Good moves you might not be using!

66A+B is under used for good reason - it's way too linear, even for an A-Pat attack. The only place I've found it pretty likely to hit is after NH 33B (thanks LP!) but then you're skipping damage you could have dealt, especially given that Alpha damage >>> Alpha guard break when you try for it. Not sure if it's worth anyone using more than the 2-3 times a match (as in 3 rounds) I see it.

2A BE is used a lot though? It's not used much from standing because 44B+K BE is a much better i14 meter spend in almost every way.

A+B's created space is nice, but I think most people just JG in that scenario. Seems more rewarding.
66A+B on hit can lead to a UK trap that is the UK you can do agB! and if they don't UK you can 2362BA for a good wake-up

The thing is about 44B+K BE is it's a high with weird horizontal properties, 44B+K is better if your opponent attacks and his move doesn't duck or he guards. 2A BE is good for anything else

The thing about JG punishing you can't JG punish moves with alpha like 2As. You use his A+B for this scenario.
 
Last edited:
66A+B strikes me as a worse option than 11B in nearly every scenario. Both are slow and linear, hit grounded, are safe on block, and do decent guard damage. Their main differences are as follows:
  1. 66A+B is even slower (i33 versus i28)
  2. 66A+B breaks guard in 7 blocks while 11B breaks in 10
  3. 11B gives far better damage on hit. Compare:
    Code:
    33A+B
    -> 2362BA  (64)
    -> JFT     (71, 79 with clean hit)
    -> CE      (85, M:50%)
    
    33A+B clean hit
    -> CE (95, M:50%)
    
    11B
    -> 1A: A: A              (76)
    -> 2A BE -> JFT          (89, M:25%)
    -> iagB -> JFT           (84)
    -> iagB -> 2A BE -> JFT  (112, M:25%)
  4. 11B is -8 on block while 66A+B is -6.
  5. 11B recovers a couple of frames faster than 66A+B.

For (1), this difference could be less noticable at neutral due to 66A+B having a simpler (and faster) input.
I don't see (2) making a difference in light of (3). If one views guard damage as an amortized source of constant damage (e.g. if a move breaks in 10 blocks and yields a 120 damage combo, then it can be viewed as dealing 12 damage each time it's blocked*), then 66A+B's additional guard damage doesn't come close to putting it in parity with 11B's additional damage on hit. It may be advisable to substitute 66A+B with 11B when trying to land the last hit needed to burst the opponent. However, people tend not to block when it would result in a guard burst.

Except in Alpha Patroklos mirror matches, (4) and (5) more or less cancel each other out.

* There are several flaws with viewing guard bursts in this way, however; it does not accurately account for the change in opponent behavior when his guard is near burst, nor does it take post-burst ringouts or wall combos into account.
 
66A+B strikes me as a worse option than 11B in nearly every scenario. Both are slow and linear, hit grounded, are safe on block, and do decent guard damage. Their main differences are as follows:
  1. 66A+B is even slower (i33 versus i28)
  2. 66A+B breaks guard in 7 blocks while 11B breaks in 10
  3. 11B gives far better damage on hit. Compare:
    Code:
    33A+B
    -> 2362BA  (64)
    -> JFT     (71, 79 with clean hit)
    -> CE      (85, M:50%)
    
    33A+B clean hit
    -> CE (95, M:50%)
    
    11B
    -> 1A: A: A              (76)
    -> 2A BE -> JFT          (89, M:25%)
    -> iagB -> JFT           (84)
    -> iagB -> 2A BE -> JFT  (112, M:25%)
  4. 11B is -8 on block while 66A+B is -6.
  5. 11B recovers a couple of frames faster than 66A+B.

For (1), this difference could be less noticable at neutral due to 66A+B having a simpler (and faster) input.
I don't see (2) making a difference in light of (3). If one views guard damage as an amortized source of constant damage (e.g. if a move breaks in 10 blocks and yields a 120 damage combo, then it can be viewed as dealing 12 damage each time it's blocked*), then 66A+B's additional guard damage doesn't come close to putting it in parity with 11B's additional damage on hit. It may be advisable to substitute 66A+B with 11B when trying to land the last hit needed to burst the opponent. However, people tend not to block when it would result in a guard burst.

Except in Alpha Patroklos mirror matches, (4) and (5) more or less cancel each other out.

* There are several flaws with viewing guard bursts in this way, however; it does not accurately account for the change in opponent behavior when his guard is near burst, nor does it take post-burst ringouts or wall comnobos into account.
I didn't know 11B does more guard damage. Well 66A+B still has that range advantage and had the potential to do more damage in the UK trap.
 
I didn't know 11B does more guard damage. Well 66A+B still has that range advantage and had the potential to do more damage in the UK trap.
11B does less guard damage. As for the range advantage, I recall them being pretty close in terms of reach.

For the tech traps to provide an advantage over 11B's damage, they'd have to have a mixup with 8A+BB or something, and off the top of my head I don't think 8A+BB is guaranteed against an opponent who doesn't tech after 66A+B.
 
11B does less guard damage. As for the range advantage, I recall them being pretty close in terms of reach.

For the tech traps to provide an advantage over 11B's damage, they'd have to have a mixup with 8A+BB or something, and off the top of my head I don't think 8A+BB is guaranteed against an opponent who doesn't tech after 66A+B.
The tech trap is 2362BA if they tech and agB if they don't. As for range I believe the range difference should be around half of Alpha's sword.
 
11B is much better than 66A+B, though it's still not something you should throw out a lot. Another thing to note about 11B combos is that 11B, 2A BE can be manipulated into giving you a FDHT knockdown, which is super strong for aPat (1B:B is a full techtrap and 8A+BB re-launches them if they don't tech).
 
11B is much better than 66A+B, though it's still not something you should throw out a lot. Another thing to note about 11B combos is that 11B, 2A BE can be manipulated into giving you a FDHT knockdown, which is super strong for aPat (1B:B is a full techtrap and 8A+BB re-launches them if they don't tech).

It may not be common knowledge but actually 1B:B is not a full tech trap (apart in very specific situations).
1B is. If you tech backward, only 1B will hit, the 2nd B will whiff giving your opponent a huge whiffpunish opportunity.

Of course, if he techs backward then 214~3A+B will connect for a bazillion damage haha.

4K is a full tech trap.
2B+K is a full tech trap although the timing is a bit weird against some characters.
 
Back