Should Algol Be Banned

[Dullyanna]

She's actually pretty damn good, IMHO. She's just harder to pick up than other characters (Including Amy, apparently).

 

[Rico]

You know what, you people do whatever the hell you want to do.

I don't even play Algol and frankly couldn't care less (from my perspective) if I ever have to play him again.

If there IS one thing I agree about in this thread, it's that we DO have to make a decision.

So go ahead. What the hell, just ban the bastard. If/when Namco patches him a bit more we can reinstate him. Whatever floats your boat.

 

[CNP]

No ban. Doesn't seem like he's doing much dominating, yet. Anyone know of an Algol winning any tournaments?

 

[Ceirnian]

I could careless if Algol dominates the scene or doesn't.
I am not voting to keep him with them damn bubbles, I don't care if you can go around them, or whatever argument you guys can come up with in regards of "his beatable."

There is no point to even respond to your statements because of this right here. You don't care if there are counters to his bubbles or that he's beatable, you just want him banned. Ridiculous.

Keep him in, there are ways around his bubbles and his big combo starters are in fact slow and punishable. If they start a bubble shield then be patient and work around it, it is not impossible even if he teleports. I'm confident in the end he will remain unbanned since he won't dominate the scene. If he actually does then there will be actual evidence to ban him rather than people crying because they don't want to learn counters to something they perceive as 'cheap'.

 

[KingAce]

There is no point to even respond to your statements because of this right here. You don't care if there are counters to his bubbles or that he's beatable, you just want him banned. Ridiculous.

Keep him in, there are ways around his bubbles and his big combo starters are in fact slow and punishable. If they start a bubble shield then be patient and work around it, it is not impossible even if he teleports. I'm confident in the end he will remain unbanned since he won't dominate the scene. If he actually does then there will be actual evidence to ban him rather than people crying because they don't want to learn counters to something they perceive as 'cheap'.

My post is very clear read it fully before wasting a reply.

 

[dastrn]

If anyone thinks that we should ban a character regardless of how good or bad they are simply because they are annoying, then they are probably a scrub. Characters should be banned only in pretty significant and specific situations, and at this point it doesn't seem at all that Algol fits the criteria. He's not even high tier. He isn't getting a ton of play in tournaments. He is very beatable.

Just because bubbles suck to fight against does not make him banworthy. I say kilik's long ass staff is annoying to fight against. should we ban that too?

 

[KowtowRobinson]

I can't believe this is happening, this is like Necrid all over again haha.

BAN HIM!
Why?
HE'S STUPID!

 

[SPQR]

The fact is half the cast can't get around bubble spam and he can run down the clock with it. Keeping him in because it "adds variety" is a faulty argument when you get down to the fact that you're adding one character's worth of variety and losing half the cast worth of variety. Banning Algol leads to a more diverse environment, which is a good thing. Also, the last thing the US scene needs is a repeat of SC3. A lot of new players can look at the Algol vids up there where he's doing 100-180 damage off of easy launchers, and spamming bubbles that most of the cast doesn't have good options against, and go "Why should I play that game?" Banning him means a slightly larger playerbase which is also good for the continued survival of this game.

 

[warble]

See I think the time limit can hurt Algol as much as it can help him. He's slow up close, and has to rely on unsafe tech crouching moves like 1b to get people off his ass. So if someone can damage him early and turtle, running around bubbles, he'll have a hard time dealing damage. His only damaging low is 11a, slow and unsafe.

I don't see any reason to ban him, he's not the best in the game by a longshot.

I disagree here, defense in Soul Calibur is the most difficult aspect of the game. Learning to attack safely, how to interact with your opponent correctly and without leaving huge openings is difficult but learnable. Great defense and the ability to shut down somebody's offense, however, has never been anything like what Algol can do. The bubbles are a form of ultimate defense, one that cannot be penetrated even with parries and blocking...only with time. Thus, I conclude that the balance of the game is skewed in favor of Algol. In an un-timed environment I agree that he is completely beatable and the bubbles are merely an annoyance. In a timed environment like a tournament, however, what is an annoyance in a casual environment becomes game-ruining. That's an easy conclusion for me to reach but not one that I gladly come to. I would prefer a simple balance fix for a parried bubble moving super-sonic to smack Algol in the face really hard. Given that bubble spam as an ultimate defense doesn't seem to be getting any attention, I can't see letting him remain in the environment even at this late date.

And the argument that you can turtle all match is invalid simply because that's a ruined game right there. I think we can at least agree on that much.

 

[AM64]

My post is very clear read it fully before wasting a reply.

Okay.

I could careless if Algol dominates the scene or doesn't.
I am not voting to keep him with them damn bubbles, I don't care if you can go around them, or whatever argument you guys can come up with in regards of "his beatable."

...

If "going around them" and "whatever argument come up with" are not valid counters for Algol's bubbles, and we forced to blindly stand in place and not guard, then yes, I concede that Algol is broken. Assuming this is NOT the case, and you will allow me to make an argument, I have the following points to make:

The bubbles block the screen...And interfere with the fight. Your rebuttal.

Every attack "blocks the screen". When I play as Astaroth and used PT over and over again and my opponent punishes me with Soph's 236B4, should we ban that, too, because it "interferes with the fight"?

You sometimes cannot tell whether the bubble missed you or hit you, a stupid and annoying factor. You're rebuttal.

...

Are you really suggesting that "stupid and annoying" are reasons enough to ban a character? Seriously? I can think of at least 2 dozen moves that are "annoying" to fight against and none of them are being considered for a ban.

The bubbles stall for time...and give him advantage when time is short, he can also back dash, and teleport...YOUR REBUTTAL.

And your point is? That's like trying to ban Sophitia's 236B4 because she's better at punishing whiffs than Kilik. Every character has advantages, this just happens to be Algol's. Should X be banned from using her A+B on the ground because it can by her an extra few seconds in a match?

The bubbles are on offensive and defensive tool, that can be spammed to no end. Your Rebuttal.

GI.
8WR.
Block.
Even if you eat it, it's only 15 damage. Plenty of moves can be "spammed" (including almost every character's AA and BB) and no one is talking about banning them.

He can control the amount of room you can move in, with them damn bubbles, limiting your step at times. You're rebuttal.

See above.

Sometimes you have to choose between getting hit with Algols moves or getting hit for free dmg with the bubble, at which you will still be at disadvantage. Your rebuttal.

Sometimes you have to choose between getting hit with Mitsurugi's low moves or getting hit for free damage from his mid moves, at which you will still be at a disadvantage.

Clearly, Mitsurugi should be banned.

Okay so he has infinites...Your rebuttal.

...Really? I was under the impression that those infinites were pre-patch. Do you have any videos of these supposed infinites? Besides, if I understand your point correctly, you don't care what Algol uses, as long as he doesn't use bubbles.

SC is weapon based fighting game where 1 on 1 matches take place within a governed technical system of GIs 8Wr, spacing, TJ, TC, etc...Algol ignores a multitude of these laws, by simply hiding behind, air mines...Yes the bubble shield is just that a mine. It's distracting and annoying, irritating and not fun to play at all.

So? No one else can break both throws with A+B like the Apprentice, and no one talks about banning him. It's different. So what? If every character played exactly the same, we'd be playing Street Fighter 1. Get used to it.

If you people are telling me you can't play this Algol without hiding behind those bubbles, then you get no sympathy from me. Fights are to be conducted face to face with that respect...We accepted Abyss because his projectiles could be easily stepped like any other B move. Algol is the exception to the rule, From the sides from the front and from the back...You have to deal with multiple attacks. And the way to get around is to be patience like a nice person.That you're to do an 8Wr all the way around the bubbles, while the Algol players gladly stops creating new bubbles...because his a nice guy.

I remember a time when I first started playing Street Fighter when I was like, 12, when I thought low moves were cheap and never did them. This argument is no less absurd then than it is now.

Funny you people keep on bring up legitimate characters, like X or cass, when they no way ever altered the game. Sure they might be overpowered, but they didn't alter the way SC was played...and that's the situation with me at least in terms of Algol. If he has high dmging combos, that doesn't bother me at all, if he wins every tournament, I don't really care. As long as he does it without the bubble shield.

Every character alters the way SC is played. I can use a long range game with Siegfried against Amy but am forced to play a close range game against Astaroth because his range alters the way I play as Siegfried.


Bottom line: bubbles are different. Until I see video proof that they are game breaking, I remain unconvinced.

 

[pixel09]

I recall in this thread that someone said Japan had banned Algol. If that is the case then we must follow suit. Why you ask? If NBGi knows Japan players have banned Algol, then why will they take any effort to do anything to him in future patches? Keeping him where he is now and toning other characters. Remember, NBGi could care less what the rest of the world thinks.

I have yet to play a decent Algol to really have an opinion on ban or no ban, but I would like to hear from a JPN player on the issue of why they banned him. It's been shown in several fighting games that the JPN don't swing their ban stick around much.

 

[Serge2HOT4U]

Hate to say i told you so

this has been called on "pre day 1", the first vids my crew posted


lol
Aftertaste of 57

 

[Malice]

Why the need to ban him now? Has anyone played against someone who used Algol who did this crap and then won a tournament with him? I'm still not seeing a need to ban him, and implementing a partial ban is just silly.

Just leave him in and call it a day. There's alot of things in SC I don't like so I can choose to play another game or deal with it. If Algol starts whipping ass in tournaments across the country in a cheap, bubbly fashion, or when at least 55-60% of people are in agreement, then this topic should be revisited and then he can be banned. Right now it's only 48% who vote yes on this forum which I feel is not enough.

I'll come back to this discussion if and when more people feel the need to ban him. And shooting bubbles all day is the gayest shit ever. That right there makes for a weak ass match, but I don't see it as enough reason to ban him outright because someone can also use Algol and choose not shoot any bubbles. So ban him when he's clearly dominating the competition.

 

[tiggerkiddo]

I've also heard that Japan hasn't banned Algol. Justification for that being that Japan doesn't really care about console and is mainly about arcade, so yea. France and Domincan Republic have banned him though. I of course heard this from Team Singapore.

 

[WareEaglesDare]

I'm curious as to how Bamco is going to react to this. Hopefully they'll fix the crap that needs fixing soon instead of releasing a knee-jerk patch that gimps Algol to hell (And before anyone asks, no, I don't use Algol). Irregardless, it's pretty apparent that the bubbles are what piss people off, so they're either going to gimp the bubbles (And thus, Algol), sit back and let him get banned (Despite the fact that they could patch him), or remove them and remake Algol (Which isn't bloody likely, IMHO).

"Irregardless" is not a word my friend, it's self-contradicting. :D

Today's segment was brought to you by the letter "D".

 

[Tidus_Crescent]

No ban. Doesn't seem like he's doing much dominating, yet. Anyone know of an Algol winning any tournaments?

Lol.

http://caliburforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35262

Also heres a GF match from a tourney in poland.


Edit - Lol @ the bubble he threw at 7:16 almost hit Ivy from behind at 7:20.

 

[WareEaglesDare]

Why does it seem nobody is for just banning his infinite? That was the case with Ivy till the patch.

 

[LargeBillsONLY]

I don't think he has an infinite anymore. But I am for the banning after seeing some of the videos people have shown. Bubbles are basically free hits for Algol. He fires a slow-mo and either you block it high and immediately eat a low or a throw, or block it low and immediately eat a mid. Sidestep doesn't work - he's got the double-bubbles, remember? You might be able to GI, but then you're probably just going to take a hit anyway since GIing the bubble doesn't stop him from attacking otherwise, or teleporting behind and completely scratching that option since you won't see it coming.

Oh, and yeah.... they rebound off of walls, and their graphic is 2D to begin with, making it stupidly hard to actually tell where they are or where they're headed.

Japan didn't ban him just for fun - they did it for a reason. Look at these tournament results:
http://caliburforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=35262

If the US doesn't as well, SC4 turns into Tekken 4 - Jin or you lose.

Worse than that though, SC4 turns into who can bubble trap more effectively. Yes - SC4 becomes a game of projectiles and not weapon-based combat. If I wanted to play Megaman I'd play Megaman.

 

[WareEaglesDare]

Heh, I used Jin in Tekken 4, not very effectively though.

 

[microgamer]

Why does it seem nobody is for just banning his infinite? That was the case with Ivy till the patch.

...honestly what infinite are we referring to? The ones posted on the soulcaliburcanada YT channel? First video was v 1.02 only. The second video posted is pure shit. The semi-infinite featured in the 1.03 vid requires your opponent to stand in the corner of the Egyptian stage level; then you have to set off a +, run (or in Algol's case, casually float) in front of that bubble into the opponents face and then charge +. For the 'true infinite', Algol has to do a +, run(float) in front of it, and do a . Once again this is only in the corner of the Egyptian stage level. In any other stage you can just RO with a lot less setup, so what's problem again?

Also

JAPAN HAS NOT SOFT-BANNED ALGOL

I don't know which fucking moron started that rumor..
But Japan has not had any form of SC4 competition, or even a fairly major console session for SC4 amongst the very best players...

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