4 K+B

SwordGluttony

[08] Mercenary
Why is this even in the game? Why is this in any game?
I'm still on the fence about even making a thread about this,

I feel it'd be as pointless as the move is.

This thing cannot do anything, and it catches no one.

I wasn't sure about putting this thing in strategies, because there is no damn strategy with this thing, there -never- was, why does it even exist? Shit, even 214A has a use for Yoshimitsu in the air, or Astaroth's whiffing unblockables from far away, or just idiots, but even idiots can see this goddamn thing.

I'm going to blame this thread to one of my sleep deprived bad ideas, so if I see this thing deleted in the morning, good riddance, I hope 4 K+B goes along with it too
 

K0rN_b4LL

[14] Master
Only thing I see it used for is to force a sidestep and then cancel it into a horizontal, but this is only useful if you cancel it in time so you throw the attack out before they come out of the sidestep and block.
 

optymuss

[12] Conqueror
unblockables are useful for lot of things....especially if they have cancels because then you can mess with your oppoennt i nthe following ways:

1. what Korn had stated....
  • force them to sidestep in order to change their positioning...like when your back is to the edge or your facing a character with a strong reverse RO game or with a strong side turning throw game when the opponent's back is to the edge.
  • forcing your opponent into classic mind games
2. forcing a laid back or cautious opponent to lock up and be on their guard because a smart oppoennt will expect you to use mind games with the cancel

3. (This reason mostly has to do with 214A because of its long cancel window) Luring your opponent by doing the unblockable and canceling last minute (frame) because they will expect to get a juicy whiff punish.....it is funny when idiots fall for this when they have a health advantage too. in hgh level play i wouldnt use it for this.....

4. extra yummy pressure on your opponent.....
 

Sora

[11] Champion
unblockables are useful for lot of things....especially if they have cancels because then you can mess with your oppoennt i nthe following ways:

1. what Korn had stated....
  • force them to sidestep in order to change their positioning...like when your back is to the edge or your facing a character with a strong reverse RO game or with a strong side turning throw game when the opponent's back is to the edge.
  • forcing your opponent into classic mind games
2. forcing a laid back or cautious opponent to lock up and be on their guard because a smart oppoennt will expect you to use mind games with the cancel


3. (This reason mostly has to do with 214A because of its long cancel window) Luring your opponent by doing the unblockable and canceling last minute (frame) because they will expect to get a juicy whiff punish.....it is funny when idiots fall for this when they have a health advantage too. in hgh level play i wouldnt use it for this.....

4. extra yummy pressure on your opponent.....

I agree with everything that was said except for the notion of 'don't use in high level play'. Keev is NOTORIOUS for using NM's unblockables to force someone to step, only to go for a crouch crab after. It's very effective especially in a high blockstring pressure situation. If you need someone to step, 4B+K is surprisingly effective.
 

optymuss

[12] Conqueror
I agree with everything that was said except for the notion of 'don't use in high level play'. Keev is NOTORIOUS for using NM's unblockables to force someone to step, only to go for a crouch crab after. It's very effective especially in a high blockstring pressure situation. If you need someone to step, 4B+K is surprisingly effective.

NO...i meant the baiting part.....because that never works..instead it backfires....

REASON 3, thats why it is in reason 3

here, i dont think i am being understandable:

If i use an unblockable at a distance to lure my opponent and i have a health diasdvantage.....with ANY character....will my opponent close in to whiff punish or will they just let me waste more time by using the unblockable and canceling?
 

KineticClash

[10] Knight
4B+K is NOT the kind of UB you should use to mess with someone's head. At least, I don't see how it could be because...

-For one, if you cancel it immediately, Ivy falls back a bit and rather slowly enters FC position, leaving you with little or no options for pressure.
-If you wait to cancel until a point where the opponent might think about stepping, the cancel will take so long that you will not be able to kill their step with anything.
-If you actually wait for the 30 seconds it takes for the UB to come out, you will already be eating a preemptive whiff punish.

But idk, maybe the fact that it has a tiny backstep when canceled will come in handy? Especially if it takes less than 20 frames to cancel it. Maybe buffering CS and pulling it out after an immediate 4B+K cancel will look tricky. Honestly, I haven't tested this move much since it shows so little potential at the moment.


You should really be asking why 11A is in this game. I mean, what kind of a sick joke is that move anyway?
 

Sora

[11] Champion
4B+K is NOT the kind of UB you should use to mess with someone's head. At least, I don't see how it could be because...

-For one, if you cancel it immediately, Ivy falls back a bit and rather slowly enters FC position, leaving you with little or no options for pressure.
-If you wait to cancel until a point where the opponent might think about stepping, the cancel will take so long that you will not be able to kill their step with anything.
-If you actually wait for the 30 seconds it takes for the UB to come out, you will already be eating a preemptive whiff punish.

But idk, maybe the fact that it has a tiny backstep when canceled will come in handy? Especially if it takes less than 20 frames to cancel it. Maybe buffering CS and pulling it out after an immediate 4B+K cancel will look tricky. Honestly, I haven't tested this move much since it shows so little potential at the moment.


You should really be asking why 11A is in this game. I mean, what kind of a sick joke is that move anyway?

I wouldn't depend so much on the backstep as the TC frames. Maybe it's just me (or I have been playing stupid people) that 4B+KG ~ WR A works.

Idk, I agree its a crap move on paper.
 

smartypants9567

[09] Warrior
Well, its about time. I hope it doesn't get deleted too. I think 85% of the Ivy forum agree with Ivy is pretty good in SCV? Correct if im wrong. Im sorry to say this but, this game is horrible in my opinion. Why am I playing it? Well, SC is the only game I play, and I think I might just quit. Alot of people are quitting SC because of everything about the game. I know, I know, I know we have to "adapt" to the game. Well, we had to adapt to SC3 going to SC4 correct?, and now we have to adapt to SC4 going into SC5? Not everyone likes to change. And besides for those of you who think you can quit now than come back, well I "think" I have news. I was surfing the internet, and rumor has it that Namco Bandai America is over SCV. Plus, I also heard SCV sold bad, and there might not be another SC, due the status at the moment.
And if you're thinking SCV is just starting and theres more to come and stuff like that. The game that you're playing now, will probably be the game you'll be playing for the next 4 years possibly. "Well smarty, thats not true. Namco could do another patch, and that could fix the game completely." That could happen 35% in my opinion. Another patch would cost Namco alot money, and why spend money on a game that isn't selling good?
 

Sora

[11] Champion
Well, its about time. I hope it doesn't get deleted too. I think 85% of the Ivy forum agree with Ivy is pretty good in SCV? Correct if im wrong. Im sorry to say this but, this game is horrible in my opinion. Why am I playing it? Well, SC is the only game I play, and I think I might just quit. Alot of people are quitting SC because of everything about the game. I know, I know, I know we have to "adapt" to the game. Well, we had to adapt to SC3 going to SC4 correct?, and now we have to adapt to SC4 going into SC5? Not everyone likes to change. And besides for those of you who think you can quit now than come back, well I "think" I have news. I was surfing the internet, and rumor has it that Namco Bandai America is over SCV. Plus, I also heard SCV sold bad, and there might not be another SC, due the status at the moment.
And if you're thinking SCV is just starting and theres more to come and stuff like that. The game that you're playing now, will probably be the game you'll be playing for the next 4 years possibly. "Well smarty, thats not true. Namco could do another patch, and that could fix the game completely." That could happen 35% in my opinion. Another patch would cost Namco alot money, and why spend money on a game that isn't selling good?

Everyone thought SC4 was the last game (heck, it was designed to be the last game) but SC5 came in. I'm not saying that its a guarantee for SC6, but I'm not not saying that either.

And people not liking change is completely fine. There's some people that just can't adapt, and really shouldn't have to force themselves to do so. If you don't like the game, you don't like the game. It's more the ones that want to drag people along with them is the problem.
 

smartypants9567

[09] Warrior
Everyone thought SC4 was the last game (heck, it was designed to be the last game) but SC5 came in. I'm not saying that its a guarantee for SC6, but I'm not not saying that either.

And people not liking change is completely fine. There's some people that just can't adapt, and really shouldn't have to force themselves to do so. If you don't like the game, you don't like the game. It's more the ones that want to drag people along with them is the problem.

So do you like SCV compared to SCIV? I know SCIV had horrible online but look at the stepping/ step g. In SCV you get a free CE if you step g, and thats a habit for me to be honest. Besides, even the greatest players hate SCV, but liked SCIV. But we all hope for a SCVI. I really really like the graphics in the game because they seem real, and Ivy CE is sexy. :P
 

Sora

[11] Champion
So do you like SCV compared to SCIV? I know SCIV had horrible online but look at the stepping/ step g. In SCV you get a free CE if you step g, and thats a habit for me to be honest. Besides, even the greatest players hate SCV, but liked SCIV. But we all hope for a SCVI. I really really like the graphics in the game because they seem real, and Ivy CE is sexy. :P

I'm with mikosu in that I think the nerfing of step-G is a positive thing. The implementation could've used more work, but its essence is that I should be able to punish your movement. It becomes more of a reading game that way (although right now, attacking more is actually a good thing without having to do too much reading -- again, implementation could've been better).

SC4 was a fun game for me as well -- for different reasons than SC5. Competitively, I think SC5 is the better game.
 

WhYYZ

[10] Knight
I completely got fooled by 4B+K yesterday, so no it's not useless. Cancel to CS or WR A tends to work against me.

Purely gameplay wise I like SCV a LOT more then SCIV. Too bad SCV has really bad Offline because that's the biggest reason why it didn't sell that good.
 

SwordGluttony

[08] Mercenary
I'm honestly dumbfounded this thread when somewhere as much as it did in just a short amount of time.

It's just, Ivy's had a lot of unblockables in her Soul life, some which have made the cut, and others that haven't.
I just spent 10 minutes looking for the name of that vertical WP unblockable, swore it was called Rolling Thunder or something, 6 A+B in SCIV, I miss that one.

Anyway, point being, she's had a lot clipped out and put in, but this move has been in every Calibur, or so I recall.
My memories of SC1 are really faint. And for it's use, or general lack thereof for the most part, I'm surprised it's stayed.
I heard a rumor this game was made by part of the Tekken crew, I'm going to pretend I misunderstood someone.

But idk, maybe the fact that it has a tiny backstep when canceled will come in handy? Especially if it takes less than 20 frames to cancel it. Maybe buffering CS and pulling it out after an immediate 4B+K cancel will look tricky. Honestly, I haven't tested this move much since it shows so little potential at the moment.


You should really be asking why 11A is in this game. I mean, what kind of a sick joke is that move anyway?

Seriously, 11A is just odd, what's funny is that in SCIV, back when I sucked starting out, all I did was spam ..(dammit, can't remember) 33 B into SE and finished with that move over and over. Only way you'd be catching someone with 11A is in their sleep.

And yeah, I was hoping I could cancel a crapload of 4 K+B's into a way to backstep glitch, like Mai Shiranui or some shit in KOF2k2. I've seen a match video of Link cancelling 4 K+B into CS, but of course, he's Kenshiro, so he can do that. I think it was against Kayane, can't remember.
 

S0ULA55A51N

[09] Warrior
There are also those, who immediately try to interrupt you, while doing an UB. I've already succesfully baited some interrupts with the 4b+kG; they whiffed and I got a CS/6B/6A whiff punisher or screwed up lol.