Hate Speech: Degeneracy (Competition)

Vincent may not have won Devastation 2011, but he certainly won our hearts, and this despite being a known Canadian. After clutching out an impressive victory against LP (and avenging a loss from the day before in the process), he was given the stream mic and used his moment in the sun to grace us all with two nuggets of unadulterated profundity: "I just want to get laid," and "we played casuals . . . I lost like fifteen in a row to him, but then I won two."

While the aspirational element of the first statement is both powerful and moving, I'll set it aside for another day. The second statement, however, is a perfect example of the attitude necessary to succeed in Soul Calibur--or any game, for that matter--at the highest levels.

Vints has gone through a few nicknames over the years, but MoneyMuffins is the worst.

While great skill and tournament experience are both necessary conditions for success, they're not sufficient in themselves to do so. The final required element is what I will term the competitive mindset. My definition of the competitive mindset is comprised of three parts, each of which we'll examine in turn, starting with:

Defining Trait 1: Perseverance

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If at first you don't succeed, cheat and use warp zones.

Think for a moment about what Vints did here. Having lost to LP in pool play on Saturday, he actively sought LP out for more games. Choking back a veritable tidal wave of hormones and sexual frustration, he sat down and took his beatings like a man until he figured out how to overcome his opponent. Developing skill isn't an easy thing, and it necessarily involves a great deal of failure. For you supernatural geniuses in the audience, think back to when your precocious little brains were trying to figure out the secret to walking. Even something that basic requires that we fall on our faces over and over again, and Calibur is hardly any different. Players with the proper competitive mindset don't view losses as wholly bad; personally, I'm never happier than when I am playing someone who is routinely out-thinking me, because I know that pushing through those difficulties will make me a stronger player. Adversity in this sense can become a valuable learning experience for, as Vints showed us, it can pay serious dividends.

Defining Trait 2: Confidence

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Vints is almost as confident as this kitty kat right here! Ladies, take note.

This bit seems self-evident, but it’s a particularly vicious brand of confidence that I’m recommending here, so it’s worth unpacking. I respect a large number of my fellow players’ skill. Maybe—and I stress maybe—if you found me in an appropriately inebriated state, I might be pushed to confess that some of them are nearly my equal. All that changes, though, as soon as we sit down to play. Don’t be reckless, and never underestimate the person sitting next to you in a tournament scenario, but take care not to err too far in the other direction. Players with enough of a reputation can often get away with murder based on their name alone, which is why it’s important, for the duration of a match, to nourish a healthy contempt for your foe. Irrespective of the situation, it’s important to have a well-cultivated belief that you will win because, frankly, all you need is one point of health and a string of intelligent decisions to come back from any deficit.

Defining Trait 3: Ruthlessness

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You will need to be even more ruthless than the negative effect this picture has on the male brain.​

This aspect might be the most abstract. The word ruthlessness, taken literally, seems merely to be a darker way of invoking confidence in the manner that I did above. For our purposes, however, I mean it to represent a willingness to do anything within the rules of the game in order to secure a victory. Put colloquially: “cheap it up.” There’s an inexplicable tendency within certain parts of the fighting game world to develop things akin to codes of honor. Barring that, we see often enough contrition on the part of successful players who use characters or tactics that others feel are less than sporting.

Ruthlessness deserves a bit more attention from us because I feel like it gets an unduly negative reputation. Seth Killian somewhat vitriolically characterized this reaction as part of the “scrub mentality” (Article HERE). That particular territory having been thoroughly covered, we’ll approach it from a different angle today: being unwilling to utilize “cheap” tactics limits every aspect of your game.

First, and most obviously, eschewing the most brutally effective tactics limits your ability to win both in and out of tournaments. Second, it limits your growth as a player. I first picked up Soul Calibur in Tulsa, Oklahoma. The Tulsa scene had very strong feelings about turtling and backdashing. Very, very strong feelings. For a long time I shared this opinion until I fell in with the Dallas-area reprobates who blocked and ran away so damn much that I had to adapt in order to survive. This was a revelation to me. Tactics I had previously thought to be boring or cheap became filled with dramatic tension as I grew to understand the much larger mindgame taking place. Interestingly, and importantly, as my turtling skills grew, I found myself with more and more opportunities to employ the tendency toward frenetic offense I had picked up in Tulsa.

Rather than artificially limiting myself to that single facet of the game, however, I discovered an inclusive attitude toward gameplay that both allowed and, in fact, necessitated extremely precise offense and defense. Third, as I just alluded to, refusing cheapness limits your enjoyment of the game. When both players are truly going all-out, fighting games provide an incredibly rich experience. What’s more, when you’re both being cruel bastards, it’s far less likely that one particular tactic will become so dominant as to choke off the fun of a game.

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Redheads always ruining the fun for everyone

But what about when that does happen? In the formal study of game design, these tactics are referred to as “degenerate strategies.” According to Katie Salen & Eric Zimmerman, "[a] degenerate strategy is a way of playing a game that takes advantage of a weakness in the game design, so that the play strategy guarantees success." (p.271 of THIS book). Game-breaking glitches, massively-lopsided matchups, and Hilde all seem to fall into this category. If that’s the case, well, ban ‘em. If there exist too many in a particular game, go find a better game. In all cases, though, be absolutely certain that you are drawing the line at a legitimate degenerate strategy and not something that’s merely strong, but not broken.

Develop your competitive mindset, keep that competitive mind open, and judge accordingly. In the meantime, go crush your friends and save those pennies so you can make it out to NEC.

Homework:
Tell me what “competitive mindset” means to you. What’s the right attitude necessary to achieve success?

Extra Credit:
Go to Canada and take Vincent out on the town for some good old-fashioned romance.
 
First of all, great work as always Hates.

And I learned this from Mick, a winning attitude is the first step to be a winner (that and being good). Self confidence is gonna affect the match and the rival, not just you, some players can get scared during a tournament, that's something Omega and I know, and it is important whenever we are playing at a tournament, if you ain't mind ready, this will get at you in many forms (Missed inputs, pre-show nerves, etc).

When you start playing at tournaments like if you were on your couch, is when you gonna get the best player out of you in a tournament, beating nerves, is something that many good players hasn't done.

Back to LP and Vincent example, I think LP is a much better player overall, I think LP stopped LP, not Vincent, when he was close to end this match, something got on his mind, Vincent maintained the same attitude, no fear, you are kicking my ass, but I do not fear you, I'm just doing my shit, so at one point in the match, it was LP and Vincent vs LP, that's how Vincent won, that and JF stab.
 
Its common for Vints to think he's WAY better than someone when he beats them by one hit.

Its also common for Vints to think he's WAY better than someone that beats him with a "Broken" character.

Double Standards Much?! Jus Sayn.

But seriously Losing is Good if you're able to learn from it.
No. Being the best is too vague for my interests. I don't actually think I'm better than another person. I only get pissed when somebody thinks I'm incapable of beating them. Then I declare war in the name of humility!

And be an adorable douchebag in the process.
 
Well he did beat you pretty well in that match. I'll say you didn't do your research. We'll say he was better on that day, at that moment.

Also. ROs are cheap. Real Players win with KOs.
 
Vincent, I said that because you were talking shit, I don't do that unless someone deserves it, I do like you Vincent, and tough I wanted LP to win that match, but you won my heart.
 
Hates said:
Tell me what "competitive mindset" means to you. What's the right attitude necessary to achieve success?

When I feel like total garbage I'll just keep going. If 0-15 then it's time to step back and ask what I am doing right and what I need to improve on. But I am proactively trying to solve problems all the time.

Some solutions require more effort than others.

If my opponent has stronger core skills like better step, technical know how, or is exploiting my lack of knowledge then there's probably little chance for me to succeed during that session -- an example of a complex problem. But I'll take those problems home and practice or research the meta game. But sometimes the only way I'll get better is by fighting 0-15 against a better opponent.

The best tactics will have a 99% chance to work the first time and a 1% chance to work the second time. Sometimes it feels like the whole point is to make the opponent forget what works and then use it again either by using confusion, interruption, or some other force. People especially get very stupid when they have to work against the clock.

A competitive mindset for me is staying positive, staying smart, and being tenacious no matter what happens.
 
Haha, I remember all the hate on backdashing and turtling the one time I went to Tulsa. I didn't meet everyone, but I don't remember you Hates. Did you go by a different name back in SC1 days?
 
Vincent, I said that because you were talking shit, I don't do that unless someone deserves it, I do like you Vincent, and tough I wanted LP to win that match, but you won my heart.

GRUDGE MATCH!

Also, I'm calling you out Hulk Hogan-style. ;)

Haha, I remember all the hate on backdashing and turtling the one time I went to Tulsa. I didn't meet everyone, but I don't remember you Hates. Did you go by a different name back in SC1 days?

I was less abbreviated back in the day--BrianHatesYou--and I didn't really get into Calibur until around 2001 or 2002.
 
All's fair in love and war...and fighting games. Seriously, unless it's banned, use whatever works.
 
BTW - How can anyone fault FT10s?1 If you can't last they FT10 that means you wee probably winning on gimmicks/lack of character knowledge, and the opponent adapted and beat you. It means you could NOT adapt to him adapting. FT3 FT5 still have meaning, but in a sense you get off lucky.

Also, by Vints and some people logic here, it does NOT MATTER if I lose 50 Matches, in theory if I win the LAST MATCH, I'm better than you. This is by Vints and co's logic not my own.

Discuss.
 
I see nothing wrong with any of those measurements, FT3, FT5, FT10, etc. Most people use their own judgment in the end, though, despite final outcomes. That's why omega is always regarded as one of the best despite not being top 3 in his past couple trips. That's why Woahhzz isn't regarded the ultimate number one despite winning the most majors. People see a discrepancy in the player skill and character tier, and sometimes other factors too. Things aren't simple. But yeah, it doesn't matter what measure we use...'cause you're likely to make up your own mind, anyway.
 
Also. ROs are cheap. Real Players win with KOs.

To hell with that. RO play has been a facet of the series for 15 years now. It's well past time for people to get over it and learn to actually deal with it. Position awareness and position control are relevant skills to develop and some of the characters are balanced around having stronger knock backs, and a wider variety of abilities to position an opponent more favorably (namely many of the slower characters in comparison to faster characters).

It gets on my nerves when I get called "lucky" or "cheap" because someone was too stupid/unaware to stop pressuring my Sieg to the edge of the stage and gets bounced for it. Especially when they're ahead in health and I HAVE to come back in after them before times up if they don't come out at me. Sometimes in lieu of better opportunity presenting itself I'll taking a beating to the edge like that as a strategy I'll use for a round if I believe I can get away with it and they'll take the bait and get overconfident. That's planning, awareness, risk assessment and forethought at work, not luck.

Usually if you get caught with a RO it's either your own damn fault, or your opponent has actually outplayed you (regardless of health meters) into that position.
 
Digitality:

He was saying it's more convincing that you're a better player if you win with KO. Me, I always say I don't mind RO if it's more universal in character ability.

In other words, ROs are pointless if both characters can't do it viably. Why should Amy have 33B (mid) and Xianghua have 66A (horizontal high) while Sophitia only has linear 66A+B? This is an example for moves faster than i20 in speed. All 3 of these characters have fast basics but it's assumed Sophi shouldn't have good ring outs because her game should be based on block and whiff punishment, which is silly because not everyone wants to focus on the same things. I wouldn't favor a cage match if I played those other characters, and you can tell with my old school Hwang 'cause the amount of ROs I got with him compared to now with Sophi is staggering.

Oh yeah, the same logic on universal character ability can almost be applied to Critical Finish but not quite 'cause it's less random than a ring out.
 
Digitality - You got trolled. Get used to it. Welcome to the forums. BTW RO aren't cheap, but you suck if thats what you rely on to win. When I'm down by a big life lead, I dont RO. I comeback and win. Ask anyone that plays me online the massive comebacks I make. I digress.....

Vints - Why are you up at 5:46AM go to sleep.
 
Man, it´s one of the most impressive comebacks I´ve ever seen. Congratulations to Vincent for this amazing performance agains a great opponent.
 
Digitality:

He was saying it's more convincing that you're a better player if you win with KO. Me, I always say I don't mind RO if it's more universal in character ability.

In other words, ROs are pointless if both characters can't do it viably. Why should Amy have 33B (mid) and Xianghua have 66A (horizontal high) while Sophitia only has linear 66A+B? This is an example for moves faster than i20 in speed. All 3 of these characters have fast basics but it's assumed Sophi shouldn't have good ring outs because her game should be based on block and whiff punishment, which is silly because not everyone wants to focus on the same things. I wouldn't favor a cage match if I played those other characters, and you can tell with my old school Hwang 'cause the amount of ROs I got with him compared to now with Sophi is staggering.

Oh yeah, the same logic on universal character ability can almost be applied to Critical Finish but not quite 'cause it's less random than a ring out.

Universal character performance/potential is unnecessary and counter intuitive to the genre. While I understand wanting to play a certain character for flavor and having options open to you, if their style can't fit the way you want to execute your game you might better off playing a different character who does. The game would probably be immaculately balanced, but would feel boring, and the characters would seem contrived if everything lined up on 1 for 1 basis no matter what character you play.

Sieg (I'm biased) has a single, generally useless, unblockable in Earth Divide while several other characters are likely to have more of them, or have faster executing ones, or they do more damage, or they have a wider area of effect. My take on it? Oh well. I have other tools available to me.

While it's easier to to believe a KO more definitively, I wouldn't say that it more clearly marks better play. There is a meta game that takes place and ignoring it is a weakness. Positioning has always been important in Soul Calibur games. Me personally... it's rarely an accident that I get the RO's I do or that the fight ends up in a particular section of the stage, so how is that less technically proficient?

The video above shows you on occasion getting drawn into a Setsuka wall combo that you have no reason to be open to. While it's easy to critique things after the fact, and we all make errors at times that's a mistake I (like to believe lol) wouldn't even leave myself open to making. It's a very basic positioning error that was the result of riding the pressure you had for too long. I would have drawn the play back out to midfield being up 3 to 1 on health (Match 2 round 2). It cost you a round you shouldn't have lost. Ultimately it didn't matter, since you won overall but I'm just illustrating my point in how much positioning and awareness of it and what it means in your match ups matters.

To me a win is a win is a win. Saying a loss is less than another loss is just making excuses. I'm just as happy to win by time out as I am by RO or KO. Whatever opportunity presents itself. It's not surprising that we've had people talk about how boring it can be to watch competitive gaming. As long as skill is the deciding factor and both players have a fair shot at winning based on their skill sets (as opposed to using exploits/gross imbalance) the means to reach the finish line are equally valid.
 

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