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JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
As you said, logic is the key here, and most people, I assume, would draw the same conclusion given the same premises.
MistaKoo
MistaKoo
No they're just lazy and under pressure to finish quickly, they probably searched for the closest/most suitable base body.
ChaosK
ChaosK
Thats what strikes me as most logical as well. I could see it turning out true though. We have just no proof yet, even if people claim their stuff to be proofs :/
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
Sorry to be stubborn but your "They were under pressure" and "that's no sufficient proof" are like claiming Clark Kent ain't Superman... Nightmare was not the last character to be shown, they had time to work on him, and surely plenty of time 'cause if there is Soul Edge, there is Nightmare. It's not a coincidence, it's just plain obvious.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
Ryan was a good voice since III, why change him if Nightmare doesn't have a new body/host? And if they used the "most suitable base body", why didn't they gave him at least another haircut?
Cause I doubt that Raphael's face + Raphael's hair + Raphael's voice actor = new host is Amy... Seriously?
ChaosK
ChaosK
I think the biggest problem with this theory is, that Soul Edge always copies the style of his host. Cervy + SE = Inferno, Siegfried + SE = NM, Pyrrha + SE = Omega. So it doesn't make any sense that this new NM doesn't use raphs fencer style and thats a very big counter imho.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
Raphael's body is empty, since we gotta play with his soul/ghost (hence the "smoke" around his feet on his artwork). The "ghost theory" was brought up at the same time Raphael was confirmed. And maybe it's the same "excuse" as Siegfried using Soul Calibur "in disguise": the sword lost power, so it cannot shapshift anymore. New and stronger host: SC goes to APat, SE goes to Oprah.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
And Soul Calibur uses 2 forms in this game, sword and shield and iai sword. Why couldn't Soul Edge do the same?
ChaosK
ChaosK
Oh dont get me started on the raph is a ghost theory. Imo thats super far-fetched and wonky.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
I wouldn't believe it myself. But yet it should be quite logical since Raphael was confirmed as deceased at the end of SCIV. Far-fetched or not, it's the most obvious theory.
ChaosK
ChaosK
It was never clearly stated that he died. Also he is a vampire. Vampires are undead beings, so him returning would be nothing unusual and imho is much less far fetched than being a ghost which has all sorts of issues.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-10-20-raphael-confirmed-for-soulcalibur-5
Tago confirmed he was dead. He is not a vampire, he is a malfested. The word vampire was never ever used. Might he be a ghost, a vampire, a djinn or a leprechaun, the fact is: Nightmare's new host is under Raphael's profile in the official artbook. I suppose these elements are enough to prove the connection between the two.
ChaosK
ChaosK
Point still stands. So the two profiles being next to each other confirms their connection? I don't think so. Imo people really like the idea of raph being NM and therefore are confusing coincidences with bare facts.
ChaosK
ChaosK
I am not saying that it is unlikely to be true, i am just saying coincidental stuff like the same VA is just not a proof. Something like a confirmation from the devs. a cutscene showing it or NM using fencer style - that would be a proof.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
Ok so according to you:
Raphael's facial structure + Raphael's voice actors in both languages (why there were plenty of other VA to find) + Raphael's hair + Graf Dumas (French name) being obviously Raphael (same intonations etc, unlike Sieg and Ezio) + NM confirmed as totally new character (by a developer)
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
+ Dumas confirmed to have "sacrificed his body" to the sword (which used memories as a fighting style, so possibly NM/Sieg's) + Raphael's confirmed to have died and returned "for no apparent reason" (by a developer)
All this does not PROVE they are the same? I wouldn't call these "coincidences", but obviously lack of imagination from the PS team.
ChaosK
ChaosK
To be honest the only viable arguments from everything above are NM's looks and the same VA. Everything else strikes me as totally pointless, again something that people consider as a confirmation because they WANT it to be true rather than actually proving anything.
ChaosK
ChaosK
For example the point: Dumas confirmed to have "sacrificed his body" to the sword. To you that somehow is a pro point. For me it is a counter because raph has a strong wish to create a world for amy. So it sounds nothing like him to give full control to the sword to do as it wishes, rather than using the sword as tool for himself to fulfill his own desires.
JohnMcKee
JohnMcKee
I agree that it could appear pointless, but as you said, he has a strong wish to create a world for Amy, so both points could be in favor of both theories:
-He wants to create a new world for Amy, so he won't let himself get overwhelmed by the sword.
-He wants to create it SO BAD he sacrifices everything he got for the sword to be at its best.
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