8WR MAY XBL D.E. & SWISS TOURNAMENTS - THERMIDOR & ALPHAKEG WIN!

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Man oh man, what has happened here...

I REALLY do not like what I'm seeing between Benny_Blanco and AlphaKEG aka Krispy Ice101... Doesn't seem like this was handled with much respect at all. I've played Krispy on several occasions, and never had issues with him and lag. So let me get this straight, there was some laggy matches when it counted, Krispy backed out, didn't want to play under it, Benny Blanco said "Now or never" for the most part; and since Krispy didn't oblige, Benny took the set since he was already one game up?

I can understand why Wombat had to give him the set but...

I just don't feel like that is a good look. Is the deadline for that round already over? Is there anyway we could schedule another match between them (both players willing of course), and have me there to spectate / record to see who really (if anyone) was generating the lag? I mean, if one person is dropping from 4 to 1-2 bar mid match, and the other person has a stable connection, I think we would know what the issue is...

I just am pretty sad I'm seeing Krispy get the short end of the stick here. I don't know the guy personally or anything, but I know he's a good player, and he seems like a nice enough guy...So it's a shame to see a match being stolen from him.


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Also, to anyone who might be wondering: I still am available to spectate / record any matches, to avoid this kind of conflict. I think it helps having a third neutral person there to monitor things. There would be no question if anybody was tampering with connections on their end, because I could see the fluctuations of connections myself, mid match.

Also, I think if it's proven that someone IS fluctuating heavily connection wise, that the match should be instantly ruled out...if the opposing player wants. And if two players can't find a way to get a decently stable connection, then they really don't have any business partaking in an online tournament, imo...

That's just my two cents though. >.>
 
Lag sucks, but it's online. It's unavoidable. If we start rescheduling and ruling stuff out every time there's a lag spike the tournament matches will take forever. A coin flip when you can't connect is one thing. Playing out a full set then saying "We should do a coin flip." Uh... No.

This is why online tournaments are just for fun and not serious business like a real life tournament.

Also the bars one sees during a match are relative to your connection with the other players. What may be a 3 bar to one player could be a 4 bar to the people playing etc. It's not a reliable metric while spectating.
 
Marginal,

The point was, if somebody was system tampering, or if there was blatant lag on one of the parties, that would be noticeable while spectating. It's not like everything would be okie-dokie in any world where both players started out as a 4bar with me, and then one specifically dropped to a 1-2 mid match, you know? That would show there's something wrong, any way you slice it.

I agree that if you start taking time to handle these things, it could end up taking a while; but consider the alternative: if these kind of things go unchecked, you're going to have a lot of unhappy players, and the whole thing could go south.

Just some food for thought. Nobody wants to play on a 2bar connection, and I think everybody can agree the matches are not worth playing, if joe-random thinks it's ok to play while he's got 10torrents running and a couple game downloads, you know?

I know it's something you have to deal with in an online setting...but I just wish there was a better way for us to *deal* with it.
 
Well Benny_Blanco went on a vacation of some sort over the weekend and will be back on Tuesday May29th when the results are due. I am willing to try again on that day with him up 1-0 and FahrosTTTT spectating. If he agrees of course.

Now as with UnseenWombat.....
UnseenWombat said:
....regardless of how hard it was to play, or how hard or ungentlemanly "he/she" exploited the lag
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This alone makes absolutely no sense. I am sorry I don't see anything right with what you just said. Playing through extreme lag should not be forced in any way. Having a difficult fight with another good player with a stable is one thing. Having a difficult fight with another good player due to an unstable connection is another. Two completely different things.


Marginal said:
Playing out a full set then saying "We should do a coin flip." Uh... No.
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We didn't play out a full set. I would never play out a full set under the circumstances that had happened with Benny_Blanco. However, I do agree with you about playing the whole set thing though. Under no circumstances should anyone play a full set and insist on a coin toss.


Another bone to pick Benny_Blanco. Your claim on the second fight where you assume I "quit" because you got a perfect on me is uncalled for. I do not "quit" and would not do so in a competitive tournament setting if the reason behind it were false. Now if you want to continue to treat me like a random ranked match player who quits because he/she can't handle a loss then that's fine. But taking a set because your opponent will not participate in unplayable connection setting is going overboard.
 
This alone makes absolutely no sense. I am sorry I don't see anything right with what you just said. Playing through extreme lag should not be forced in any way. Having a difficult fight with another good player with a stable is one thing. Having a difficult fight with another good player due to an unstable connection is another. Two completely different things.
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Lag is the nature of the beast. At some point, you just have to wade through.

I personally don't really like the alternatives being proposed. If someone's not liking how a match is going, the door's wide open for them to cry lag and force perpetual abortive rematches until they get the result they want.THat's not helping anyone have a good time either.

It's not unlike SC2 Regionals in CO. They had a very odd arcade cabinet (they had the buttons and sticks at a ~45 degree angle from the screen) at the Aurora Tilt and the sticks sucked. Couldn't do much but limp through.

Chugging through lag is what it is. It's not a super serious tournament and it's double elim.

If someone is getting by choosing Maxi, flipping a lagswitch and mashing B, that won't carry them far even in lag. (Just counterpick Pyrrha and mash B.) If there's evidence of them doing something like that, don't let them enter future tournaments.
 
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Fahros, I didn't call it for benny because he was one game up. They had played through one full set based on what Alpha said. The first two games were "good", then the lag got bad, and according to Alpha, benny started abusing it to win the next two games, winning him the match 3 to 1. Then alpha said, no that didn't count, we have to redo it. And benny played one more game with him, won, and then alpha backed out entirely. (That is what happened, correct guys? Or now alpha is saying no. Please explain what did happen if that's not it.) I don't particularly like exploiting lag either. It's unsportsmanlike, ungentlemanly, and un-everything nice. But while the right thing to do is to back off and wait for it to subside, can we really force them to? I want our tournaments to be as legitimate as possible, but lag is unavoidable sometimes.

Perhaps the best thing to do if you're caught in a match where it's lagging so bad you don't want to play it is to not get up after the first KND and make the opponent ground hit you to death, then back in the lobby say you protest that match. But if you play your hardest and try to out-lag-tactic the other guy and get out-lagged yourself, I don't think you can really complain then after the fact that you lost. You made an unspoken acceptance of the conditions and agreed that you were gonna fight through it when you played hard the whole way through.
 
UnseenWombat said:
Fahros, I didn't call it for benny because he was one game up. They had played through one full set based on what Alpha said. The first two games were "good", then the lag got bad, and according to Alpha, benny started abusing it to win the next two games, putting him up 3 to 1. (That is what happened, correct guys?) I don't particularly like that either. It's unsportsmanlike, ungentlemanly, and un-everything nice. But while the right thing to do is to back off and wait for it to subside, can we really force them to? I want our tournaments to be as legitimate as possible, but lag is unavoidable sometimes.

Perhaps the best thing to do if you're caught in a match where it's lagging so bad you don't want to play it is to not get up after the first KND and make the opponent ground hit you to death, then back in the lobby say you protest that match. But if you play your hardest and try to out-lag-tactic the other guy and get out-lagged yourself, I don't think you can really complain then after the fact that you lost. You made an unspoken acceptance of the conditions and agreed that you were gonna fight through it when you played hard the whole way through.
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No we didn't even get through half of a set(best of 5). We finished 1 full match with the 1st two rounds going smoothly and the rest going down hill and staying there. We still have yet to actually finish the entire set. So out of 5 matches he's got one if you wish to count it as his. If not, then he hasn't won a match and neither have I. So it'd look like this......

If you DO wish to grant him the win then it'll look like this:

Benny: Game 1(W) Benny: Game 2(N/A) Benny: Game 3(N/A) Benny: Game 4(N/A) Benny: Game 5(N/A)
Alpha: Game 1(L) Alpha: Game 2(N/A) Alpha: Game 3(N/A) Alpha: Game 4(N/A) Alpha: Game 5(N/A)

If you DO NOT wish to grant him the win then it'll look like this:

Benny: Game 1(N/A) Benny: Game 2(N/A) Benny: Game 3(N/A) Benny: Game 4(N/A) Benny: Game 5(N/A)
Alpha: Game 1(N/A) Alpha: Game 2(N/A) Alpha: Game 3(N/A) Alpha: Game 4(N/A) Alpha: Game 5(N/A)


This is why I suggested the following:
I) Try again on Tuesday May 29th when he returns with FahrosTTTT as a spectator. Whether we start fresh is up to you.
II) If the same problem persists then we leave the the private player match lobby, contact you and have you(UnseenWombat) flip a coin to decide the winner.
 
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Alright. I did misunderstand. We're using different words for set, match, round and game. So benny won 1 game and in that game only 2 of the rounds were any good. Correct? In that case you still haven't finished the set and should play it to completion. For reasons I explained before, benny is up 1 game to 0. I think having me or Fahros there to officiate would be best.

Try to do it Tuesday if you can. Because of memorial day, I'll give you a couple extra days if it's impossible, but please try.

I'm really not trying to send anyone up the river here. I want to do what's fair by everyone. I don't want to have to flip a coin, but if whoever officiates agrees the lag is unplayable, I guess I'll have to.
 
UnseenWombat said:
Alright. I did misunderstand. We're using different words for set, match, round and game. So benny won 1 game and in that game only 2 of the rounds were any good. Correct? In that case you still haven't finished the set and should play it to completion. For reasons I explained before, benny is up 1 game to 0. I think having me or Fahros there to officiate would be best.

Try to do it Tuesday if you can. Because of memorial day, I'll give you a couple extra days if it's impossible, but please try.

I'm really not trying to send anyone up the river here. I want to do what's fair by everyone. I don't want to have to flip a coin, but if whoever officiates agrees the lag is unplayable, I guess I'll have to.
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Alrighty then! I'll send him a PM on both XBL and 8WR to let him know the situation. Thank you for taking the time to help us clear up the situation.
 
I'm going to resign from both tournaments, a lot is going on atm because I'm moving out of state soon. I'll see if I can get in next month.
 
I'll play in Solo's spot LOL. Just kidding, I would however love another shot after getting destroyed by the twin killers of Thermidor & LordSturm. Good luck to those guys going forward!
 
I'll play in Solo's spot LOL. Just kidding, I would however love another shot after getting destroyed by the twin killers of Thermidor & LordSturm. Good luck to those guys going forward!
 
Haha, thanks man, they were some fun games :) We both gotta level up for the next tourney and stay in winners longer!
 
Ok everyone. Sounds good to me. All I ever wanted out of this was that 1 win he refused to honor and to continue the series. If anyone wants to spectate that's completely fine.
 
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