Frustration, excuses (your char is top tier)

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[08] Mercenary
I love how this thread started as a way to say tiers are overrated, and thereafter fell into a detailed discussion on how Natsu is good because she is high tiered etc etc....

Anyhow to the creator of this post, I completely agree with you; tiers are overrated, they do exist, but they are damned overrated.

The reason so many people make excuses in fighting games, my self included, is that hands down these games are the most personal. By this I mean, when people lose they lose because they were directly defeated by their opponent. There may be lag, there may be a tier difference, but still the loser lost to someone else because they weren't good enough to compensate. People will ALWAYS be to emotionally weak to just accept this, as after all this is just a game that is suppose to be fun! As soon as something in the game no longer is fun to us, we as self-conscious human beings find some way to frame the situation so that after we lose we can still somehow perceive it as a fun event.

Anyhow, good original post!
Natsu's really not hard to deal with, and I know I'm gonna get ranted on about this. But I say once again, she's just gimmicks.

With the update she's worse and really nothing to complain about or hard to deal with.....she's just gimmicks. I don't see what's so hard about her.

I second Seig and third Zwei and with either one do I have a problem with a Natsu. In fact, I generally do better with Seig against Natsu then when i'm playing WITH Natsu (my main and best character having trouble with a character than my Alt?!). So what's really the problem? PEOPLE JUST DON"T KNOW THE DAMN CHARACTER!

She's good, don't get me wrong, and one of the better ones, but I really don't feel she is top, she has silly factors that doesn't put her up there (like her most damaging attacks have to come from the opponent standing up and majority ends in high attacks).

I have way more success in winning with her than SC4 Taki, but still when I lose I find myself losing to the player, not the character, so there's really no excuse for it. When I hear the high tier bs online or whoever I play I just keep playing, laugh, and educate them on why she's not as good as what people think she is. Cause basically Natsu just forces you play up your reaction speed, and since alot of noobs have the reaction speed of a 98 year old woman, they complain when they eat consistent bombs.

I know one thing, I will be angry if Natsu gets the nerf hammer again.


[09] Warrior
Pretty sure this has either been implied or said BUT Natsu was so good because people didn't know how to play safe against her. In all honesty that all you really had to do was block and space. On block there were/are no great options to go into PO, her lows have shit range or can easily be blocked, and her pressure from throws was non-existent if you opponent had good spacing.

PO's mixups are somewhat dead thanks to JG.
PO b+k is blockable on reaction. PORC yields NO pressure. PO EX can be JG'd now. You know how to beat out PO?? BLOCK and JG EX!

Guard damage... most things that break are -12 or more... Enough said?

Lows... ALL blockable on reaction. OR you have to be hella close... a single back step kills ALL of her lows that you can't block on reaction.

a+b was hella good pre-patch... Yeah I can see why people cried about it. Good job with a solid nerf.

CH22k/CH WRk... Oh for fucks sakes if you're going to find it necessary to attack you deserve to eat 50% I could care less if it was meterless or not. If you get hit and try and attack after you're more than likely going to get CH... If you get hit and try and QS or BS you're likely going to get CH... block block block.

Damage reduction... again good nerf if you ask me.

Throws are comparable to her lows in terms of range.

All in all?? Let Natsu kill herself would have been the best solution to the patch. Just block and let her build meter whoopidy doo!


That is all for now.


[09] Warrior
People would really really cry if she could cancel EX... She also needs to go back to school and figure out how to abb and ba. AND BOTH NEED TO shift into PO at plus frames on hit and completely safe on block... like +/-0 or -1


[12] Conqueror
god damn i loved SC2, look at all of those options characters had. the new SC games are so watered down it sickens me.


[09] Warrior
god damn i loved SC2, look at all of those options characters had. the new SC games are so watered down it sickens me.
Sigh. Now I miss SC2.
<- My avatar will never change and now you all see why, haha. I feel so gimped playing anything after SCII, Taki was the Magneto of that game.

It wasn't just the fact that she could cancel EX, but she had so many moves and most importantly STRINGS into PO. The mix up was beyond good, four main strings into PO was a huge factor. Even if Natsu had EXC (which I've been asking for since day one and would love), she still wouldn't have the pressure game Taki had, not even close. I laugh so hard at the week one band wagoners saying Natsu was better than SCII Taki due to damage output, that's hilarious. Damage output means nothing if there is a 500% less likely chance of getting in, plus another 500% less 'make it safe' options. I love Natsu and all, but comparing the two is a joke.

AB4B+KA cancel string into ABBB.POA+B, the first string is common and because you can go into PO from just about any string, doing the same starter inputs disguises the PO set up completely, usually they'll be blocking low due to the bomb threat of the original combo.

BA POA+B EXC BAK -> Opposite of the above you throw out EXC set ups, but then trick the opponent into getting hit by a normal as they're expecting EX, then have WL mix ups on wake up.

BBB.POA+B EXC, probably the most used, doesn't stop 8wr like BAPOA+BEXC but does apply pressure and ends with mix up. Letting the raw BBB hit after a pressure string or two usually lands the third attack, which can also be cancelled into a 66B+G. Let the third hit enough and expect to land a BB.POA+B raw here and there. Chances are they'll 8wr, but this is where you are ahead of the game and anticipate it by doing BBB.PO_88_22A+B. Enjoy the damage.

Now, picture the above four strings mixed into a single form of pressure mixed up on every EXC (more or less every second). THAT is SCII Taki and that is pure pressure and rush down. Oh and those are just the main normal strings, pretty much all of her special attacks went into PO too. Talk about tools.


By the way, if anyone wants to play SCII I'm holding a tourney this summer that you can click in my sig. I'll be sure to demonstrate some OD pressure and rush down, just talking about this has made me want to put on a show. I miss the feel of fast flowing mind games so much.
My view when I used Tira in SCIV - Wow all these people just use whatever high tier character they can find, I bet they feel really pro when they win.

My view now that I use a high tier character - Yeah people who cry about tiers are funny, if it bothers you that much just use a high tier character and stop being such a sore loser.


[09] Warrior
Here, walked over to the cab for a sec to show you. Just showing her normal string mix up into PO/EXC, more or less supporting the chunk I wrote above.

Anyone who came into the scene post SCII should enjoy.

*youtube vid*
WTF do you mean "walked over to the cab" is that shit in your house?! LOL

THOSE AREN'T tEXC!!!! those are just EXC! GRRRRR! There were a few in there, but still! LOL

texc = a+b+g in same frame and no "EVILLL" exc = a+bG and "EVIIIILL" LOL

Nice inputs! With the EXC

God, I want to play some SCII now.
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