Siegfried: About User Written Guides...

Slayer_X64

Slayer_X64

Siegfried SA Moderator
Alright, since we are striving for completion of the wiki, i figure, why dont we write a few versions of character specific guides for him to add later on? While theres is definitely more than one way to play siegfriend, this will give others a general idea of not only the many ways to play him, but how to execute some of them properly, sometimes even going into an in-depth move by move basis. Adding onto this, we can also have each other point out strengths and weaknesses of each guide style, perhaps leading to a "master" guide of which we all contribute to perhaps? I will begin writing my own guide over the next week or so, and i will post it here as a rough draft to be revised. Anyone who wishes to post a guide, whether it be lurkers or the well known, are more than welcome to post them here for the time being.
 
Nice, but somehow I'm unable to edit anything now on the wiki, the edit button is not show up for me, I don't know why, & I've edited the wiki before.. :(
 
its because after several users spammed the wiki's a while back (prolly b4 i became too active...i dont remember it) and mikosu n jaxel and administrative team ect all locked them down because the edits were irrelevant or wrong...somethin along that lines. i talked to mikosu a little bit a while ago, and he seemed to consider the idea, but we have to prove that we're really going to work at it before we earn the right to edit the wiki. and even then we may have to post it through them.

tbh tho b4 we get to workin on that we should try to get just a little more done so that we have something to show. i've done a lil bit, heatons done tons, we can really thank zombie bear for his in depth exploration into frame data as well, endnow has been extremely helpful with the punishment list he made way back, you've developed some interesting ways to use certain techniques(2A ghost range?) sjarcha, stryker and others helped to lay down the foundation for us all to work off of, and every1 else has added their piece(especially the people whom i forgot to credit, you guys have done alot of important stuff). not only is this an extra step to add that 1 last bit to the wiki to show that we are serious, but it also assists newer users in getting an idea both how to use sieg properly, what move does what and how to use it, and the wide variety of exactly how to use sieg.

and if u dont wanna read all that: wiki's closed until we prove ourselves cause people were making stupid edits.
 
who's up for making a sieg guide ? i'm willing to do a bit , still too lazy to type an english essay so i'm not sure about this . but i'm willing to help any nig who needs it .
 
Jaxel said:
Wiki editing is closed to everyone except people who have earned the right to be wiki editors...
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LOL, so how could a idiotic scrub like myself earn such right to which I'm so unworthy for..? XD

Slayer_X64 said:
its because after several users spammed the wiki's a while back (prolly b4 i became too active...i dont remember it) and mikosu n jaxel and administrative team ect all locked them down because the edits were irrelevant or wrong...somethin along that lines. i talked to mikosu a little bit a while ago, and he seemed to consider the idea, but we have to prove that we're really going to work at it before we earn the right to edit the wiki. and even then we may have to post it through them.

tbh tho b4 we get to workin on that we should try to get just a little more done so that we have something to show. i've done a lil bit, heatons done tons, we can really thank zombie bear for his in depth exploration into frame data as well, endnow has been extremely helpful with the punishment list he made way back, you've developed some interesting ways to use certain techniques(2A ghost range?) sjarcha, stryker and others helped to lay down the foundation for us all to work off of, and every1 else has added their piece(especially the people whom i forgot to credit, you guys have done alot of important stuff). not only is this an extra step to add that 1 last bit to the wiki to show that we are serious, but it also assists newer users in getting an idea both how to use sieg properly, what move does what and how to use it, and the wide variety of exactly how to use sieg.
and if u dont wanna read all that: wiki's closed until we prove ourselves cause people were making stupid edits.
Click to expand...
Yeah, we've dogged Sig so deep (that sounded weird XD). I made up the "Ghost Range" name to point out which moves have collision that stretches farther than the sword's visual polygons, but someone edited-out the "Ghost Range" name, & its ok as for "Ghost Range" is no official term in 8wr & other fighting game forums.

But as for what I would add to Sig's guide if I was worthy (XD), it'll be around his Tip Range game & how is that Tip Range can defeat frames against certain characters. Anyone who has fought me before may know that I'm not a Stance Roulette Sig player. I know good Roulette tricks but I prefer basic poking action. I enjoy better when I manage to keep my opponents at my tip range during a whole match. But Tip Range fighting doesn't just consist on knowing Sig's collision range, it also depends on the opponent's character body collision range & what they are doing. Does anyone knows that some character's body collision gets bigger while they are back dashing? Not back step.

This is some info that frames can't answer, & works to counter frames & players who relay too much on frames.
 
i will likely begin writting a sieg guide as soon as i finish collecting siegs remaining frame data. we can then work on it here, as a collaborative effort. and once that is done, we can consult one of the wiki editors to add it(and maybe just add our names into the title as credits) i've already consulted some of the wiki editors about the soul crush data we found, and they have let me know that they will probably post it once 8wayrun is done its new transition. i guess we owe alot of thanks to them in advance, especially malice, whom i consulteed mainly because he was the 1 to transition over siegs frame data in the 1st place it seems...or so the editing history says. in either case, i guess we can start workin together, and they'll post it when they get the time. we could likely start with completing siegs bad matchups/anti strats guide and siegs mixups/mindgames guide, since those already have a good start on them.
 
A general Siegfried guide would surely just get contracticted by anyone who lies awake in bed at night thinking about frames. Personally I don't fancy a lecture from Ivy players (=P) so surely we would do better to make a splintered guide relating to different factors as if you ask me, Siegfried can not be made for a general guide as mind games are integral to him.
If we were to split it into safe moves, good utilisation of stance, soul gauge damage, mind games, ranges to attack, accuracy etc. Then I think we'd be onto something, but not in a typical structured guide
 
lol i was thinking of the guide not as saying: "heres how u play siegfried step by step, now follow it to the letter", but more of an introduction to siegfried, what his various tools are, how to utilise them correctly in certain situations, some good generalized anti character tactics, and examples of different ways to use him. there are soo many ways to use him that it could never possibly be covered in a general guide. think of it as creating a very strong foundation for players to reference, all compounded in 1 easy to reference place, so that they may learn the basics, and begin experimenting to develop their own style of "self taught" siegfried.
 
IMO Sig's best range from opponent is between his 1K's tip & 2A's tip. At 1K's tip range Sig has more room for using K & back stepping then punish counter most characters BB & other quick short reactions from opponent. It similar to quick whiff punishing in tekken where the dodger evades the attacker's 1st move & counters the attacker's 2nd string move. Like Sig Ks Mitsu's G at tip range, Sig backsteps & evades mitsu's 1st B of BB, then Sig 6Ks Mitsu's 2nd B of BB. This is still experimental & might fail depending on opponent's time & choice reactions vs Sig's timing & confirm. After tip range K vs G Sig can backstep & backstep more with 4B+K, or simple 4B+K'A+B after K. It also depends on the opponent's character range.

4B+K'A+B is good for regaining space while whiff punishing, it can be used often from most attacks at tip range. Another set up example: Sig 1Ks & normal hits opponent, Sig ends in disadvantage & opponent BBs, Sig GIs opponent's BB, the GI might force your opponent to do a slower attack or throw to counter Sig's GI, that might allow Sig to do 4B+K'A+B after normal hitting with 1K.

IMO Sig's best poke mix starter is 1K or 2A, why? pretty simple, neutral G: after Sig Gs vs opponent's disadvantage but safe attacks, it gives advantage to Sig, if the opponent is smart she/he will G, if the opponent is not smart or is reckless she/he will attack at disadvantage, but regardless of opponent's choice Sig's 1K is very likely to hit, more likely than mids. 1K is low damage but is good for leading or luring reaction like TJs & LowGrd. 1K (i15) on counter hit gives Sig +2 for an i13~1K, that means that after counter hitting with 1K, Sig can interrupt most i14~2As, Sig can 1K,1K,1K... against 2A friendly opponents.

Sig can 1K for an i12~6K against opponent who tries i12 or i13 moves to trade/interrupt, but another 1K after counter hitting with 1K still has more chances to hit or counter hit. If the opponent is clever she/he will might try 2G, 3GI or TJ. if opponent G2, Sig gets WS'K, B or 4K. If opponent 3GIs, Sig gets 11_77A. If opponent TJs, Sig gets 6K or 6A for right RO.

b6 & 2A are good tools together at tip range. Set Up: b6 hits tip range, 2A counter hits at tip range, 4B+K'A+B hits if opponent reacts with quick short attacks, that might promote opponent to use a slower range attack next time. Mix Up: b6 hits at tip range, 2A counter hits at tip range, opponent tries slower range attack, Sig 6K, 6A (if opponent steps) or WS'K (If opponent's range move is a TC) & counter hits opponent's slower range attack that was meant to counter Sig's set up 4B+K'A+B.
sig can also try SSH'K for this mix up. If the opponent is clever she/he will try TCs like Asta's 66K.

K is good against shaky opponents who got 6K stunned. Like for: 6K counter hits, K stun hits, then 1K, or b6 if opponent G2.
 
CH 6K is largly + on fastest SHK (+11 i think...remember reading it somewhere.) as well, giving sieg an almost free stance transition. it also creates 3B/grab mixups, lets u throw off an A+K string, get a poke, or even throw in some agA. u can even go 6 ~ 4B+K SSH A+B if you're fast enough, and throwing in the SRSH change up + grabs to make opponents duck is nice too. u cud even switch it up into chief hold for a K/B/stance cancel grab mixup, or if your opponent turtles after the SHK even try for a slower move, like 44B SBH mixup, 1B spacing mixup, or even 1A to freeze them up even more and discourage step.

NOTE: Not sure y we posted this twice jink, so i'll throw mine in here too so ppl dont get confused...lol...even tho im confused by u :p
 
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