SC5 'Ivy' Story/Possibilities/Speculation

Status
Not open for further replies.
Who say SS/CS should be in the same stance, most people know that be to strong, and want CS/SS to be in separate stances.

The damage on the other hand has been like that for the Past SC games. iCS has alway done 100 damage what is wrong with that. It is not broken or overpowered. What are you talking about no risk, there is a risk doing that throw. It is a throw it can be broken, you can only do CS in one stance.

This logic that correctly defending against an attack should yield damage close to the actual attack would just make the game boring, as people would not use high damaging option if there is a chance they can be punished for the same amount off damage. What makes people want to learn CS/SS is because the damage is much higher than normal throws. If the damage is only to be 70 or something then there is not much incentive to learn the throws.

Why should the break window be bigger. The break window is fine. The recovery on whiff seem to be the same as whiff normal throws. Maybe its harder to punish a whiff throw because the animation is unique so people react slower.

But what ever the case there is nothing wrong with the throw or their damage.

Please don't spit in this thread, it not up for discussion it is just a wish list thread. If you want to discuss this, post it on a different thread. You non-Ivy users are so arrogant with your fallacies, not knowing anything and just trying to vent your frustration....people like you are indeed mind blowing sometimes.
 
What's with the hate, Doc? Bad day? ;) CS/SS has always been like that, I don't see why they should nerf that now.

Nerfing CS/SS would mean that other command throws should be nerfed as well.
 
I don't wanna spoil your Wishlist-Thread, so I just post my ideas concerning Ivy's C-Throws here since it's on topic at the moment.

Personally, I REALLY liked the way they were in SC3. The input was ok. The speed was ok. The buffer window was great, you could even do A,B,K-Cancels if I remember well. The damage was fine as well. One SW-throw, one WP-throw, both from SE.
In SC4 we have iCS, ok, but the buffer window is shitty, they feel slower und there are no SE-throws.
In SC5 I'd gladly go without iCS (never really liked the idea of JF-Command-Throws to be honest) and CS/SS doing 80dmg, if they gave us SE-throws back and generally better setups.
 
What's with the hate, Doc? Bad day? ;) CS/SS has always been like that, I don't see why they should nerf that now.

Nerfing CS/SS would mean that other command throws should be nerfed as well.

Oh you call that hate? :P I think you havent seen me play against Dark Slayers Amy lately :)

I stated multiple times that other command throws should be nerfed, too. I absolutely dislike the whole gameplan of Asta for example, didnt we already discuss this once? I think we did.

Common look at Elis list:

Asking for 100 DMG Command throws with HUGE buffer windows (As in SC3), in addition he wants them to be FASTER, cause they "feel" slow to him, he wants to take away the "flash" which is an indicator for the opponent,which again is a buff, and then in addition he wants both of them accesible from SE and SP? So how many Buffs are those? four? five?

This is absolutely laughable. Its such a joke i dont even know what to respond to his answer, since he didnt get it at all. RIGHT now its OK, since the options are limited, the buffer windows are small etc...still people land it from time to time... but after buffing the SHIT out of this move any player with a brain can tell this will be a huge problem...

Looking at his list it seems like iCS is really bad in this game^^

EDIT: Lol i just realized he even wants to BUFF the damage of SS in comparison to SC4...i really should just stop to read this forum, 8wayrun is turning me into a hater :P
 
I took the time and read the whole "Wishes"-Thread and there are some very generous changes that make me wish that Xianghua tought her daughter her whole SC3 moveset. :P

I really don't wanna enumerate all the changes that I don't agree with except this one:

  • CS/SS should be more necessary for Ivy

Hell no.
For me Ivy has always been a character who is fun to play because she can be played so differently. I really don't want Namco to focus more on her C-Throws. Yeah, I know, you always feel confident when you land them, but if you wanna play a JF-Throw-dependant character, you have Astaroth (and his JF-C-Throws could be nerfed, too).
Let her have her C-Throws, make them stronger than normal throws, but don't exaggerate. Imo her C-Throws should be a plus, but not a must nor a part of her "basics".

And I forget to mention in my last post that the break window (especially for iCS) is much too short in SC4. All Command Throws should have the same break window, but in SC4 I think it's 5 frames?! That's a little too much.
 
Kalas you are just too bad. 5 Frames break window is quote: "just fine", you are way too slow. Now go learn the game cause you dont know shit about Ivy, thats the only reason you lose to her. Dont come into this arena if you dont know shit about Ivy. Same goes to the whole fucking country of france who all together tries to beat this character since 1,5 years. You are all too bad and dont know Ivy. Now go away with your arrogant fallacies.
 
lol, that was my best tourney match ever. I love it!

I agree CS/SS was powerful in SC3 (range, i15 etc) but it was one of the very few good things she had to keep up with the damage of other characters. The rest was pretty shitty, she had no damage on NH at all. So in a nutshell her command throws did not make her a great character despite them being extremely good.

Right now we can only speculate but to me it seems that:'
- SC3 buffer is back
- CS is back but does less damage, also it has SS startup animation which means less range than in past games
- SS itself is gone, and you can only do it using the meter to change normal throw into SS, also does small damage ~65

And no, I don't want SC3 "model" (Ivy CS/SS dependent) back. For CS/SS I only want different animation, new input and speed dependent JF, not timing. I could care less about the damage =/
 
That game indeed was amazing, i need to send this to NEO, im sure he deleted this out of his brain. Somebody needs to remind him :P

And yeah i think we agree on the topic, i'll just leave it here, dont want to destroy peoples illusions...
 
Well, the idea of the wishlist was to give Namco 5 random ideas that they could use for SC5. By no means it was an intruction to create a god tier character :)

I'm convinced that they have been reading us way before the wishlist was made - in the videos I noticed a lot of things that we begged for in the SCIV Ivy SA (5hit JF GB, neckgrab AT etc)
 
Asking for 100 DMG Command throws with HUGE buffer windows (As in SC3), in addition he wants them to be FASTER, cause they "feel" slow to him, he wants to take away the "flash" which is an indicator for the opponent,which again is a buff, and then in addition he wants both of them accesible from SE and SP? So how many Buffs are those? four? five?

EDIT: Lol i just realized he even wants to BUFF the damage of SS in comparison to SC4...i really should just stop to read this forum, 8wayrun is turning me into a hater :P

Ha you really think those buff are so powerful that they will make her broken. I can understand the SE and SP one, but yea your reading way to much in to this. The only thing that is laughable is your weak passive aggressive insults.

SS was 90 damage in previous version I don't see why it would be such a terrible thing for it to be 90 again. I think it was 80 damage in SC4 because Ivy mids were very strong. So I rather have SS do 90 damage and have her mid tone down in damage.

Maybe it just you think I am asking for damage from attack and combos to be like they were in SC4. But I not asking for that. I want her throw game to be more prominent for SC5 and her her damage from combos/attacks nerfed.

I also wouldn't say your a hater, just a another ill informed scrub :P

Hell no.
For me Ivy has always been a character who is fun to play because she can be played so differently. I really don't want Namco to focus more on her C-Throws. Yeah, I know, you always feel confident when you land them, but if you wanna play a JF-Throw-dependant character, you have Astaroth (and his JF-C-Throws could be nerfed, too).
Let her have her C-Throws, make them stronger than normal throws, but don't exaggerate. Imo her C-Throws should be a plus, but not a must nor a part of her "basics".

Well that your opinion which is fine and I have mine. Neither are wrong or right, but for me I would like her gameplay to be more focused on the throws.
 
Sure i did not criticize the idea of the wishlist. But you dont see me in the Setsuka Arena begging for mindblowing buffs to a character which is already extremely strong. Some people want Setsukas Step to be a lot better and i stated multiple times that she will be way to strong in combination with her current whiff punishment. People whine about balance all day and then post stuff like that.

Some people are just absolutely unable to reflect their ideas and suggestions when it comes to their own character, so i hope Namco doesnt read too much of this stuff :) Seeing this is also common among players that are considered good and have some authority here just is really weird to me. Im not even sure if those people acutally do want a balanced game. Ivy is so extremely dominating, people train and train against her and then Eli has the guts to basically tell those people to GTFO because we dont know shit. Acting like Ivy players are all godtier players and the rest is just too dumb to win against her. Then calling me arrogant. Really dont know what to say there anymore.
 
At first I was laughing at the thought of CS being more powerful, but then Eli emphasized he just thinks Ivy should be more throw-based in nature, which is okay if everything else is weaker by comparison. Maybe you two were reading each other wrong!
 
At first I was laughing at the thought of CS being more powerful, but then Eli emphasized he just thinks Ivy should be more throw-based in nature, which is okay if everything else is weaker by comparison. Maybe you two were reading each other wrong!

No i dont think so, maybe you should read his original post here and then judge for yourself which point is a buff and which is a nerf. I stopped when i counted 20 buffs to 2 nerfs...maybe somebody else needs to tell him its completely nuts since im a scrub :)

http://8wayrun.com/threads/official-8wr-scv-ivy-whishlist.7742/

EDIT: My final result was 30:5 buffs to nerfs and a few neutral. Im open to discuss this :P
 
doc: Looking at it that way I can see what you mean. But then again, I know he prefers SC3 Ivy as well and she wasn't as beastly. Also, I don't think any good player would want their character to be so good knowing that other characters can't compete either. So I was pointing out the attitude between you guys, not so much the technicalities of the game.
 
Yeah maybe i read to much into this.

A player who is interested in balance maybe would point out that 2A+K is way to safe for a anti step, super Tech Crouch low that does so much damage + gives wakeup.. Its incredible hard to punish with JF Umbrella in fact due to the short blockstun, while other -15 moves are easily punished from neutral. So i would either keep the blockstun and make it -18 or keep it -15 and make it easier to punish.

What do Ivy players do? Ivy players ask for it to be available from every stance. Thats it^^ No nerf needed. I just hope Namco doesnt read those wishlists, but as Ring pointed out i think they do :)

I really dont know where this Ivy hate comes from today, lol. I didnt even touch the game since EBO :P
 
We all want balance, but not every move should be balanced to have equal risk/reward ratio. Imagine Setsuka and her 33B being -16 on block for instance. In my opinion every character should have a few really good tools, "staple moves" (or spammable moves :P). With SG gone, Ivy's not gonna be as scary anymore. I really wonder how she turns out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom