WARUI_NE
Prettier than you
4K only tracks his weak side but its i14 and has a lot of ghost range so you can use it to be annoying since its like -4 on block and has good range
Raphael video thread!
- Thread starter ShenYuan
- Start date
BelovedChild
[09] Warrior
Me and Deathinmyeyes have recently played an offline session, mostly dealing with Raphael vs NM.
Overall good matches with some obvious issues we have to correct
Death..
1) Can't handle Prep effectively yet
2) Let's me get away with alot of attacking on disadvantage
I...
1) Cannot block readable lows on reaction for the life of me, I later started 6K whoring at certain points of disadvantage to compensate for this
2) Fall for some stupid NSS frame traps that should be seen a mile away. NSS K mostly
3) Got YOMI'd bad with throw breaking.
Overall though, you'll see alot of quick plays, Tech Traps, Pressure tactics, risks that pay off or fail, some down to basics fighting, and some good Raphael/NM strategy. Critique, comments, and praise to what I did right is very welcome and NEEDED, because we both have a tourney coming up in about 10 days with some hard competition.
I honestly don't know Any Raphael that plays like me, and this may not be a good education in offline play because I think Raphael in general can get away with shit vs NM more so then other characters due to his overall poor impact frames and lack of safety. So check out the vid's when they get posted, and please tell me everything I did wrong, right, and in between.
Prep game is strictly relevant to how the opponent handles it, you see a decent amount of prep here because he wasn't murdering it. Vs a Prep killer, I'd tone it down accordingly, which Death may soon become.
Video's will be posted Thursday or Friday.
Overall good matches with some obvious issues we have to correct
Death..
1) Can't handle Prep effectively yet
2) Let's me get away with alot of attacking on disadvantage
I...
1) Cannot block readable lows on reaction for the life of me, I later started 6K whoring at certain points of disadvantage to compensate for this
2) Fall for some stupid NSS frame traps that should be seen a mile away. NSS K mostly
3) Got YOMI'd bad with throw breaking.
Overall though, you'll see alot of quick plays, Tech Traps, Pressure tactics, risks that pay off or fail, some down to basics fighting, and some good Raphael/NM strategy. Critique, comments, and praise to what I did right is very welcome and NEEDED, because we both have a tourney coming up in about 10 days with some hard competition.
I honestly don't know Any Raphael that plays like me, and this may not be a good education in offline play because I think Raphael in general can get away with shit vs NM more so then other characters due to his overall poor impact frames and lack of safety. So check out the vid's when they get posted, and please tell me everything I did wrong, right, and in between.
Prep game is strictly relevant to how the opponent handles it, you see a decent amount of prep here because he wasn't murdering it. Vs a Prep killer, I'd tone it down accordingly, which Death may soon become.
Video's will be posted Thursday or Friday.
darkfender
[10] Knight
Well i think that raph is one of the few characters that when you learn you can use just in one way :/
I am following lot of video and maining him from the release.
At first i eveloped my style without any help, and changed often my playstyle but always towards that style common to 99% of raph players :|
His flaws are imho what force that kind of play.
The only thing that change a bit is the amount of risk you can put in your strategy, cause raph has strong moves that can be used on prediction to get some serious advantage or disadvantage if you feel to.
I am following lot of video and maining him from the release.
At first i eveloped my style without any help, and changed often my playstyle but always towards that style common to 99% of raph players :|
His flaws are imho what force that kind of play.
The only thing that change a bit is the amount of risk you can put in your strategy, cause raph has strong moves that can be used on prediction to get some serious advantage or disadvantage if you feel to.
- Admin
- #224
Xeph
#TRYHARD
Since you asked BelovedChild, I'll critique your overall performance as a player.
Pros;
On neutral ground, your offense was shining more than Death's. When both players stood, you were the one pressing attacks and showing, generally, more patience.
Sadly... that's all I saw that was good. :/
Cons;
Movement:
Okay, your movement overall was mediocre. You would step, but it seemed like you would with zero thought into it. For example, around 1:08 you backstepped at the beginning of the round, then for a little bit, proceeded to step to your left... towards the edge of the Ring. Death should've capatalized, and pushed for an RO, but he ended up saving your life for a little bit long by stepping himself towards the edge and pushing you into the center. You need to utilize step and backstep and control the space as best as possible.
Whiffing:
The constant whiffing was incredibly baffling. Death definitely wasn't capitalizing on it, but you whiffed so much throughout all the matches. Offline this shit is usually punished hard at high level play. You need to not whiff and have a better sense of judgment to what attacks will hit the person at what range. Take in notes if the person could possible step... sometimes, you may want to just fish for whiffs and whiff punish yourself. Work on that, you'll lose less life.
Attack patterns:
Your attacking was so predictable. Death showed that many times with stepping or GIing. You would get offense starting, or sometimes tried to, and he'd step you and punish.... sometimes, not punishing. Try less linear moves, or halting on the attack pressure. That also plays into getting into their heads.
Character Position;
As I said before, note where your character is in the ring. If you're fighting against Nightmare, you don't want to be fucking around near the edge or wall. This is basic knowledge, but burn this into your brain and like I said before, control the space.
Grab Breaking:
Death was ass fucking you with grabs. I know you know how to grapple break, just be more efficient... or hell, try ducking sometimes. Maybe throw a safe, not so linear, TC... if raph has one, not sure. Or try to stay away from his grab range as best as you can. Anything, but stop losing 50-60dmg off of grabs, every time.
Risk/Reward;
Okay, you're trying to do a lot of moves in situational occurrences. Stop... take a second, think about the risks you're taking, and maybe replace it with a step guard. or a back dash. But, you're eating a lot of damage for taking high risks with low reward. Or, compared to the risk, it's lower. Play smart, download better, and use the risk/reward situations less. Your life will not be so low so fast, and your character will thank you.
Mix Up:
I said before, but your attack patterns were predictable. That, and you'd do a lot of the same shit, that it wasn't hard to get a grip on how you play and completely download your style. Towards the end, Death showed "DOWNLOAD COMPLETE." Wonder why? Your lack of mixing up effects you in long sessions.
In my opinion, your most potent flaws are your whiffing, and your stepping. Put more thought into your attacks/if you should attack, and put more thought into your stepping, if you should step here, back step there, or just keep blocking.
You asked for my evaluation, I gave it to you. Keep it or leave it.
edit;
One more thing
Punishing;
Dude, you need to punish a lot more efficiently. Even if it's just a 6bb. Also, Death whiffed a good amount too, and majority of the time, you tried to whiff punish with 4b. which failed. Learn what to whiff punish with, or use 4b more efficiently.
Pros;
On neutral ground, your offense was shining more than Death's. When both players stood, you were the one pressing attacks and showing, generally, more patience.
Sadly... that's all I saw that was good. :/
Cons;
Movement:
Okay, your movement overall was mediocre. You would step, but it seemed like you would with zero thought into it. For example, around 1:08 you backstepped at the beginning of the round, then for a little bit, proceeded to step to your left... towards the edge of the Ring. Death should've capatalized, and pushed for an RO, but he ended up saving your life for a little bit long by stepping himself towards the edge and pushing you into the center. You need to utilize step and backstep and control the space as best as possible.
Whiffing:
The constant whiffing was incredibly baffling. Death definitely wasn't capitalizing on it, but you whiffed so much throughout all the matches. Offline this shit is usually punished hard at high level play. You need to not whiff and have a better sense of judgment to what attacks will hit the person at what range. Take in notes if the person could possible step... sometimes, you may want to just fish for whiffs and whiff punish yourself. Work on that, you'll lose less life.
Attack patterns:
Your attacking was so predictable. Death showed that many times with stepping or GIing. You would get offense starting, or sometimes tried to, and he'd step you and punish.... sometimes, not punishing. Try less linear moves, or halting on the attack pressure. That also plays into getting into their heads.
Character Position;
As I said before, note where your character is in the ring. If you're fighting against Nightmare, you don't want to be fucking around near the edge or wall. This is basic knowledge, but burn this into your brain and like I said before, control the space.
Grab Breaking:
Death was ass fucking you with grabs. I know you know how to grapple break, just be more efficient... or hell, try ducking sometimes. Maybe throw a safe, not so linear, TC... if raph has one, not sure. Or try to stay away from his grab range as best as you can. Anything, but stop losing 50-60dmg off of grabs, every time.
Risk/Reward;
Okay, you're trying to do a lot of moves in situational occurrences. Stop... take a second, think about the risks you're taking, and maybe replace it with a step guard. or a back dash. But, you're eating a lot of damage for taking high risks with low reward. Or, compared to the risk, it's lower. Play smart, download better, and use the risk/reward situations less. Your life will not be so low so fast, and your character will thank you.
Mix Up:
I said before, but your attack patterns were predictable. That, and you'd do a lot of the same shit, that it wasn't hard to get a grip on how you play and completely download your style. Towards the end, Death showed "DOWNLOAD COMPLETE." Wonder why? Your lack of mixing up effects you in long sessions.
In my opinion, your most potent flaws are your whiffing, and your stepping. Put more thought into your attacks/if you should attack, and put more thought into your stepping, if you should step here, back step there, or just keep blocking.
You asked for my evaluation, I gave it to you. Keep it or leave it.
edit;
One more thing
Punishing;
Dude, you need to punish a lot more efficiently. Even if it's just a 6bb. Also, Death whiffed a good amount too, and majority of the time, you tried to whiff punish with 4b. which failed. Learn what to whiff punish with, or use 4b more efficiently.
darkfender
[10] Knight
i'll look better tomorrow for now i can tell u 3 things:
2B punish lot of nighty things
2K is a guaranteed mixup break against him in many cases (note that raph leg is looong)
prep A is risky ._.
2B punish lot of nighty things
2K is a guaranteed mixup break against him in many cases (note that raph leg is looong)
prep A is risky ._.
SBA
TFNA
there's no sound...was there suposed to be sound? and is that you at the end of the video? ive been wonderin wat u look like for sometime....
Ok I suck at critiques, but man you know you got away with A LOT. I mean between the prep shenanigans, the whiffing (oh the whiffing T_T) and the lack of step killers, you got away with too much. lol but you did well for your first decent offline game, you used lows well and ur basic pokin was there...but ther was times wen i was like "please for the love of god 2a that GS" lol. I'm also glad you stopped using 1bb...you got punished for it everytime. It did seem like u were stepping just for the hell of it, and that u didnt care about positioning at all...
also i cried a little everytime 1a got stepped....
overall it was decent, u just need to work on ur whiff punishing, reaction, and overall movement and conscisnous(sp?) there of.
and oh yea prep a is risky ^_^
Ok I suck at critiques, but man you know you got away with A LOT. I mean between the prep shenanigans, the whiffing (oh the whiffing T_T) and the lack of step killers, you got away with too much. lol but you did well for your first decent offline game, you used lows well and ur basic pokin was there...but ther was times wen i was like "please for the love of god 2a that GS" lol. I'm also glad you stopped using 1bb...you got punished for it everytime. It did seem like u were stepping just for the hell of it, and that u didnt care about positioning at all...
also i cried a little everytime 1a got stepped....
overall it was decent, u just need to work on ur whiff punishing, reaction, and overall movement and conscisnous(sp?) there of.
and oh yea prep a is risky ^_^
DeathInMyEyes
DIME
SuPhy, the guy at the end of the vid is me.
Yeah, I let a lot of things, like Prep A, go unpunished. I'm going to brush up on Raph's frames and make sure it doesn't happen again.
Yeah, I let a lot of things, like Prep A, go unpunished. I'm going to brush up on Raph's frames and make sure it doesn't happen again.
DeathInMyEyes
DIME
SuPhy, the guy at the end of the vid is me.
Yeah, I let a lot of things, like Prep A, go unpunished. I'm going to brush up on Raph's frames and make sure it doesn't happen again.
Yeah, I let a lot of things, like Prep A, go unpunished. I'm going to brush up on Raph's frames and make sure it doesn't happen again.
SBA
TFNA
ok word
yeaa raph frames is either really good, or really bad...its easy to remember wen hes at disdvantage
darkfender
[10] Knight
i dunno commands but FCB uis the best punsher on force crouch against one of his mixup maybe the only at all due to range, instead against the other that impact i usually go for 1A....
Maybe there is something better.
You can also risk 4 a lot against nightmare if you know his stances.
another thing....
236B imho >>>66B
expecially at huge frame advantage.
11B is better than 2A+B after a stun
And you should try:
6A or A
ON BLOCK
followed by one between:
2K, 3K, 6B, 4K etc etc etc that would be -2 +13,14 for an i15-16 after the block that can be mixupped to grant the abuse of AB :)
Maybe there is something better.
You can also risk 4 a lot against nightmare if you know his stances.
another thing....
236B imho >>>66B
expecially at huge frame advantage.
11B is better than 2A+B after a stun
And you should try:
6A or A
ON BLOCK
followed by one between:
2K, 3K, 6B, 4K etc etc etc that would be -2 +13,14 for an i15-16 after the block that can be mixupped to grant the abuse of AB :)
DeathInMyEyes
DIME
Actually....not all of the vids are up. I still have Tira vs Raph, Nighty vs Voldo, and Raph vs Zasalamel. I just slacked off today and only uploaded Raph vs Cervy.
SupHy, you should know that I'm 5495273x sexier than BC. No homo intended.
SupHy, you should know that I'm 5495273x sexier than BC. No homo intended.
darkfender
[10] Knight
6)......... stepG to bait whiff when you expect a vertical...is a safe whiff bait if you have low disadvantage....its the reason many skille dplayers use i12 aa characters .-.
But night does not have an i12 hori afaik
But night does not have an i12 hori afaik
- Moderator
- #233
InsaneKhent
[12] Conqueror
Mandritti
[09] Warrior
Do... do I have to reply to this?
...
I'm just ... so confused right now.
Last time I said anything where InsaneKhent reads would be... a post in Seong Mi-na vid thread a billion years ago?
... I'm really just confused. :\ Would be less confused if people I even talk to make this post, but... huh?
*~*~*~
I'm going to try taking a different approach than my instincts here, but... did someone put you up to this? Is there a group really so determined?
I wasn't going to say anything at all about BC's vids. I'm using them myself, and can't see anything deeper than what was already said.
Just... SO confused...
Tiamat
[11] Champion
I think you just have to change the way you are thinking about it. You need to stop focusing too much on frame advantage and focus more on mental advantage. Doing a slow attack or sidestepping when you're at advantage might seem like a waste, but if you predict they will block after their attack it gives you a huge timeframe to get in a better position, do soul gauge damage, or hit them somehow or other. Stepping at advantage is rather odd but it moves you closer to them and may allow for side grabs among other things. I could be wrong but I don't think you did much single A or B into stuff and that's another example of focusing too much on the frames instead of the mental advantage. If you're pretty sure they will keep blocking after A or B to guard the second hit (for A the string would be AB not AA of course) you can be really annoying just spamming single pokes until you predict they will try to attack and then use a double hit string.
- Moderator
- #236
WuHT
Premium Moderator
thats like doc karnage or w/e his name is. Tailspin had a really good opening theme.
KingAce
HERMITISM
BC it's no wonder you're having a lot of difficulty with Raphael.
Raph isn't an aggressive character by any means. You were more aggressive than DIME. Attacking in situations where it's very easy to get stepped and punished.
Rule number one with Raphael...never over commit.
Raphael is reactionary character, because his aggressive options suck and will get you killed.
You have to punish everything, if you're not punishing with 6B or 3B. Everything else you know isn't worth much at all, because that is free damage you're letting slip.
You need great defense. You need a good GI game with any low tier character, but with raph it also plays apart in damaging SG.
Like Xeph said the way you step isn't effective. You step backwards a lot and only when there's nothing to be gained...convenient stepping. If you're to backstep, do it for the purpose of whiff punishing, his sidestepping is actually decent. Side step after your safe moves are blocked like 8K.
Always keep your opponent in check.
When you know someone is going to sidestep 4A isn't a bad idea, because it's fast. 66A from a distance, 236B to catch backsteppers. 2A and throws...throw a lot with raph. A+B is also solid. 7A+B
Keep your opponent's SG in check, sometimes it's rational just to make your opponent block something. If they're blocking they aren't moving or plotting. When you knock someone down doing 11B just to check them is a good idea.
Interrupt anything...BB 6B AB are your friend.
I suggest you practice your punishing, just because you know frame data, doesn't mean you will react appropriately when the situations calls for it
1A sucks in fact all of raph's lows suck, only use them when you know they will hit. Usually at a distance...otherwise 2K is your friend. 1B never 1BB.
66K might as well use it.
789K use it, on block you have freedom to step. On hit you can throw or whatever.
If none of your WR option can punish something that leaves you in a crouched state after blocking, 6BB all the way.
3A.
I almost never go into Raph's stances. If you want to play aggressive raph I am the wrong guy to get advice from.
Raph isn't an aggressive character by any means. You were more aggressive than DIME. Attacking in situations where it's very easy to get stepped and punished.
Rule number one with Raphael...never over commit.
Raphael is reactionary character, because his aggressive options suck and will get you killed.
You have to punish everything, if you're not punishing with 6B or 3B. Everything else you know isn't worth much at all, because that is free damage you're letting slip.
You need great defense. You need a good GI game with any low tier character, but with raph it also plays apart in damaging SG.
Like Xeph said the way you step isn't effective. You step backwards a lot and only when there's nothing to be gained...convenient stepping. If you're to backstep, do it for the purpose of whiff punishing, his sidestepping is actually decent. Side step after your safe moves are blocked like 8K.
Always keep your opponent in check.
When you know someone is going to sidestep 4A isn't a bad idea, because it's fast. 66A from a distance, 236B to catch backsteppers. 2A and throws...throw a lot with raph. A+B is also solid. 7A+B
Keep your opponent's SG in check, sometimes it's rational just to make your opponent block something. If they're blocking they aren't moving or plotting. When you knock someone down doing 11B just to check them is a good idea.
Interrupt anything...BB 6B AB are your friend.
I suggest you practice your punishing, just because you know frame data, doesn't mean you will react appropriately when the situations calls for it
1A sucks in fact all of raph's lows suck, only use them when you know they will hit. Usually at a distance...otherwise 2K is your friend. 1B never 1BB.
66K might as well use it.
789K use it, on block you have freedom to step. On hit you can throw or whatever.
If none of your WR option can punish something that leaves you in a crouched state after blocking, 6BB all the way.
3A.
I almost never go into Raph's stances. If you want to play aggressive raph I am the wrong guy to get advice from.
- Moderator
- #238
WuHT
Premium Moderator
BC i'll try to keep this a general raph-specific critique (without going into much anti-NM)
From the first few rounds i'd have to say you may even take a few more risks on block (ie if you see yourself standing guard and just "waiting" for NM to retaliate, you could opt for some evasive manuevers to try to get more damage off (or at least get to a better ring position).
In case im' being hard to follow, what i'm saying is it seems like you kill all of your momentum when you sense one of your attacks are blocked and you just hold guard "waiting" for NM to do something (except when you do the intentional blocked single B into step). Guarding is a smart thing if NM is really following frames tightly and trying to stuff you, but he's noticeably taking his time in attacking you (ie when he steps a bit or does slow 66A or 66B) you should take advantage of that.
You did do some 8A+B, but i'm a big advocate of movement. Yes it's sounding like me to tell you to take more risks, but it's more of "don't let NM walk up all over you and let him dictate the pace of the match". The other guys have covered some of the stuff i've picked up.
Anyways you need to work on your CAS big time.
From the first few rounds i'd have to say you may even take a few more risks on block (ie if you see yourself standing guard and just "waiting" for NM to retaliate, you could opt for some evasive manuevers to try to get more damage off (or at least get to a better ring position).
In case im' being hard to follow, what i'm saying is it seems like you kill all of your momentum when you sense one of your attacks are blocked and you just hold guard "waiting" for NM to do something (except when you do the intentional blocked single B into step). Guarding is a smart thing if NM is really following frames tightly and trying to stuff you, but he's noticeably taking his time in attacking you (ie when he steps a bit or does slow 66A or 66B) you should take advantage of that.
You did do some 8A+B, but i'm a big advocate of movement. Yes it's sounding like me to tell you to take more risks, but it's more of "don't let NM walk up all over you and let him dictate the pace of the match". The other guys have covered some of the stuff i've picked up.
Anyways you need to work on your CAS big time.
KingAce
HERMITISM
If you think about, you can punish just about anything NM does. AGA is your biggest worry. Most important thing is to master punishing.
And 66K is a good move, you don't have many to choose from.
And 66K is a good move, you don't have many to choose from.
KingAce
HERMITISM
You might want to consider aiming. Basically when your press G it aligns you with your opponent, making your moves have a better chance of hitting. For thing's like 236B, from a distance.
66K has pushback, knocks down on CH, sure it doesn't track, but it's faster than 66A,4B, 22K at i20 only the AI and leet mofas will be ducking that on reaction...and it's only -9 on block. Keep it in the back of your head somewhere.
66K has pushback, knocks down on CH, sure it doesn't track, but it's faster than 66A,4B, 22K at i20 only the AI and leet mofas will be ducking that on reaction...and it's only -9 on block. Keep it in the back of your head somewhere.