Raphael General Discussion

New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

It doesn't pertain to Raphael but being an above average player in general, you HAVE GOT TO GET DOWN SIMPLE GI's like Cervantes Teleport spam(4B+K and the other one where he teleports back then does the GDR crap), Yun Sung's 2nd hit of 6BB(universally easy to GI), Taki's dive attack, And all of Astaroth's long winded Guard breaks. If players know they can pull stupid shit like this on you without any threat of retaliation...you're not going to make it.

Also as a Raphael, LEARN what highs your opponents like to use and 4B the shit out of it. Nightmares rely on plenty of highs for example.

Pay close attention to 66A+B and A+B, A GI windows, ALOT OF PLAYERS will try attacking you right after they block both of these, 66A+B less so because of the threat of 44B, but A+B, A all the time. Don't get predictable, but have enough control to force your opponent to not gain any advantage after both of these.
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

or step cervys 4B+K , Yun Sung's 2nd hit of 6BB, Taki's dive attack, And all of Astaroth's GB's

more reward anyway
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

Millionz: more than 50% of characters get ~60 dmg on both sucessful GI or re-GI. Raph's post GI is roughly equal to NM's post GI, maybe even worse than that (40 on GI, 60 on re-GI). above average? how many characters get worse than that?
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

I GI a shit-load, love how it applies to Raphael's game.

Anyone been experimenting with 11_44_77A? I can't remember if it was on hit or block, but I did it without the B followup and did a throw...it happened to be a backthrow.

I'm not sure if the move spins you to BT(on block or hit....), but I want to understand this mixup/throw window now. I'm learning to use Raphael's prep starting moves without going into prep as much to surprise my opponent more.

44A/44A, i want more opinions on these moves o_o.
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

44A series is pretty useful in spots. The prep transition is his best one from a stand still move, and it starts off a horizontal mid albeit slow. It's another piece of mind game against those who know raph and a tool against those who don't.
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

Belial said:
Millionz: (40 on GI, 60 on re-GI). above average? how many characters get worse than that?
Click to expand...

some characters have pretty awesome post GI stuff but some characters have pretty shitty ones. i guess the difference between us is that I think those are solid numbers. in no way do i think raph is just better off "sticking to throws" when he GI's someone
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

I can't think of characters with worse post-GI than raph. at least name a couple? can you? I cant. I'm not hating, that's the truth. If you want to risk post GI against those chars with "awesome" GI like mitsu, asta, or sophie - go ahead. All I said was that he's gi is bad, you said it somehow above average, thats completely wrong.
And that said, unlike everybody else here I think raph is definitely far from low tier.

On a side note - You can follow it up at a distance, for ex you can set up your post GI after Gi'ing slow moves from far away, like asta 22B or kilik 2A+B. 3B or 236B have great reach and can be mixed up with 66B for ex.
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

edit: actually i dont play this game enough to care anymore ^_^
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

Hey guys, I need some more 1-off parlour tricks to glitter-up my game. Can you help?
So far:
AB
BB 4A
1A on grounded 44B (doesn't actually work ever but I always attempt it)
Prep
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

Nukleurfire said:
Hey guys, I need some more 1-off parlour tricks to glitter-up my game. Can you help?
So far:
AB
BB 4A
1A on grounded 44B (doesn't actually work ever but I always attempt it)
Prep
Click to expand...


1)step-4B/44B mixups
step after these moves on block (do it after an opponent's safe move)
6A
66A+B
8K
66A

and then step-whiff punish with 33KB/22B or w/e suits you.

As long as you use 4B/44B (and they know you will) ..most of their high/special low anti-step moves won't be thrown out as much, but most importantly mix up step and 4B/44B. For me ... I get quite a bit of my damage by punishing whiffs, and the other half with pokes. I don't really use much frame traps as I should..
 
New to 8wayrun, would like some Raphael help

WuHT said:
1)step-4B/44B mixups
step after these moves on block (do it after an opponent's safe move)
6A
66A+B
8K
66A

and then step-whiff punish with 33KB/22B or w/e suits you.

As long as you use 4B/44B (and they know you will) ..most of their high/special low anti-step moves won't be thrown out as much, but most importantly mix up step and 4B/44B. For me ... I get quite a bit of my damage by punishing whiffs, and the other half with pokes. I don't really use much frame traps as I should..
Click to expand...

Ooh. That's cool. I already do this for 66A+B and kind of BB if they wise up to 4A, but not off of those moves there. I never knew these moves had such little disadvantage (I'm guessing they do since the frame data is down).
I was asking for dumb stuff, but you gave me something really useful.
Thanks!
 
ok ive been cleaning up the SA

i got rid of the threads asking

"whats this move do?"

and merged them into this one

duplicates of other threads like the raphael mirror matches or 2nd raphael combo thread were either deleted or merged and put where they should be

I also moved the ivy and sig match ups thread to the anti character thread

which im reformatting

i will be replacing holy force as a mod

since hes been awol for months now

if you have a question about something please put it in here instead of making a thread

i have a low tolerance for Q.Q threads because they serve no purpose at all

so please no threads saying "man i wish raph was better" if you play a low tier its your own fault

cant take the heat get out of the street

EDIT: the changes i made to SA should take effect today

if you dont like what i did please PM me and give me feed back and i will try to do better next time

EDIT EDIT: i got rid of random threads and what not basically moving them to where they belong
 
Why does raph get so much hate online?

"Raph takes no skill"

"Raph is a spammer"

"All Raphs play the same"

I'm sure we've all heard it before. Is everyone just jealous of our smexy fencer or what?
 
Nah, people just like to bitch like... little bitches. I hear it about every character I play. I've played people that said, "Man I hate [insert character], blah blah bitch bitch" after EVERY time I switched characters to try to quell the whining. I would go from Raph, to Voldo, to Kilik, to Lizardman, to Asta....

The only one I haven't really heard whining about is when I play Mina. :\

Oh, and these were actually decent players.
 
I've heard people say that raph has such a spammy combo... pressing BBBBBBBBBBB like mad. I'm grateful for any raph combo, so I don't complain though heheh.
 
CaLaMiTyArRow said:
Why does raph get so much hate online?

"Raph takes no skill"

"Raph is a spammer"

"All Raphs play the same"

I'm sure we've all heard it before. Is everyone just jealous of our smexy fencer or what?
Click to expand...

low tiers take no skill remember that

my raph has no spam! who do you think raph is algol?

my raph is different i never use prep out side of combos take that!

i said no QQ but ill let it slide for now

since no one has seen what i expect obviously ill say again

1) please no crying about raph or QQ of any kind

2) dont make a thread for everything we have pretty much everything covered pretty much anything you can think of should go into the threads already made
 
I just want to elaborate on my playstyle with raph to those who maybe didnt realize it from my vids, b/c I cant show everything in video.

In my opinion Raphael is a good character in this game, contrary to common opinion. He has three very important aspects that not just surpass that of other characters but are very synergic to each other.
They are:
a) Atack range (most people dont even remotely realize how much range Raph has b/c of all those prep Sheanigans going on)
b) Soul Gauge Damage (SGD)
c) Reverse mixups/Evades

By poking at a distance - your opp cannot punish Raph for that, well, most characters cannot, and those who can - will have to take risks, react not to particular atack animation but to a character movement - that is very risky b/c most punishers are not safe. - so by poking I will build up SGD very fast, raph is really good at that (also I think 3B deals more SGD than 3 but not sure). Since Raphael is weak to step opp will generally try to step him constantly. But when they step me - I step backwards and keep on poking. If they try to 8wr 88_22 will hit often its 60 hit detectable damage. it also builds up SGD. But the very important part most players lack is Just Frame VE B:B on it. If you dont have it 200% of the time you shouldnt play raph ever!
Good pokes at distance:
3B
22_88B
B
6B variations
In certain game situations 44AB and 66A work well. 44AB in case your opp is waiting to punish your poking game, I will use 44AB then b/c its the only way to set up relatively safe prep and will track 100%. Most of the time I will deal extra SGD, I i'm lucky I will also deal damage to my opp If not I might get punished, but more often than not it will result favorably for Raph.
66A is used at max distance. The move itself is not that great even at tip range (where it tracks 100%), but it will teach your opp that stepping is dangerous at far range. Normally your opp is not ready for this and will become nervous b/c he will think "WTF is this shit and how did it hit me?" it will also make him hesitate at far range, b/c he will want to punish you for what he thinks a bad play, then you can continue to build up SGD.

Even if your opponent is cautious and defends very well, red SG will make him atack recklessly. Thats where you should get just as reckless. Use your powerful evades and reverse mixups at maximum. 8wr 33_99k:B and 22B VE B:B from step, 4B to beat high moves or throws he may try to stop your step with (he really wouldnt want to get hit by 22B at red gauge. 44B is strong by itself and builds up SGD BUT many players will Gi it on reaction if you dont guess correctly. WS B and 44K are also good mentions b/c they deal good damage and are safe ways to beat high and low moves respectively. Also upclose you should keep two moves in mind! 6K and WS A are both very good on block b/c they give great pushback. they are both safe and have added bonuses as 6K jumps and is very quick and WS A tracks step 100% though slow. Try to use them to push your opp away to make him even more desperate to get in.

It really took longer to describe but it actually works amazingly good b/c Raph builds up SGD very fast.

If you can combine those three strong sides than Raphael is a very strong character (IMHO)
problem may be that you should really know distance well and that only come with experience.
 
Distance is definitely his best weapon. He doesn't have the strong basics on paper and have to be played with a firm grasp of the game engine instead. The more effective you become with raph, the more unorthodox you will be to an opponent who doesn't play against it regularly. Part of his appeal to me is his inability to play by the rules and the experimentation required for me to make him work. My alt characters are robotic by comparison since the character themselves tell you how they should be played.
 
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