Pyrrha Movelist Discussion/Analysis

Status
Not open for further replies.
L

Lasercakes

[12] Conqueror
I am really jealous of the Ivy SA because they aren't talking about how cute Ivy's win poses are. They are actually talking about constructive things like her move set and how it works. Anyone playing Sophie now will know what they are doing with Pyrrha on day one when SCV launches, but there is still enough ambiguity to talk about.

I'll color code the updates so people can see the changes quickly.
October 11, 2011
October 17, 2011
November 16, 2011

December 6, 2011

I will start by listing her move set and commenting where I feel a need to. Feel free to correct me. I will try to maintain this list.
A - I would really like to know the frames on block for single A, but we probably won't know until release.
AA - Sophie, but with a small step forward on the 2nd A.
AK - Cass
6AK - What are we supposed to do with this?
3A - Sophie 3A. Is it safe? Does it give advantage on hit?
2A - 2A
1A - Does this hit grounded? New animation. TCs better than old Sophie 1A. Way faster than old 1A.
1AA - Sophie's with a new animation.
4(A) - I'm pretty sure I've seen this and that it's a lot faster than in IV, but I'd still think it's duckable on reaction.
4A Series - Seems like you might be able to delay the 2nd hit quite a bit. New animation for the 2nd hit.
4AB - Might be safe now?
WR A - Sophie
8A - Sophie

BB - Sophie. Damage nerfed.
BK - Sophie. Is this worth using?
B2 - It got an animation change. Does it do anything?
B2BBB - It's back. Video. New input 2B+Kbbb
6B - Sophie 6AB without the 6A part? Doesn't seem to do anything? And what's with SC4 Sophie 6B in this vid?

6BK - The attack described above followed with a new low kick.
3B - Standard sister launcher. Might be safe, or might have dumb recovery. Hits grounded "nicely." I suppose that means you can count on it not to randomly whiff.
1B - Probably Sophie 1B.
4B - This is now Sophie 22B. I've seen this hit on block a bit, but it still looks duckable on reaction to me.
WR B - Sophie
8B - Sophie's probably

K
KK - Does this exist? No
6K - Sophie 6K Sophie 44K
3K - Cass 3K knee
3KK - Cass 3K into Sophie 44K. Might be good combo filler like Cass 3AK off of walls. 2nd K might be delayable. Probably NCC.
2K - 2K
1K - Sophie, but looks more useful. Does not give advantage. Probably -2 on hit. Seems to track rolls better. More stun on grounded opponents. Seems like pretty good oki. How safe is this?
1(K) - Doesn't look like this exists.
4K - SCIII/IV Sophie 6K
WR K - Not too important, but does it still feel like -2 on block?
8K - Sophie's probably

A+B - Sophie's. Looks like it does the same stuff as in IV when hit with A, B, or K.
3A+B - Sophie's I think
WR A+B/ WR (A+B) - I heard it's a guard break now. I bet you'll be able to back step it on reaction if it has the range of Sophie WR A+B, but it might be good near a wall. Do you get anything free off of a full charge? Free 236B on block with guard break.
B+K - Still good? Might have worse TJ frames.
B+K B - Sophie's. Give's force block for 66B
8B+K - Standard sister/lizard quake thing
4B+K - does this exist? Different input
WR B+K - how about this?
BT B+K - What does this look like? Sophie's BT B+K looks like it still has good ring out potential.
A+K - Does this exist? No A+K moves at the moment?
8A+K - Why does this exist?

66A - Looks like exaggerated Cass 66A
22A - Sophie's
11AA - Looks like a guard break non TJ version of Sophie's 11AA. I don't think I've seen 11AA used, but 11A looks like it's safe and has a nice arch. Looks like it steps back bit first, maybe more than Soph 11A. Free 236B on block with guard break. I think I forgot to update this part.
44A - Sophie's, but is it worth using?
66B - Probably Pyrrha's most original attack. Looks like a cross between Cass 33B and Cass 22B+K, etc. Can BE afterwards. Is the BE steppable? How much disadvantage is there on block?
33B - Sophie's 33B.
22B - I think this is Sophie's 2B 8B A K without the 2B.
44B - Sophie's I think.
66K - Sophie's
22K - Stunning round house?
44K - Sophie's
66A+B - Does this input do something?
66B+K A B
44aB - Looks like this is back. Not sure if it's the same input, but it's much faster now. Still and unblockable. Still might be shameful to get hit by it though. Haven't seen the cancel either.
22_44_88B+K - Same as Sophie's

A+G - This probably does what A+G2 did in IV. Free 1K?
66A+G - This is the command throw right? Not sure I know the command throw from the B+G throw.
B+G - See above.
Clockwise throw - Awesome Sophie side throw
Counter clockwise throw - Poopy Sophie side throw
Back throw - Sophie's ROing back throw.

236 - Dina was unclear where it is exactly, but she does have STC properties some where apparently.
236B - Looks like free move list on whiff. TAS B like tip stun on counter hit. Shakeable? Utoh called it launcher punishable on block.
236B4 - Is this the one where she falls over on them and rolls off? Can be done from side hits.
236B:4 - How's the damage? Can be done from side hits. Different timing?
236AA - Can BE out of it. Might have disgusting potential as a whiff punisher. See later in my post.
236AA (BE) - Looks like the 2nd hit launches and the (BE) grants air control after it hits. Source
236K - Back flip. Seems like it has more knock back and better recovery than Cass 8K. It might have stupid evasive properties.
236236B - Same animation as 236B? Huh? Not sure what Dina's saying here.

BE - It's a guard break version of Sophie 66B. Is this stepable if 236AA or 66B is blocked?
CE - Stabs 3 times. Probably has huge risk in the face of just guard. Usable in combo after 3B, 66B, 66B+K A B, and 33B

Launcher follow up
Is 22B A K worth using after launchers? Is it better than 236B?


Punishers
What's the damage from 236B:4 to the damage potential of 236AA (BE) into a launcher follow up?
Back dash isn't good enough.

What attacks hit grounded?
66B, 3B, 1K?
She definitely has an oki game.

Step seems more on Cassandra's level, but it might just be the nature of step in the new game.

Throws between Cass and Sophie range.
Feels like SC2 Cassandra as Sophitia.
No Sophitia 4B.
 
Good stuff.

I'll make a note of some things I noticed a bit later. Not much to add, but I see some properties on moves that might turn out to be key tools in her moveset.

Also 3B seems to be safe or have a stupid recovery (see SC4 Ivy movelist)
 
Ok here are the things I noticed (this is all from watching videos so some of the info might be off):

236K:
- (maybe she'll have the same move for 8K?) is the same as Cassandra's but seems to recover faster and push back more. If it is anything like the SC4 version it should have TC and TJ frames early on.

3B:
- Seems to be similar to Cass/Soph/LM's 3B. Looks a lot like Sophie's 3B animation but seems to be safer on block and hits grounded consistently.
- Pushes back quite a bit.
- Combos into CE.

1A:
- Animation is brand new, looks like it will TC to some degree.
- 1AA still exists, 2nd hit seems exactly the same as Sophie's.
- 1AA(BE) = old JF now as a guard break(?).

11AA:
- New animation of Sophie's old 11AA, seems to TC and step back a bit before it hits.
- Follow up looks kinda similar to her 66A. Knocks down on CH, not sure about NH.
- 2nd hit is chargeable with a Guard Break effect. I recall someone saying it guaranteed an AA or BB but I can't remember where I heard that.

3K/3KK:
- First hit is Cass' 3K, follow up is Sophie 44K. I'm gonna go ahead and assume that this move will act as a "combo move" (think Cass 3AK after wallsplat :D) or a CH fisher (might suck because 3K doesn't do anything special on it's own) especially if the follow up K is delayable.

6B?:
- There's a move that looks identical to the 2nd hit of Sophie 6AB, so I think that this might actually be her 6B. Unfortunately there seems to be nothing special about this move ;/

44B+K:
- Same as Sophie's.

AK:
- Same as Cass'.
- Should be hit-confirmable still :)

4AAA string:
- Same as Sophie's but with new animation for the 2nd hit.
- Seems like you can delay the 2nd hit quite a bit, which was not possible in SC4.

4AB:
- Same as before, but might be safe now?

And while I'm at it...

- Movement looks more like Cassandra's but step speed in general has been increased so idk.
- Grab range seems to be in between Sophie and Cassie's.

- More to come -
 
Lasercakes said:
I am really jealous of the Ivy SA because they aren't talking about how cute Ivy's win poses are. They are actually talking about constructive things like her move set and how it works.
Click to expand...

I lolled for real.

3B - Standard sister launcher. How safe is this though? Do we have a strong fast safe mid?
Click to expand...

I think we've all had enough safe mid combo starters from Sophie for a lifetime.

66B - Probably Pyrrha's most original attack. Looks like a cross between Cass 33B and Cass 22B+K, etc. Can BE afterwards. Is the BE steppable? How much disadvantage is there on block?
Click to expand...

I theorize this got changed due to Sophie 66B spam online. Bet on it. This looks pretty linear.

Also, Soul Arena policy will change to strictly gameplay as we get closer to launch. I promise.

-Idle
 
haha you guys wish you had the science maining Pyrrha. Patroklos looks like a blast to play. Ah well

Couple things I noticed you missed in the OP:

She either doesn't have an A+G that leaves you standing or everyone's been using A+G2 (unlikely). People have been comboing into 1K from it.

She has Sophie's 6K.

1K does not give advantage, and is most likely -2 like in SCIV. But it does more damage now and seems to give more stun on grounded opponents now or it tracks rolls better... idk, it seems really effective as a oki now.

She has a high roundhouse kick that stuns. It's kinda like a fast Sophie A+K. This makes her step killing more threatening.

Her 236B stuns if hit on the tip and if it's a CH, and the sword doesn't go in and Pyrrha does not go into the usual extended recovery, much like TAS B in SCIV. Not sure if it's shakeable or not.

So Sophie/Pyrrha has no more stupidly good punishes on things that are usually safer due to pushback. No more ridiculous damage from launchers also due to TAS B. No more safe high damage mid, again, no TAS B. No more stupid retracking high damage safe mid (delayed/slow TAS B). Without TAS B her punishment isn't that special either (Sophie does 55-60 damage max until -26 without TAS B). Possibly no more 4B+K, a mid that's risk free on block due to pushback and safety against a good portion of the cast. Her godlike BB carries some risk now due to JG. Delayable BK and AK might be more useful now? Her CE can also be JG'd and probably punished hard since she can't stop.

Looks like Pyrrha will benefit from a defensive style of single Bs and 1K poking and whiff punishes.
 
She has everything I want except for the following missing: 4B, 66B, 11AA UB, and WS A+B UB.

Let's post on Daishi's Twitter to bring it back so we have another match of the year. :p
 
oh yeah I forgot to mention her STC is back. This time you have to G236 to get it out. It's effectiveness entirely depends on the hitboxes of everyone's moves, though
 
Hmm interesting. So 236236 would have the STC on the second 236 and G236236 would have the STC on the 1st 236. Now there's no reason to not always G236.
 
um, yes, I think.
Lasercakes said:
Hmm interesting. So 236236 would have the STC on the second 236 and G236236 would have the STC on the 1st 236.
Click to expand...
This is how it is in SCIV

In SCV 236236 never STCs from what I've seen. But the french have confirmed the G236 STC (actually it's FC 236, the G is only there so that 2G makes you crouch), and I've seen it in a video.

Does Pyrrha even have a 236236 that's unique from her 236? Her 236B and 236236B supposedly look the same.
 
Whoops. Not sure how I misphrased that so terribly. Yeah I was talking about 236236 in SCIV.

Dina says 236236B has the same animation as 236B. I'm not sure how to read into that exactly. And I don't know what he's trying to saying following that.
 
I've been going on the theory that Pyrrha is the Cassandra for this game.

Lighter, faster style with more grace while Patroklos is the Sophitia (harder hitting, more focused style).
 
SolidSonic said:
I've been going on the theory that Pyrrha is the Cassandra for this game.

Lighter, faster style with more grace while Patroklos is the Sophitia (harder hitting, more focused style).
Click to expand...

I've been going over the opposite, with Pyrrha being Sophitia (they virtually have the same moveset), and Patroklos being Cassandra (aggressive, all-out-limbs style).
 
Partisan said:
Not sure if this was listed but...

It looks like she has a new low!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=zPfPeyxz-jE#t=115s

Startup seems similar to 236K and her new 3B but goes into a low kick than stuns on NH!

Looks kinda slow :/
Click to expand...
It looks like the start of her new high roundhouse kick (22K?) gets cancelled into it. Not sure what that could be used for. It might make it safer against TC or crouchers trying to punish but it's still really slow. I guess maybe you could see that they're ducking or doing a slow TC and cancel into the low to stop them but idk how much time you have to cancel it.
 


From these videos it appears that:

- Sophie's old 6K has returned with a new animation. Hits grounded as far as I can tell and looks to be close to 0 on block.
- 6AK exists. Was this a move before?
- New low looks definitely looks like it comes out of 22K or whatever the Cass 236K-esque move is. It combos into 3B and probably 1K.
- 66B (BE) B(?) 22/88BAK looks to be the BNB combo.
- 33B combos into CE

More to come when I have time.

Edit: I don't know why, but the site insists on putting my spoilers in 3 times when I only have one in my post :/

Edit 2: This is NOT the latest build, apparently they had both versions running at the Paris event, and these two videos are from the TGS build.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back