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Heaton
A Soul in the Purgatory
Discuss the Astaroth match-up here. A guide can be found here, and the string defense guide can be found here.
[MATCH-UP] Astaroth
- Thread starter Heaton
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TheGuy
[09] Warrior
I think that vs. Astaroth the matchup is 70:30 in Astaroths favor. He is just so unpunishable and long ranged.
I think you're exaggerating. Astaroth may have the advantage but he has plenty of weaknesses and is very vulnerable to whiff punishment. Yeah he has more range but Raph is faster with better mixups and can win the ranged poking game against him.
Anyway, it's been a while since I've hung around here...might as well contribute to this.
Astaroth is one of the typical big dudes that are slow but has scary weapon and grab range and does huge amounts of damage. He wants to psychologically weaken you, make you block everything, and eventually move in and start grabbing. It's just how he is, a grappler and one who forces you to guess. Yes, he has a bunch of other moves but if he uses those to beat you, it'll take him forever.
That last sentence from the first paragraph is key to facing him. Raph has a good speed/range ratio which allows him to stay out of Astaroth's grabbing range but still whiff punish Astaroth's axe swings. At this range, Astaroth has 0 mixups, is quite vulnerable to Raph's 236B and 66B whiff punishes, and can't easily out-zone the fencer. If Astaroth does get close, start your 2K and wrB spam. Not much he can do about it. Then move back and watch what he does and continue your usual whiff punishing and other mixups. Don't panic and start block everything and you should be okay.
His 22B and 66K can be a nuisance, but the former is steppable and the latter Prep crusher can be circumvented as well. Avoid throwing out too many verticals carelessly because his 22B BE can half life you. He can't necessarily abuse Bullrush on Raph because he can't really tell whether he entered Prep. If he guesses wrong and you JG his Bullrush, Raph gets a free 66B punish. In other cases, 66K can be quickstepped and then punished with 22B. Same applies to his 22B. There are a couple other moves to watch out for but they are all high or mid. 44A is relatively east to 4A+B gi as you look for the lightning, 1AA is 66B punishable, and you should be able to see and step the second hit of 1AB.
Lastly, don't get up immediately if you get knocked down. If you aren't stunned, Astaroth will probably not grab you on the ground but try to whack you with his axe. Just roll and wait and you should be able to block what would have done a lot of damage.
Astaroth is one of the typical big dudes that are slow but has scary weapon and grab range and does huge amounts of damage. He wants to psychologically weaken you, make you block everything, and eventually move in and start grabbing. It's just how he is, a grappler and one who forces you to guess. Yes, he has a bunch of other moves but if he uses those to beat you, it'll take him forever.
That last sentence from the first paragraph is key to facing him. Raph has a good speed/range ratio which allows him to stay out of Astaroth's grabbing range but still whiff punish Astaroth's axe swings. At this range, Astaroth has 0 mixups, is quite vulnerable to Raph's 236B and 66B whiff punishes, and can't easily out-zone the fencer. If Astaroth does get close, start your 2K and wrB spam. Not much he can do about it. Then move back and watch what he does and continue your usual whiff punishing and other mixups. Don't panic and start block everything and you should be okay.
His 22B and 66K can be a nuisance, but the former is steppable and the latter Prep crusher can be circumvented as well. Avoid throwing out too many verticals carelessly because his 22B BE can half life you. He can't necessarily abuse Bullrush on Raph because he can't really tell whether he entered Prep. If he guesses wrong and you JG his Bullrush, Raph gets a free 66B punish. In other cases, 66K can be quickstepped and then punished with 22B. Same applies to his 22B. There are a couple other moves to watch out for but they are all high or mid. 44A is relatively east to 4A+B gi as you look for the lightning, 1AA is 66B punishable, and you should be able to see and step the second hit of 1AB.
Lastly, don't get up immediately if you get knocked down. If you aren't stunned, Astaroth will probably not grab you on the ground but try to whack you with his axe. Just roll and wait and you should be able to block what would have done a lot of damage.
Slade
[14] Master
Astaroth can get a free crouch throw attempt to "punish" blocked 2K, so be ready to break throws when kicking his ankles. Also, abuse the fuck out of 236B against him. It does enough damage to stuff 66K BE's revenge armor, it closes gaps extremely well, and is safe on block against Astaroth. Just be sure to avoid getting greedy with them or you'll run the risk of eating 22B BE for half of your life.
Something else to consider is that some players might look at this matchup and think "Astaroth has plenty of slow, reactable moves. This is a perfect opportunity to land Raphael's aGIs and look awesome!". Avoid this pitfall, because you'll get better damage through conventional counters and look like less of a retard if you make the wrong guess. Well-timed B+K on 22B BE = gdlk 20 damage evasion punish. Poorly timed B+K on 22B BE = free 110 for Astaroth.
Oh, and one last thing: avoid entering Prep against Astaroth. Seriously, it just isn't worth it, even if you are getting into SE. His brave edges hurt too much to risk gambling against with Prep and he won't get strong punishes on Prep moves without the entrance.
Something else to consider is that some players might look at this matchup and think "Astaroth has plenty of slow, reactable moves. This is a perfect opportunity to land Raphael's aGIs and look awesome!". Avoid this pitfall, because you'll get better damage through conventional counters and look like less of a retard if you make the wrong guess. Well-timed B+K on 22B BE = gdlk 20 damage evasion punish. Poorly timed B+K on 22B BE = free 110 for Astaroth.
Oh, and one last thing: avoid entering Prep against Astaroth. Seriously, it just isn't worth it, even if you are getting into SE. His brave edges hurt too much to risk gambling against with Prep and he won't get strong punishes on Prep moves without the entrance.
arceus462
[10] Knight
I am an astaroth player myself and even though he has reach, if someone is able to out speed him and close the gap he is pretty much finished. he litterly has only 4 mix-ups, THATS IT. The thing with astaroth is that you have to condition you opponent to fall for your grab mix-ups. Sure he can dish out damage, but what is the point of having strength if there is nothing to hit?
Yeah almost forgot that.
You forgot that Raph gets a free CE after successful B+K but I get you.
I agree. Don't force Prep in this matchup. It'll make Raph's life easier lol. Do use 66B and 3B though. Just don't enter Prep and he can't punish you. Raph should be inflicting damage mostly from 236B, 2K/wrB, 66B Prep A+B, 22B, and other pokes.
I forgot to add that it is a good strategy to attack Astaroth at minor disadvantage since he has few frame traps. 3A works well when he is in your face, as in the case of a blocked bullrush. If you are good enough, you can interrupt often and when he is backdashing with 6BB BE.