Talim Q&A / General Discussion

Dogysamich

[09] Warrior
So, I found a quick fix for my problem. I wonder how long it's going to last.

AS/Jump mixup. Yeah, i got the bright idea of, instead of ASing, just jumping forward. I was curious if people actually noted that talim makes noise and flips or if they just lump it all into "She's in the air and coming at me." .... so far, everybody lumps it as "She's in the air and coming at me". It's pretty comical.

Works for WL too, although I gotta figure out what could be done from it.
 

CrazyYoshimitsu

[10] Knight
Ok, this guy on xbl, xshinobidestiny, doesn't know a thing about Talim. He was going on how Talim can win like there is no problem. When I said that Talim is hard to win with. I went on to say that Talim ahs no good match ups. Then he comebacks, and states that she has good match ups, and they were X,Tira,Vader, mina, and Rock. I was like W.O.W. I said do you know her frames, dude? He's like no, I don't know her frames because I'm to lazy to study her. So can someone please explain this to me? I am really lost right now.
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
What are you lost on, here? Are you're confused as to whether or not the matchups xshinobidestiny listed were good ones for Talim?

If so, I'd say he may have a point about Tira and Rock. (Maybe even Vader as well, not sure about that one...) But definitely not with Mina and X being in Talim's favor.

It could be just me, but I think X is actually a better matchup than Mina. Only things with X that are annoying are her 44B and punishing with AA (i11). Tira is on the fence for me, as I can't really see her causing Talim too much trouble even with slightly better range. Talim doesn't seem to have any clear advantage, but not a clear disadvantage either. Only good Tira I played was Mikosu, so this is still up in the air.
 

CrazyYoshimitsu

[10] Knight
thank zero, that what I was confuse on. It seem the best were getting is 5-5's. If talim was a tad bit better she can have some 6-4 matches in her favor.
 

Dogysamich

[09] Warrior
did you people not read wtf i said?

I ducked a damn BB. I dont mean I ducked it out of fear and got hit. I mean I ducked that shit and didnt get hit. Ducked it like a champ!

I'm also fucking around, so you're in your rights to completely ignore me.

____

SERIOUS QUESTION, THOUGH.

Does anybody happen to have like, talim matchups? I'm kinda curious about that beyond "Well I'm playing talim, i'm probably at disadvantage."
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
did you people not read wtf i said?

I ducked a damn BB. I dont mean I ducked it out of fear and got hit. I mean I ducked that shit and didnt get hit. Ducked it like a champ!

I'm also fucking around, so you're in your rights to completely ignore me.

____

SERIOUS QUESTION, THOUGH.

Does anybody happen to have like, talim matchups? I'm kinda curious about that beyond "Well I'm playing talim, i'm probably at disadvantage."

When did you say anything about ducking a BB? I didn't see a post about that...

Jaxel put down his opinions on some of the matchups in the "Talim vs the SC4 cast" thread. If you've seen threads in other forums about matchup rankings for characters, it'd be interesting to get some perspectives from everyone as to how to rate Talim's matchups over there.

The characters I fight fairly often are Voldo, Ivy, Cassandra, Sophitia, (only really one Sophie player), Taki, Hilde, Setsuka, Astaroth, Siegfried, and as of last night Kilik. I can play Xianghua and Kilik, as well as Tira and Amy to an extent, so I have a good idea of how they basically work. Anyone else, I either haven't played against at all, or not enough to have any real input. (I was beaten by a Raph player at last night's Kogarasumaru tourney mostly because I've never faced him offline before, for example.) But yeah, If anyone here has any experience against Raph, Nightmare, Yun, Cervy, the Star Wars cast, Mitsu, Lizardman, Yoshi, Rock, Maxi, Zas, or Algol, go on and put your own opinions in the vs thread.
 

Dogysamich

[09] Warrior
oh i didnt post it in this thread, nowonder. XD My bad.

But yeah, I fuckin ducked a BB saturday when I was playing. It was pretty fuckin comical. AS'd through another one.

___

That matchup thread? Forgot about that. Iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii'm just fuckin up all over the place.

My bad. :|
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
I guess it would depend on the transition. I don't fight too many Yun's to say for sure, but wouldn't AA or K work just as easily? 66A or A+K might work as well. I think Yun can TJ 2A anyway with CR B+K or CR KG can't he?

Haven't gotten to testing counter stuff against him yet, so I'm just offering suggestions off the top of my head here
 

ruinandchaos85

[08] Mercenary
The problem with AA is the CR 2K(I think?) TCs. I've been using AAB, AA6BA, to deal with CR for the most part, until one of the Yun spammers started abusing CR 2K, and I lost a match because of it.

I'm not sure about the TJ either. I've never had 2A be TJ'd by anything except Talim's stuff before. Is CR B+K the GB where he jumps across the stage? If so, I think 2A may be faster. And also, I don't let most Yun's stay in CR for very long. I try to punish it on reaction with 1A+B or AA. However, since 1A+B is treated as a vertical, it tends to get countered.

In any case, if 2A won't work A+K might, it's Talim's only fast horizontal besides AA and 2A. I'll give it a try next chance I get. Or I could try IWC. I'll do some vs Yun tests tomorrow. To tired right now.
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
Hey, whenever you get to it is fine. Saves me a bit of work with the Counter Attacks list.

I think 66A is faster than A+K, come to think of it. Also try 6K or 3K. 6K may be treated as a vertical as well, but 3K should do nicely if your close enough. Plus it gives nice advantage on hit.

And yeah CR B+K is the GB move.
 

ruinandchaos85

[08] Mercenary
-__-zzzz

I went ahead and tested some things anyway. CR K:G does indeed TJ 2A. I didn't check CR K, but I do know it's WC'able. Also, IWC is way too slow to counter CR transition, and the TC frame is way to short to time properly. You'd have to do it almost as soon as, say CR B, hits.

Also, a correction, what I was talking about before was not CR 2K, it's CR A+K, which of course TCs. 1A+B will work if you wait for Yun to attack, but I think Yun auto counters on neutral. Not sure there. As far as I can see, Talim and Yun are par for par. There is no surefire way for Talim to counter CR. I can test 66A, I didn't think about that. But my problem is, which is the same problem with A+K, I'm not accustomed to using 66A in a situation like that, so my reaction is definately slowed.
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
Ahh I see...

To be honest, I don't think there is a one-move solution to stopping Crane altogether. but as long as there is one general answer to a large majority of Yun's options, it'll force the Yun player to limit his options to what works. Which limits the amount of guessing for us Talim players.
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
So here's something I don't think has been discussed already. What do you guys think are good options for Talim post-GI? I admittedly haven't taken this part of the game into account for Talim. I'm so used to people automatically re-GIing that I've been conditioned to use 236B after a GI or JI. Sometimes I'll go for the multi-part throw after a regular GI, but I've had it broken or JIed before.

If the followup move is 20 frames or less it's unblockable, but it can be impacted or parried. If it's more than 20 frames it can be blocked, but becomes a good backup for people who like to re-GI. What are your thoughts on this?
 

Eclair

[10] Knight
I always grab after a GI. Its all about the mix ups with the grabs. Albeit my friends haven't mastered escaping from grabs but it works the majority of the time.
 

ZeroEffect317

[13] Hero
I've been trying to condition myself to use 1A+B~2A+B or 66A~AS A. Something with a quick knockdown and grounded damage. That way the people who refuse to re-GI will have a reason to.

66A is probably better actually, cause it can RO forward, and the AS A is a tech trap. If they don't tech it's still like 40 something damage.
 

fe7lyn

[08] Mercenary
What are you lost on, here? Are you're confused as to whether or not the matchups xshinobidestiny listed were good ones for Talim?

If so, I'd say he may have a point about Tira and Rock. (Maybe even Vader as well, not sure about that one...) But definitely not with Mina and X being in Talim's favor.

It could be just me, but I think X is actually a better matchup than Mina. Only things with X that are annoying are her 44B and punishing with AA (i11). Tira is on the fence for me, as I can't really see her causing Talim too much trouble even with slightly better range. Talim doesn't seem to have any clear advantage, but not a clear disadvantage either. Only good Tira I played was Mikosu, so this is still up in the air.

I prefer playing against X than Mina but that's only because of the range Mina has over talim. X has more of a variety of moves but once you are familiar with most of them then it should be fair game.
 

ruinandchaos85

[08] Mercenary
I've never had a problem with Mina's spacing game. Could be I haven't played any good Mina's, because there aren't a lot of Mina players online, but most of her long range moves are pretty linear, and the ones that aren't can be AS'd. I find Talim v. Mina a lot easier than Talim v. X.

As far as post-GI mind games go, I either throw or use 4BB. However, it's rare for me to GI against a good opponent. Bad habit from playing online too much, I guess.
 

MasudSabr

[08] Mercenary
Am I the only one who go for a WC-something after a GI? <.<
On a similar topic though. Okay, you've just performed a beautiful 22K and danced around your opponent's attack... What now? I usually go for a 1A+B or a throw, but there must be better options?