The New MMA Thread

To those saying Lesnar is gonna get owned by submission fighters, well...I just don't see it happening. Don't get me wrong, he can and almost surely will lose at some point. That's the thing about MMA, in a strange way skill matters both far more and far less than in other sports. Hear me out before you start ripping, I'm just saying any fight can be over in an instant. It's not as if in football the game can just suddenly end (barring overtime) because one team got a "really good touchdown". The same can't be said for MMA. A lucky punch, a surprise arm-bar or guillotine and bam, it's over.

Anyway, I got sidetracked. The point is Lesnar is easily twice as strong as the next strongest heavyweight in the UFC, and as fast as guys 80 pounds lighter than him. The dude was 4 time NCAA national wrestling champ in college and I'm going from memory so don't butcher me if I'm wrong but I think his record was something like 105-5. The man knows how to grapple and he knows how to be on the ground. If it weren't for the fact that his glancing blows land like cannonballs, I'd say his biggest weakness aside from inexperience is his striking. He doesn't seem to throw particularly well, he just has so much power it doesn't matter. He's not going to be outwrestled and, odds are, he's not going to be out-punched. If he loses, it's going to be to an out of nowhere leglock like his match against Mir. And if you remember looking back at that Mir match, it was two seconds of leglock and the entire rest of the match was Lesnar making him look like his prison bitch.

He's not unbeatable by any stretch of the imagination but I will go on record now and say you can put him against pretty much any mixed martial artist in the world and they will be the underdog.
 
Sporko said:
The point is Lesnar is easily twice as strong as the next strongest heavyweight in the UFC
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shane carwin
Sporko said:
The dude was 4 time NCAA national wrestling champ in college
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1 time
Sporko said:
odds are, he's not going to be out-punched.
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shane carwin, junior dos santos, possibly nog, cain velasquez, gonzaga
Sporko said:
He's not unbeatable by any stretch of the imagination but I will go on record now and say you can put him against pretty much any mixed martial artist in the world and they will be the underdog.
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shane carwin, fedor, josh barnett

lesnar moves very well for a guy his size and has good power in his hands, but keep in mind that the one time he fought a good submission guy, he got submitted. he has enormous potential, but right now he's extremely raw and still has a lot to prove. now if he can beat the real giant killer, nog, then that's another story.
 
Sporko said:
If he loses, it's going to be to an out of nowhere leglock like his match against Mir.
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I'd also like to add that there is no such thing as an "out of nowhere leglock." Jiu-jitsu doesn't fall under "a puncher's chance" category, it's something that has to be set up, thought out, and strategically implemented and/or avoided. Mir made several submission attempts against Lesnar and that just happened to be the one that sunk in, but it was just a matter of time if you really watched the fight. Lesnar's jiu-jitsu defense is "yank really, really hard when they grab onto your limb," which just isn't smart MMA. I don't think he could take Nog or Mir, and in a fight against Fedor he'd be out before the clock started.

Lesnar is a young guy and he probably has a promising MMA career ahead of him, but anyone who thinks he actually deserves the UFC Heavyweight belt is daft.
 
Smithy said:
1 time
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Ok, I was so very sure I was right about this, so I checked wikipedia only to find out we were both wrong. He was two times NCJAA all-american, two time NCAA all-american, and then NCAA heavyweight champ. I added his NCJAA wins to his regular NCAA wins. My bad, but still impressive.

As for the other comment below that first, call me daft then, because until I see somebody dominate him in a fight, I stand by comment that not only he deserves to be champion but that anybody opposing him will be the underdog.

And I disagree, that leg lock *was* out of nowhere. Or, at least due to a lucky situation that Mir skillfully took advantage of. It wasn't a planned attempt by Mir in the sense that Mir did not position him into that leglock, not by himself anyway. Lesnar positioned *himself* into it,due to inexperience, and then tried to leap out of it, again due to inexperience. And even still half a second sooner and that admittedly stupid escape attempt would have worked because Mir got it locked in *just* in time and Lesnar *can* power out of moves that normal people just can't. Every part of that was Lesnar's fault and Mir took advantage like a vet. That's just the thing about Lesnar's power, positioning Lesnar is a near herculean task. We've seen thus-far that in any kind of standing-grappling position, the fight goes where Lesnar wants it to go. And I mean that in the literal "I'm going to move you and put you where I want you to be" sense. The same has seemed to go for the ground position as well if for no other reason than getting out from under the guy is *damned* hard.

Of the fighters you mentioned, I must admit some degree of infamiliarity with Shane Carwin. I admit I had to look him up. He's big, no question and his record seems to show he's got the skill to back it up, but until I see him show me he can do these things, my opinion isn't really going to change. Though I'll give you that, yeah, this dude *looks* like he could out-punch lesnar. Like I said, Lesnar does not look to be a very *skilled* striker. It just hasn't seemed to matter...yet. You got a striker who actually has the power to land on Lesnar and actually move his face in spite of the mountanous delts/quads he has framing his head and taking the place of what should be his neck, and I can see Lesnar being knocked out. And a 6'4 240 pound dude could probably do that. I don't retract my statement, though. When it comes to overall body strength, I'd still be willing to put up a bet that Lesnar is near twice as strong as him. It just has to do with how he's built: i.e. like an inhuman freak who should never have been put on a world of mortal men. Carwin does look like he's got the striking power to match and the skill to out-punch. We still haven't seen Lesnar's ability to take a *real* punch so that's still a bit up in the air right now.

But saying he doesn't deserve to be Heavyweight champion, you might as well just say Couture didn't deserve it and, no, not just because he beat Couture but because he defeated Couture in the same fashion he has beaten everybody he's faced so far ( and I say beaten and instead of won, because he didn't win against Mir but, once again, he beat the fuck out of him). Remember, I started my post by saying Lesnar will *surely* lose at some point, but I don't see anybody dominating him. And if somebody does, I see it even less likely that it would happen twice were there a rematch.

Lesnar is inexperienced as hell and a new, inexperienced Lesnar is still *dominating* competition.

He is *only* going to get better. His UFC record right now is 3-1. In another twenty one matches, if his record is any worse than 21-4 or 20-5 I will be amazed.
 
Ok
I went back and watched some old Pride intro vids

HOLY SHIT production values, hype vids, wow
WOW, i got hype

Thats how jaxel needs to headline tourney vids
 
the second vid is one of the hypest vids of all time, too bad the event ended the way it did
 
Wait what do you mean ended the way it did?

You mean Pride as an association? or specifically the 2004 Grand Prix? What's going on here?

(PRIDE 4 LIFE, no homo)
 
the grand prix, it ended with fedor getting cut a few minutes into the fight. they fought again at shockwave, but the cut at the end of the tournament made final conflict 04 the most anticlimactic mma event ever
 
AH YES I was thinking it was that event where Fedor and Nog had the NC... well cool, cool.

and Overeem and Crocop's nuts ... man... nut shotzzzzzzzz
 
speaking of megafights, how bout that chuck vs randy 4 on tape delay from germany lol

randy at the beginning of the contract dispute: "fedor is the only fight that makes sense for me"
 
wec tonite seems like a decent card
so far only 2 fights listed for the jan 25th stuff
varner vs. cerrone
pulver vs faber

is it me or all the old school guys falling off
liddel pulver couture among others...
 
flaw said:
is it me or all the old school guys falling off
liddel pulver couture among others...
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that's what happens when you get old. and wec tonight was okay, not their best show, but they've been pumping out consistently high quality shows for a while now, which makes solid shows like tonight's seem mediocre by comparison
 
ya its was aight
i dont see torres losing anytime soon dudes a beast
i wonder why ian mccall hasnt fought in awhile
cant wait for the cowboy varner fight though
 
Any news about who gets a LHW title shot after Rashad? If Wand destroys Rampage again they may give Machida the middle finger and give Wand the next shot.

As for Brock I can't believe there is discussion about him even here, Big Nog will submit him with a flying inverse reverse gogoplata and hopefully I'll never have to hear about Brock's steroided ass again. Before any of you leap out of your skin to reply, Brock was caught red handed with a shipment of steroids a few years back and after bribing the police they said it wasn't steroids, only human growth hormone. As if that makes him any more innocent.
 
brian bowles has a very good shot at beating torres if he can mix it up and take torres out of his game. as for the ufc lhw title, the winner of forrest vs rashad will fight the winner of wand vs rampage, period. after machida beats thiago silva he'll fight luis cane or something, and so on and so forth. they'll deny him a title shot until there are no more contenders left to fight. then, in like 2010, he'll get his shot and win the title.
 
Maybe Machida should backdash cancel less then lol.

And isn't flying INVERSE REVERSE gogoplata a double negative? I bet Nog will divide Brock by zero next, lol.
 
what a brutal fucking show, my god lol. al-hassan's arm... fuck

edit: just saw video of corey hill's leg breaking, that shit was horrific
 
obligatory double post acknowledgment

darth bader ftw lol. i'll be using him in the ufc video game thanks to his epic choice of entrance music
 
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