Yoshi Okizeme & Tech Trap Guide

3B, a:B+K, 8A+BG is ONLY guaranteed if their back was turned and they slid on their stomach rather than back. Otherwise, you just sidestep or back step on wake up to avoid it. If they slide on their chests, it even has a chance to hit grounded opponents, so I find it invaluable to use at that time. 3B, a:B+K, 8A+B4 I learned when I first started the game and I have been using it my whole career. As much as I would hate to tell you how to avoid it, Hajime was right in his guess. You must back step or run forward. Those are your only "safe" options. It has a chance to wiff if you side step too, however unlikely. You are better off just walking back. It saddens me that others finally decided to ask about it, for I have loved deceiving people with it since I learned it =/
 
CH a:B+K 11A catches all direction and gives +3, should hit even if they stay on the floor.

the only problem with this is iMCF is always faster then a:B+K just by 3ish frames, but this is way easier then doing a:B+K iMCF [place combo here] usually people do iMCF for their main counter/punish speed attack,

but if you can manage to land a a:B+K to counter with try 11A with a +3 you can 3AB for very high gain high risk situation for a CH, or if you want to play it safe after the 11A, try grabbing, 4B, 22K, 44bA (Three-two hits cancel), stances anything, that leads into mixups or very high pressure.
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Also any 8A+B 2/G setups you can either 214A and it will provide natural knockdown on right tech and it will hit them OTG if they try to tech any direction, but if you want the natural knockdown on right tech don't buffer the 214A after the heli UB, if they stay grounded it'll miss so either that or 3B.

Also another note about 8A+B 2/G after that you can also do REF A and if they do tech (catches all directions) you can do double (2x) door knocker on almost every character beside Amy.

I was reading about some info on the FC 3K, what's the best situation? On what Hotnikkelz have said, he's right about after FC 3K then DGK K usually after the FC 3K they'll be rolling by the time you drop a DGF K they'll be rolling and they can get up in time to block and punish, so if you try DGF B that'll be no good at all since they're rolling, my opinion on this is to

-If they try rolling try RCC 2A+B 6[6], they can't roll out of they'll take the whole combo
-If they try blocking you should do RCC 3B+K it pushes them back and they can't roll out and it gives you -3 so it's impossible for them to catch you.

~Basically I believe it's better than a 3B because on how bad it is on block but 3B is still way faster.
I believe I might make a short guide about, Ukemis and pressure on yoshi soon.
 
For the a:B+K tech trap, I think it's more useful to go for the iMCF (however, there may be times when your tech trap is more useful =] ) Also, I posted all the tech-traps (well, good ones anyways) possible for 8A+BG and 8A+B4, so they were known too. I'm glad you're thinking though; tech traps are a good thing to discover =]
 
Icy: You should come out to the next NorCal gathering before you consider writing a guide. Give your theories a try against real competition. Besides, it would be interesting to see another NorCal Yoshi.

IcyBlueCrysis said:
CH a:B+K 11A catches all direction and gives +3, should hit even if they stay on the floor.

the only problem with this is iMCF is always faster then a:B+K just by 3ish frames, but this is way easier then doing a:B+K iMCF [place combo here] usually people do iMCF for their main counter/punish speed attack,

but if you can manage to land a a:B+K to counter with try 11A with a +3 you can 3AB for very high gain high risk situation for a CH, or if you want to play it safe after the 11A, try grabbing, 4B, 22K, 44bA

(Three-two hits cancel), stances anything, that leads into mixups or very high pressure.
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iMCF is the superior option by far. Please note, this thread is for discussing okizeme and tech traps. This thread isn't for discussing options after connecting various moves, because your mileage will vary greatly based on how your opponent plays.

Also any 8A+B 2/G setups you can either 214A and it will provide natural knockdown on right tech and it will hit them OTG if they try to tech any direction, but if you want the natural knockdown on right tech don't buffer the 214A after the heli UB, if they stay grounded it'll miss so either that or 3B.
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Discussed already in the first post.

I was reading about some info on the FC 3K, what's the best situation? On what Hotnikkelz have said, he's right about after FC 3K then DGK K usually after the FC 3K they'll be rolling by the time you drop a DGF K they'll be rolling and they can get up in time to block and punish, so if you try DGF B that'll be no good at all since they're rolling, my opinion on this is to

-If they try rolling try RCC 2A+B 6[6], they can't roll out of they'll take the whole combo
-If they try blocking you should do RCC 3B+K it pushes them back and they can't roll out and it gives you -3 so it's impossible for them to catch you.

~Basically I believe it's better than a 3B because on how bad it is on block but 3B is still way faster.
I believe I might make a short guide about, Ukemis and pressure on yoshi soon.
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Take your FC 3K, 2K and be done with it. Yoshi is not at a large enough advantage to really capitalize on connecting FC 3K. You don't get any tech traps and you're just far enough away to not be a threat on sleepers.
 
HajimeOwari said:
Take your FC 3K, 2K and be done with it. Yoshi is not at a large enough advantage to really capitalize on connecting FC 3K. You don't get any tech traps and you're just far enough away to not be a threat on sleepers.
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Technically speaking if you can get combo with RCC 3B, then you really have more adv than RCC 3B and FC K. Problem is though PG dash is VERY risky if u were wrong and they simply block. Now personally, i do RCC 3B, i find although 2K gives more ground adv (slight but significant), RCC 3B leaves me deeper with enough adv for my purposes. So in essence I agree with hajime of course, don't give up on guaranteed damage unless you can make the reward worth from sacrificing it and most of the time, Yoshi really can't here unless you're psychic i guess :)

Instead of 2A+B though, try experimenting with 66A+B and cancels. Much safer option....i can't recall if it stops all siderolls post FC 3K though. I am rust at SC, even more so with Yosh ;) Hajime can tell u
 
IMO, the timing on RCC 3B as a follow up is so tight with such little reward, it's not really worth the effort. But, to each his own!
 
66A+B can rolled after FC 3K even 66A+BG but 2[A+B] blocked is +15 on block and pretty much can't be interrupted
But yeah 2K the best idea I guess after 2K i'll go with FC 1K: K: K: K: K if they tech and block.
 
ok cool, couldn't remember. Don't get me wrong i like 2A+B and it's variants.

Hajime, i'm accustomed to this combo ;) since SC1.....although....the rust takes its toll. What's the damage difference?
 
IcyBlueCrysis said:
66A+B can rolled after FC 3K even 66A+BG but 2[A+B] blocked is +15 on block and pretty much can't be interrupted
But yeah 2K the best idea I guess after 2K i'll go with FC 1K: K: K: K: K if they tech and block.
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Nothing is guaranteed after FC 3K except 2K or a nearly perfectly timed RCC 3B (you have a few frames of error).

2[A+B] may give +15 on block (assuming the testing is correct), but that doesn't mean everything from FLE can't be interrupted afterward.

FC 1K after a grounded 2K is not a tech trap and in that particular case won't connect because you'll be way too far away. You're trying to plan things way to far in advance assuming they'll work. In essence, you're playing theory fighter without testing anything and, no offense, but you're not really contributing to this thread at all. If you want to post about tech traps and okizeme, study this thread and the other big Yoshi threads and learn how to properly test tech traps before you jump to conclusions on what work and doesn't. Thanks.


hotnikkelz said:
ok cool, couldn't remember. Don't get me wrong i like 2A+B and it's variants.

Hajime, i'm accustomed to this combo ;) since SC1.....although....the rust takes its toll. What's the damage difference?
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Less than 10. Sure, early SCs it worked great, but in SCIV it's just not worth it unless you really have the timing down well and you're playing against a character who can only punish your 3B on block with AA.
 
I must agree with hajime's position. If you are lucky enough to land a FC3K, take your free 2K and be happy that you weren't blocked.

Yoshi's wakeup game is so bad now. Tricks don't work on people.
 
Hey Hajime, wondering if you would be able to to test this (I know you'd be able to do this far better than me.) In a corner, opponent back to wall, SDGF B,2A+B_iMCF trapped a couple people today on-line. Need to know if it works constantly. Didn't see it posted anywhere.

Worked against Voldo & Kilik .. lemme know!!
 
Im not sure if im totally speaking out of my ass but I was trying some moves with yoshi and I noticed that after REF B,K, BT 2K, 66B cant be tech rolled to any side (I think). It can be blocked on the crouch though. Does that mean its a tech trap? or is it nothing? This is more for my own understanding than anything.
 
Well if it doesn't catch tech it's not a tech trap, but since it catches all rolls and hits grounded I would consider it to be a "down trap"... Meaning if the opponent decides not to tech it can't be avoided... Hey, doesn't BT 2K, 66B combo anyway??? And I believe REF BK, BT 2K falls under the same category, I think BT 2K can be blocked...
 
I may get flamed for this, but correct me if I'm wrong. If for instance I use T2(Drunken evade) and they hit me with a mid. I noticed that if I'm hit I'd spin evade to the side like every Yoshi does.

But sometimes if I follow-up with a couple :B:s, I'd be right behind them. So as noobish as this sounds, would a backthrow be some guaranteed damage? And can they grapple break the back throw Yoshi does? Once again, correct me if I'm wrong.
 
senzait said:
Im not sure if im totally speaking out of my ass but I was trying some moves with yoshi and I noticed that after REF B,K, BT 2K, 66B cant be tech rolled to any side (I think). It can be blocked on the crouch though. Does that mean its a tech trap? or is it nothing? This is more for my own understanding than anything.
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REF BK, BT 2K is a combo.
BT 2K, 66B is a combo.

The entire thing is NOT a combo.


NamuSkull said:
I may get flamed for this, but correct me if I'm wrong. If for instance I use T2(Drunken evade) and they hit me with a mid. I noticed that if I'm hit I'd spin evade to the side like every Yoshi does.

But sometimes if I follow-up with a couple :B:s, I'd be right behind them. So as noobish as this sounds, would a backthrow be some guaranteed damage? And can they grapple break the back throw Yoshi does? Once again, correct me if I'm wrong.
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Back throw is guaranteed damage if the opponent isn't playing Voldo or Asta. Either of those guys can break back throws. Same 50/50 chance, though.
 
Why isnt this OKI guide stickied? I believe JB and everyone else put a significant amount of time into this. OKI is just as important if not more important than punishment or frames but they are stickied? Just wondering...

Also the Tekken Study deserves a sticky as well. I shouldnt have to search around for two of the most important threads in here... It'd be a shame if the tekken moves got moved to the back and new players never even saw the study cause they didnt think to look.

Both of those guides are pretty in depth with alot of work from people in the community. They should be easy to find...
 
funkpanda said:
I must agree with hajime's position. If you are lucky enough to land a FC3K, take your free 2K and be happy that you weren't blocked.

Yoshi's wakeup game is so bad now. Tricks don't work on people.
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WTF is this guy smoking?? LoL yoshi's wake up game is bad...? have you been reading this thread guy ?
 
RedDjinn said:
WTF is this guy smoking?? LoL yoshi's wake up game is bad...? have you been reading this thread guy ?
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I agree with you man, once I understood yoshi´s wake up game, I started playing somewhat different, no more dirty tricks, just plain and simple pain to sleeprs and SG dmg for turtles, and everything else that is known atm
 
In FunkPanda's defense, he used iFC 3K so often in tourneys that TX players block low in certain situations out of anticipation. I think that's why he feels Yoshi lacks a strong wake-up game. I don't feel the two are related, though. (Those two things being FC 3K and Yoshi wakes).
 
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