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ZeroEffect317
[13] Hero
More Talim buffs incoming in the next patch:
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There weren't any nerfs mentioned outside of removing the 6BB~WS A+B combo. Which is pretty dumb and definitely an oversight.Her biggest issue for me right now is less the ability to get in and more the ability to stop people from retreating once she is. Staying in is a bit tricky. Specifically due to that spacing you can do against Talim where you can freely 8-way run her forever and she has no tracking mid to stop you from doing so. If she does a high, you can react with a block/crouch or a high crushing move. Even a lot of her high moves like 6A don't quite get far enough fast enough to stop people from just running away after certain moves. 66B is also not a backstep catcher as advertised, so maybe they'll touch the distance, or speed, or high/mid property of it.
Why are they messing with wnc B.B that's her only guard break out of that move and it's needed if anyting it needs to give frame advantage it's retarded plus the only does 10% on a guard gauge not a lot.@Skiegh you probably missed the the translation from Okubo :
View attachment 57922
For CE, I see some kind of RO option, maybe CE 4 WNF BB?
Is WNC B:B considered as a delayed version?
Change to BT B+K, A+B is welcome, I often encountered the described issue.
actually no it's a get out of jail free card if you use your ce and they block you can use that as a mix-up to scare'm basically.Does this mean that CE can now be used as a combo extender?
Yea basically you can use it that way or you can just go for the damaged so it's totally up to you
No actually I think we misunderstood it because you can only cancel it after the second hit so it stops you from getting GI on the 3rd so what it is a mix up to save yourself.Theoretically, that means you could do a combo such as LH WNF B:B~CE6~WNS (K)~A,A,A+B.
No actually I think we misunderstood it because you can only cancel it after the second hit so it stops you from getting GI on the 3rd so what it is a mix up to save yourself.
It's more like ce to jump in then as you're hitting the guard they have 2 options.
1.Let the go ce and don't challenge it
2. Challenge the CE and try to guard in pact
Which leaves you with a few options you can go into wnf and go for wind canning which is worse than taking the CE because when canning does more damage
@Skiegh you probably missed the the translation from Okubo :
From what I read it says starting after the second hit so if you hit somebody while they're standing it automatically goes into the cinematic .The chain of thought I'm following is that since all three hits are needed to start the cinematic against airborne opponents, it would make sense that you would be able to connect the first two hits before transitioning to WNS for potential follow-ups.
Ah, good. Yeah, I don't think that was out when I stumbled over it.
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Seems the patch is mostly just bug fixes, some of which I did notice.
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CE: I imagine the guard break numbers are now more like 5%/5%/5% instead of 10%/2%/10% or whatever it was before. With the ability to switch into stance after the second hit, I imagine you can do some pretty crazy forced guard break situations now, which is good because breaking guard with her CE had a lot of scaling. May possibly be new ways to combo from the CE as well, maybe. This move is now just a complete "I want in" card now, which is going to be a little silly, but certainly gives her more of a use for her super now. Now when using it as a tech trap, even if it doesn't hit, you still get more pressure. So sticking to people with meter is going to be a lot easier.
Behavior 1: I assume this is just a bug fix where Talim could ring herself out more easily. Considering she has a better ability to ring herself out than her opponent, I guess that's good.
Behavior 2: I did notice BT A+B could whiff sometimes up close, so I'm glad that's fixed. I didn't enjoy being Astaroth while BT.
22_88B: Eh... tracking, really? The move is still worse than just doing any of her other options if you stepped a move. I guess it might be selectively useful against attacks which move a lot, but considering 3Bs universally received buffs to whiffed tracking, eh...
B+K~A+B: Oh, thank god. Another bug fix I noticed a lot. This was a regular occurrence against good players, so now they will hopefully get stuck blocking if they get up against this move, as it should be.
WNC-BB: Sounds like it's mostly just going to gain more advantage on hit. Still not sure why I would opt for this over the delayed version. Save for the delayed version's ability to be stepped now, it seems. The reduced blockstun on the first hit is likely to create a gap where people could try stepping the changed WNC-B~B version.
WNC-B~B: Damage nerf! That sort of blows, but this move was usually the combo ender, so hopefully not a huge issue. On stun combos, you could do WNC-BB to launch them higher anyway, so that may be the better option now if this scales too hard. It being able to be stepped seems unnecessary, but, it's just another situation where Talim is putting you in a "mix-up." People can step it, but if you do WNC-BB, the second hit will counter-hit and launch them -- I hope. This is a pretty pointless change, and I'm sort of confused as to why they touched WNC-B, as it is one of her slowest options from WNC, and she only has a few ways where she can ever safely go into it.
6BB: No more dumb combo. Seems they just made it so you can block high during the last few frames of stun, which is... a very arbitrary solution to fix this, but okay. So I assume frame advantage for other mix-ups are mostly the same. So this will likely remain one of her only ways to go into WNC-B safely on hit. That said, they also increased the distance on hit, which might bring it more in line with how it was before? Hopefully she is now at a range where both her WNC and WNS options work effectively. And, hopefully, this does not screw up her new 6BB counter-hit combos in to WNS-(K). This change has the potential to fuck over a lot of things, or be rather nice.
Reading it more, it actually says it does MORE hitstun on hit. So perhaps you can do some real WNS mix-ups on hit, which is nice. Damage buff to the first hit is likely to offset the lost combo. Probably be hitting 40ish damage with this, which ain't bad at all. 1st hit... now hits grounded opponents? If so, Talim just got another option in her long list of Oki buttons. Could probably clip people on the ground with the first hit and force them to get up to the charged version. Not bad.
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Nothing really game changing here. Mostly just bug fixes and things to hopefully increase Talim's consistency. In-fact, you could make the argument she got nerfed more than buffed in this patch despite all the buff arrows. Though the CE change will be stupid, depending on how plus the stance transitions are. Mostly the same character for me as she was last patch. 6BB changes to distance and WNC-BB/B~B are the only things which may cause problems.
Actually it's very possible you can do the combo as @Thylacine492 said. It's also very possible that if the 2nd hit of CE guard crushes, you may get a LH cannon out of it. It doesn't specify that the stance cancel only works on guarding the CE. Just that you can cancel after the 2nd hit.No actually I think we misunderstood it because you can only cancel it after the second hit so it stops you from getting GI on the 3rd so what it is a mix up to save yourself.
Okay that would mean they rework the whole thing completely which would be if the CE hit there is no cinematic show which don't make sense.Actually it's very possible you can do the combo as @Thylacine492 said. It's also very possible that if the 2nd hit of CE guard crushes, you may get a LH cannon out of it. It doesn't specify that the stance cancel only works on guarding the CE. Just that you can cancel after the 2nd hit.
But my biggest concern is the WNC B-B nefActually it's very possible you can do the combo as @Thylacine492 said. It's also very possible that if the 2nd hit of CE guard crushes, you may get a LH cannon out of it. It doesn't specify that the stance cancel only works on guarding the CE. Just that you can cancel after the 2nd hit.
If you hit CE in juggles you get all 3 hits before the cinematic. For example do 236B and then CE. If I'm right, that means you could do 236B~CE~6~WNS A+B or something for massive RO potential.Okay that would mean they rework the whole thing completely which would be if the CE hit there is no cinematic show which don't make sense.
Yeah they really took that move apart. I wonder why they felt the need to.But my biggest concern is the WNC B-B nef