Unlisted Guard Cancels

Windstar

Windstar

[13] Hero
Leixia's got a few moves that aren't listed as guard cancel-able. For example 2A+B, 3B+KK, and 11AA. Some of these might prove useful.
 
I think the second A in 11AA can be cancelled on its own with a different input from crouch. Not entirely sure..

But yeee, more WS mixup galore!
 
Can someone compile a list of these? I thought I was going crazy when I saw these but I wasn't able to replicate them.
 
Yeah , it is very real and good if your opponent blocks 3B+K and you can also set up a wide range mix ups considering on how pro your opponents reaction is.
 
yeah the 3B+KK cancel is pretty good, 2A+B cancel seems fairly useless as it puts you in backturned crouching, is there any mid/low throw that can punish people that duck?

My favorite tho is 11AA cancel, the 3B is fast afterwards, not sure how safe it is to abuse or if they can interrupt the second A even if you dont cancel, but it was working pretty well tonight.

-orvn
 
onlyrunverynoob said:
yeah the 3B+KK cancel is pretty good, 2A+B cancel seems fairly useless as it puts you in backturned crouching, is there any mid/low throw that can punish people that duck?

My favorite tho is 11AA cancel, the 3B is fast afterwards, not sure how safe it is to abuse or if they can interrupt the second A even if you dont cancel, but it was working pretty well tonight.

-orvn
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But you can B+K from back turn which is a stun. And if it hits you can combo bATK BE from it.
 
3B+K,kG is a nonstarter for me. If they block the first hit, the second is interruptible for major damage, even if you don't cancel it. If the first hit connects, there's only a few circumstances where you would want to close the distance but not try to hit with the second K. Even if you do close the distance on an opponent who has put themselves in a position to evade the second K, are you going to be at an advantage against them when the kG finishes? I think it equally likely that you are at neutral very close to them. In that case, I would rather close with a different attack where I can choose my range based on the situation.

Just like 3B+K,K, if the first one is blocked, the second hit of 11_77A,A is interruptible for major damage, even if you don't cancel it.
 
3B+K, kG is used to mixup when juggling. Uncancelled version hits "meaty", I think. So if they tech to avoid it, you cancel and grab or whatever.

...I think. I gotta go test this later.
 
3B+K K has some odd properties. It does more damage to grounded opponents than ones recovering or simply eating the attack, plus it also has a clean hit property so its always good to use once and a while. The guard cancel option recovers crouching and sets up some options in case your opponent techs after 3B+K, making it so the K whiffs (and you don't want to whiff). This makes it so that the K ends up being an option to trick your opponents into, and the guard cancel as a way to continue your offense without losing your advantage from a whiff or what have you.

The 11AA guard cancel isn't particularly amazing, but I am finding the FC A+B guard cancel a little more useful. It recovers the same way as the 11AA version does, but there's no first attack before the cancel.
 
After 3B+K,kG I normally use iWR A+B. It's fast, and it starts with a low, so it could mess some people up.
 
Loquori said:
3B+K,kG is a nonstarter for me. If they block the first hit, the second is interruptible for major damage, even if you don't cancel it. If the first hit connects, there's only a few circumstances where you would want to close the distance but not try to hit with the second K. Even if you do close the distance on an opponent who has put themselves in a position to evade the second K, are you going to be at an advantage against them when the kG finishes? I think it equally likely that you are at neutral very close to them. In that case, I would rather close with a different attack where I can choose my range based on the situation.

Just like 3B+K,K, if the first one is blocked, the second hit of 11_77A,A is interruptible for major damage, even if you don't cancel it.
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So are you trying to work 3B+K into your normal game, or dealing with it as a juggle finishing option? As for these moves overall, any of these old cancels scream risk vs reward pressure mixup tools, not something you just throw out. Depending on the style of the player, I'd either refer to the cancels as all finisher setups or "only after you've pressured them into freezing" tools.

Because the cancels aren't fast, it's doubtful you'll do anything other than be able to provide additional pressure, or mixups... But a cancelled 2A+B on the edge, follow up FC'ed 2A/2B to keep them there? A 11AA cancel after abusing it for an entire game? A launcher to 3B+K,Kg that cancels into WS providing you a wsB / wsB BE / wsA+B mixup after closing the gap? (Once again, assuming you are discounting the value of post launcher; I could see an old school X wanting their lower great wall lol. Still, launcher or not, that gap closing pressure is valid against most opponents.)

It's true that until they expect the full string and are blocking / frozen cancels can't be relied on; but as for 'end of game' solutions, with little prep/conditioning you can work them in, imo - just like you could have with X.

On your last part there - are you saying normal or CH 3B+K, FC'ed A+B = guaranteed?!


- Your favorite Tulsa X
 
OKgamers.com said:
So are you trying to work 3B+K into your normal game, or dealing with it as a juggle finishing option? As for these moves overall, any of these old cancels scream risk vs reward pressure mixup tools, not something you just throw out. Depending on the style of the player, I'd either refer to the cancels as all finisher setups or "only after you've pressured them into freezing" tools.

Because the cancels aren't fast, it's doubtful you'll do anything other than be able to provide additional pressure, or mixups... But a cancelled 2A+B on the edge, follow up FC'ed 2A/2B to keep them there? A 11AA cancel after abusing it for an entire game? A launcher to 3B+K,Kg that cancels into WS providing you a wsB / wsB BE / wsA+B mixup after closing the gap? (Once again, assuming you are discounting the value of post launcher; I could see an old school X wanting their lower great wall lol. Still, launcher or not, that gap closing pressure is valid against most opponents.)

It's true that until they expect the full string and are blocking / frozen cancels can't be relied on; but as for 'end of game' solutions, with little prep/conditioning you can work them in, imo - just like you could have with X.

On your last part there - are you saying normal or CH 3B+K, FC'ed A+B = guaranteed?!


- Your favorite Tulsa X
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I think you quoted the wrong post.

However, I think people are overusing the 3B+K followup post-launch. You have to use the kG cancel to chase them down because the 3B+K pushes them so far away. I think most people are trying to solve a problematic situation of their own making. Yeah, I might be relying on old school muscle memory, but I use 1B after launch. I still have the WR A+B/A/B(BE) mixup, and I don't have to deal with chasing them down and strange off-axis whiffs. I also have 33_99B,B and 44K that I can wake them up with for special cases. The 3B+K launch finisher is fine for straight damage, but the oki after it is sub-par. All of the good players I have come up against force a whiff on the second K. So, I can't train them to expect and block the K because they just punish me in either case. For me, the best use of 3B+K is anti-high punish and ROs.
 
No love from Sean!

I'm pretty sure you are right, and using it will fall out of favor; my problem is probably a lack of playing Leixia enough to see it. Not that Cali didn't also get some great preview tournaments / etc; I also just haven't been putting as much time into Leixia as you probably have, so my opponents haven't taught me the same lessons yet, etc.

1B eh? Feels too old school to go back to, but makes sense if the damage is anywhere similar.

Without having good players punishing it, and it being a clean hit, etc - it just seems so tempting; sad to know I'll have to start to strain it out of my game already.
 
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