasher said:
I guess the point you were trying to make was that: Because on NH, 3KK is -2 and that disadvantage, plus the time you need for a normal WRO, would make WRO B come out too slow to beat the opponents 2A.

But: (Now i'll explain what i mean with 3KK B+K is a stance transition)

Unlike most other attacks (for example KK), 3KK has the built in possibility to go faster into WRO than usual by pressing B+K.
After 3KK the duration of the shift into WRO is shorter than it would usually be if you just pressed B+K out of nowhere.
So 3KK B+K gives you a faster transition into WRO than KK B+K would although KK gives +frames on hit but KK just doesn't have the built in "fast transition possibility" 3KK has.

Because 3KK has this special "fast transition possibility", you can't just add the recovery frames of 3KK and the impact frames of a Normal WRO B when you wanna know if it beats this or that.

i hope i explained it right and didn't just state the obvious again.

Anyway, after 3KK on hit WRO B beats a normal 2A, just test it yourself already so that i can say i told you so :)
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Yep, fleshmaster is right on this. There's alot of moves that transition faster into a "stance" type ablilties which is why it's hard to test the frame data for those moves. noticing the difference of KK B+K and 3KK B+K is a really good example, since 3KK has the ability to transition faster into wind roll. With these type of "stance" transistions you can actually make Taki faster than what the frames allow. An example of this doing a standard AB on hit and still be behind on frames and doing AB PO on hit and get a frame advantage.

Some moves are even excecuted quicker because of this type animations. For example AB, 4A+B is actually a faster transition bomb than standard i30 A+B. In fact, I believe the whole AB 4A+B sequence is less than i30 frames put together, but I haven't tested that yet. So if AB hits on NH or CH, you'll be able to TC under any high performed on you for a free bomb.

But there's also moves that can actually make you transition slower, if not the same speed when going into "stance" type attacks.

8~9 KK PO actually has a slower PO transition speed than a standard i15 PO. Same with 6KA Po.
 
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