Yoshi SCIV -> SCV Changes

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iMFC game has always essentially been fishing for counter hits. That's risk. 3B used to be one of the most risky launchers in the game. 3AB was no better, in fact I much prefer the new 3AB which gives you a hit confirmable launcher. Using a timer for Tekken moves was major risk, if you chose that route...etc Otherwise most of his weapons are still all there outside of a few stances and 6K2K which wasn't that good to begin with.

6K is buffed. 4KB is buffed. 3B is far less punishable. SDF B tracks if you hold 4 or 6 as they step to realign and is way quicker. This follows by a guaranteed 9B+K(K) DGF oki. And if you're BT in DGF try A. DGF A has almost as long of reach as it does from front, BT. A+K is more reliable than it once was. His wall game is as good if not better than before (normalizing meter changes between the two games). The things he lost he didn't really lose so much as they're utilized differently. iMCF is far stricter to get juggles off of it, but it works just fine still. And I don't know if you can complain about it being 1 frame slower when it's a lot easier to execute. I haven't tested much of the tech crouching with it but either way you'll be fishing for counter hits with it the same way as always. The one thing he did get nerfed hard was earslicer which is almost unnecessary now with its execution problems. His BEs aren't that good for sure, but his super is actually one of the better ones. Also, MED didn't get that big of a buff when you take into account you can backstep literally anything from it.

He's at least B tier right now, but do see him dropping when people learn to more accurately guess his mixups.

As others have said, none of that is really new. iMCF was never a risk. Yes, you fished for CH, but off of a setup or when you knew iMCF would beat out anything the opponent could do. Against certain characters with good TJ attacks, it could be baited out, but that's no different from any other attack in the game.

Also, I don't know how you played, but I never did 3B or 3AB unless I knew it would connect. The new 3A is unsafe, whereas the old one was not. The new 3AB is also unsafe. Fish for CHs all you want, but it's not hard to punish in SC5. And the Tekken moves were never a risk to me. It was rare to miss the attack I wanted.

iMCF being one frame slower and tech crouching later (presumably) is a big nerf. In addition, many of his iMCF frame traps are gone. It's not a bad move, but it's lost a lot of its usefulness compared to SC4 iMCF. I also don't find it any easier to execute, but I didn't really have issues with it in SC4 so...

To me, the MED buff is bigger than any other "buff" you mentioned, aside from maybe 6K. You even agree that Yoshi is B tier at best and will probably fall. How does that not indicate a bad nerf?
 
As others have said, none of that is really new. iMCF was never a risk. Yes, you fished for CH, but off of a setup or when you knew iMCF would beat out anything the opponent could do. Against certain characters with good TJ attacks, it could be baited out, but that's no different from any other attack in the game.

Also, I don't know how you played, but I never did 3B or 3AB unless I knew it would connect. The new 3A is unsafe, whereas the old one was not. The new 3AB is also unsafe. Fish for CHs all you want, but it's not hard to punish in SC5. And the Tekken moves were never a risk to me. It was rare to miss the attack I wanted.

iMCF being one frame slower and tech crouching later (presumably) is a big nerf. In addition, many of his iMCF frame traps are gone. It's not a bad move, but it's lost a lot of its usefulness compared to SC4 iMCF. I also don't find it any easier to execute, but I didn't really have issues with it in SC4 so...

To me, the MED buff is bigger than any other "buff" you mentioned, aside from maybe 6K. You even agree that Yoshi is B tier at best and will probably fall. How does that not indicate a bad nerf?

I'm saying while he may not be as good as his SCIV self he is still nowhere near as bad as you and others are making him out to be. Especially since this is barely a week into the game's life cycle. Yoshi players didn't figure out 8K was a viable wall combo starter until well into SCIV's life span. Give it time. Right now most Yosh players are stuck in bad habits from older games. Especially iMCF setups.
 
I'm saying while he may not be as good as his SCIV self he is still nowhere near as bad as you and others are making him out to be. Especially since this is barely a week into the game's life cycle. Yoshi players didn't figure out 8K was a viable wall combo starter until well into SCIV's life span. Give it time. Right now most Yosh players are stuck in bad habits from older games. Especially iMCF setups.

I was doing 9K wall combos within the first month of the game (don't remember exact dates). It was a safe mid that wall splatted. Now 9K isn't even safe anymore... >_>

Also, Yoshi isn't bad, he just isn't all that good at the moment. I definitely don't think he's bottom tier or anything, and you even said yourself that you expect him to fall below B tier. A C tier Yoshi isn't very good in my eyes, but I think he's about B tier and will likely stay there unless we find some magical juice.
 
It executes in 8 frames.

Like MarkMan, I'm having problems opening people up... and I seem to get stuffed regularly when I use iMCF. I know my opponents aren't at advantage, so I have no idea why I'm getting stuffed.

It seems like you have to take far more risks with Yoshi, and the reward is a little less than it used to be. Right now, things are working out, but I'm afraid of what will happen when people know how to properly punish things.

I was trying to work MED into my game more, but unless the opponent is grounded MED B and MED K are easily stepped. MED A is unsafe on block and doesn't give Yoshi much on hit, so the risk again outweighs the reward.

I will keep at it with Yoshi to see if I can find any juice, but I'm definitely getting frustrated with him. He's just... not fun.

I'm using Astaroth as a secondary character now :x
 
Asta has quickly become Yoshi's big brother haha!! Really though I hope they update it the way they did with 4 fairly soon and maybe we'll get some justice.
 
lots of whining!
i´ll make yoshi broken in this game. just you wait :)
I wouldn't call it straight up whining. But it seems like changes for the sake of changes with no real balancing purpose behind them. I'd like to think of it as justified complaining!!
 
Asta has quickly become Yoshi's big brother haha!! Really though I hope they update it the way they did with 4 fairly soon and maybe we'll get some justice.

They need to patch in actually useable BEs aside from 3AB(BE). That reminds me, that brave edge is actually pretty useful if you hit confirm with it on CH. I've heard a lot of people saying all of his BEs are trash but I think that one is pretty good actually.
 
Okay. I'm glad everyone is/has gotten it out of their system. But, I feel this thread has mostly run its course. It's boiled down to calls for changes, patches, etc. While this is great and all, there are other forums made for these kinds of posts.

If you have anything else to say on this matter, please do so in the next 24 hours from this post. In which time I will lock this post and we'll focus SOLELY on SCV Yoshi.

If you'd like to continue your comments about this subject, please do so in the proper forum.
 
They need to patch in actually useable BEs aside from 3AB(BE). That reminds me, that brave edge is actually pretty useful if you hit confirm with it on CH. I've heard a lot of people saying all of his BEs are trash but I think that one is pretty good actually.

I've been trying to condition opponents to expect only 3A, so that I can hit them with 3AB later in the match. Unfortunately, 3A and 3AB are punishable, so eventually it may not be worth the risk.
 
Okay. Thanks for your understanding, Yoshi fans. Let's focus on SCV now. For better or worse, this is the character we have to work with. Thread closed.
 
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