Rock Similar to Astaroth?

ShadowCollector

[09] Warrior
As the title says. Rock is similar to Astaroth in terms of moves. But can someone give me the rundown what makes these two characters completely different Outside the Air/Ground Grabs.
 

HeeeeresJonny86

[09] Warrior
As the title says. Rock is similar to Astaroth in terms of moves. But can someone give me the rundown what makes these two characters completely different Outside the Air/Ground Grabs.
Absolutely. Im a little surprised someone hasn't already beat me to this. The difference between Rock and Astaroth is that they lend themselves to different playstyles. Astaroth has good tools for spacing and ringout pressure. Rock is more geared toward close range mixups and ground pressure. I remember you comparing a few of their moves in another topic. I'll use that post to explain their differences.
However fundamentally jonny you can see some similarities in quite a few moves they share. And Yes I'm talking about 6k and 1a. Now before I get flamed for mentioning those two moves, there's also A+B, 4A+B, and the similar bullrush (Rock is CR 3k, Astaroth is 66k). Although I'm not surprise the two are the same because Astaroth as a character in general was based off Rock so it reflects in gameplay.

Sure Rock can be more brutal up close but looking at the two. They ARE similar to a degree. Never said you can play Rock Like Astaroth and Vice-Versa, But it's easier to transfer between the two then let's say Talim and Setsuka.
I'll give you that both their 6Ks and 1As have pretty much the same purpose. Asty's 6K TCs and he can delay his 1A into 1[A]A or 1[A]B, but both these moves are pretty much used for the same purpose for both characters. 6K is an anti-pressure tool up close that scores KND. 1A is a horizontal KND low that kills step at range. Both of their A+B_2A+Bs are generally used as long range step killers as well. (Astaroth's has better reach and is safer) I can understand why at a glance they seem pretty similar, but let's compare their differences.

You mentioned Astaroth's bullrush (66K). That's a good place to start. Astaroth's 66K covers moderate distance (moreso if it's charged) and knocks the opponent away landing face-up. Rock's 66K covers very little distance, but leaves the opponent grounded face-down right at Rocks feet. Although the command is the same, their purposes are completely different. Astaroth uses bullrush to create distance and to ring out. Rock uses 66K to punish highs up close and set up ground mixups. Even Rock's WR 3K (which looks the same as bullrush) doesn't space, but instead leaves the opponent grounded face-up right in front of Rock.

You also mentioned 4A+B. On both hit and CH, both of these moves do exactly the same thing. They both kill step to both sides and cause crumple stun that leaves the opponent face up and close. The difference here is their frames and follow up. Astaroth has much less of a reason to ever use this move. Rock's 4A+B is considerably safer on block. (-16 to Asty's -20) It's still punishable, but not as severely. Rock also has ground throws in his repitoire which means that the opponent has to eat a ground throw mixup every time this move lands. Astaroth has a much harder time following up the standard version of this move. (214A tech traps, but that's far from a guaranteed mixup) Astaroth can also charge his 4A+B which results in an unblockable attack throw. Asty has better options to kill step up close so you'll rarely see an Astaroth throw out the standard version of this move.

I could continue to give a move by move comparison but this post is already running a little long. Generally though, while their moves may have similar animations their properties and functions differ. If you have any other specific questions or you'd like me to continue to compare moves, feel free to shoot me a message. If you ever get a mic, I'd be more than happy to give you a few pointers online as well.
 

Suirad

[10] Knight
Rock has better step. Pretty much everything else Asta does better, even often with a move looks the same as one rock has. I wrote more, but eh. Rock can't do bullrush from standing (which is a deal breaker), asta's grabs are much stronger for a number of reasons and asta's gimmicky stuff also tends to work better than rock's.