Matching Forward Step

DrakeAldan

Follow the rules!
I've been playing Street Fighter as of late, and learning various things about the game. I was watching a video by Juicebox on footsies, and he said something interesting- basically, if you step forward when the opponent does and interrupt him, you can negate his range advantage. Or, rather, short-ranged attacks become more viable.

It made sense, but it seemed odd to me that I hadn't thought of it before. I feel like I should be fairly strong in footsies, since... well, I'm coming from Soul Calibur where the whole game is spacing. I thought I'd test this principle to see if it worked here.


Sure enough...

And apparently this works with other moves, too.


The way this seems to work, is... basically, when both players step forward, the distance between them is reduced dramatically (read: twice).


You can see here how Ezio ends up in AA range. There's interesting implications from this.


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So, from what I can tell...

- Pick a short-range move that you'd like to extend the range of. Something that's good, but just happens to be out of reach most of the time.

Like...

Pat - 1B
ZWEI - 4B ~ BE
Ezio - 1K, 6B, 3B, 1BBB
Raph - 33K BE, 66A+G
Viola - 3B
Maxi - 6A+B, 4BB
Yoshimitsu - 3B
Astaroth - Command throws
Algol - 6BBB
Omega - 4B (Difficult 'cause it's slow!)

You can probably think of more applications than I can.

The slower the move you use, the more open you leave yourself/the harder it is to time correctly.

- Read your opponent's habits. When you get the feeling that they want to step forward, step forward before they do and throw out your attack. If you did it right they should run face-first into it.

Most moves will work with this; BB (neutrals), 3B (unidirectionals), and 66/33B (forward-facing 8WR moves). You can use other 8WR moves, but rolling from 6 adds time to your attack, and you're trying to land it early.

Tapping G to cancel your forward step might help with inputs. e.g., 6~G~6B.

You will probably land CH doing this, but I wouldn't count on it.

There seems to be a lot of ways this can go wrong.

You need:

- your opponent to step forward.

- your opponent to step forward and attack. (They can run-up guard, step, GI...)

- your opponent not to react to your forward step.

- correct timing.

If they just stand there and attack from one spot, then... you won't be able to get in. If you guess wrong, you'll step forward, attack... and whiff. Oops...

I suppose you could stand outside of their range, wait for them to step closer to try to hit you, and then do it.

To top it off everything might fail horribly because this is a weapons-based game, and you can attack at a distance while keeping yourself relatively safe...

---

I began to wonder why I never learned or picked up on this before... It looks pretty obvious!
I think it's because I never really had to.

There are lots of good "keepout" moves in the game, such as Pat's 66B... 66 moves in particular have built-in forward movement, so I suppose I had been doing it and not noticing. (I love my sudden run-up 66K.)

It also seems like a bit of a hassle. If I predicted a forward step and I was playing Omega, for example, I'd just toss DNS B out. Ranged attacks and basic keepout seem better than putting yourself in harm's way for an interception... so I don't know how useful this would be.

I guess you could apply the principle to longer-ranged moves, but then we're talking about playing fullscreen.
Who does that?

I'm sure a few people around here probably knew this already... Maybe?
 

Marginal

Chikara Sashimi
This is further encouraged in SCV since forward step G doesn't bear the movement penalties of the other steps.
 
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AndyrooSC

IVE WAITED FOR THIS!!!
@Zane
This got me thinking about ZWEIs footsie game. ZWEI has alot of move where the range of his faster moves can just fall short and using this can give our pokes that extra range and chance of hitting which will improve ZWEIs poke game.

Some examples i can think of -
4B (like Drake said) - and being able to hit confirm it into BE.
6B - Dat frame advantage.
AA/BB/(B)
and extended range with possible bigger reward with-
6A
A+B
66B
66A+B.
 

Zane

Spirit of the Wolf
@Zane
This got me thinking about ZWEIs footsie game. ZWEI has alot of move where the range of his faster moves can just fall short and using this can give our pokes that extra range and chance of hitting which will improve ZWEIs poke game.

Some examples i can think of -
4B (like Drake said) - and being able to hit confirm it into BE.
6B - Dat frame advantage.
AA/BB/(B)
and extended range with possible bigger reward with-
6A
A+B
66B
66A+B.
I'm finding this very helpful with the B/(B)/A/(A) variations. If you think about it, 6~ B+K can be given more range here as well
 

Signia

[13] Hero
Interesting this thread was bumped, but I started doing this after watching Juicebox's footsies video, too. However, the way Drake suggests to apply it in Soul Calbur is incorrect, in my opinion, though this probably has a lot to do with the fact the Pat isn't a great character to do this with, and is actually a great character to do this against.

The ideal move archetypes to this with are safe short range counter hit moves and safe mid range pokes that are difficult to whiff punish. The slow, short range, easy-to-whiff punish moves that Drake listed are the wrong moves to use here, as if your opponent doesn't run in, you may be whiff punished without them doing anything to force your whiff. The unsafe moves he listed are foolish for the same reason but also because passive opponents might see you move forward and block on reaction. CH moves and pokes are what you want, as they won't likely get hit just while running forward unless it's a fast poke, they'll just block on reaction, and it won't be safe to use unless it's safe on block or difficult to whiff punish. If they're coming in with an attack, the poke will work but a CH would be more rewarding.

It also helps if your character has a fast forward dash, since this allows you to change your position more between their decision to aim their attack where you were standing and the time it takes for them to position for that. As a Yoshimitsu player I used this strategy to great effect since I had the best tool for the job: dash-in iMCF. 33B and bA were also reasonable choices, but it turned out that dash speed and attack speed always up for iMCF's lack of range, it was almost never whiff punished, and if blocked I always had options. I could hang outside their range, run forward and iMCF at the timing for which I predicted their approach, and I was mostly only punished for this if I ran into a move or if the move was stepped at close range. If was running into moves, I could simply wait and whiff punish, and if the opponent was stepping or playing passive, I could sweep them. Fast basic pokes on reaction to them running in deterred a wider range of options more safely. I later learned that this mix was better than always just running in and trying to rush down all the time.

The best characters to use this strategy against are the ones that throw their body forward with their attacks. Even if your move has less range, if it connects with them while they're moving forward and winding up an attack, it'll beat it out. Similarly, with a fast poke, which are moves that tend to not move you very far forward, you can use the relatively long distance between your body hitbox and the end of your attack hitbox to compete with a move that has more total range but leaves the body more exposed. This is similar to the concept of "priority" or "disjointedness," but in a 3D game with fewer hit frames this just means you are putting yourself at less risk to be counterhitted than your opponent because you're ideally attacking from a position that requires them to start their move late enough that lets you poke them as they come in (it's hard to describe).

Sometimes you want to think about targeting specific moves or sets of moves to CH or poke out against, as moves may expose themselves uniquely as in Juicebox's video with Bison's standing medium kick. Pat's 66B in particular heavily exposes his front leg, meaning there's a long period of time where he may be hit by relatively short range low-hitting moves before the move comes out. Note that I say "low-hitting" -- not just lows work here, but mids that hit low down. To troll bad Pat players who attacked at predictable timings I would just 2K as they came in with that move and 66A (which makes him run really far forward before he attacks and exposes his whole body). Even Yoshi's stubby little 2K worked, and other characters probably had better tools for this.
 

shen11a1

[08] Mercenary
Footsies:
  • you walk forward and soon as you walk forward I'll walk back and punish on prediction wiff with a poke, launch, knockdown etc.
  • You walk back I walk forward, you walk forward I walk back etc... no one wants to take a risk I walk forward to take a risk to poke my opponent.
  • You hold your ground by being neutral dont let your opponent inn zone the day lights out of em and walk forward if they dont respect your space let em know what's up
  • Sit there inn your spot and dont move let em know your not moving say this myspace and if they attacking you while your blocking wait for them to walk up an try to hit you soon as u feel em get close enough Bam CH the lights out of them step forward again keep swinging till they block
  • If you walk in there range inch your way inn dont attack right away or u might get CH yourself and if u want to get close quarters CH/poking is the way...What if I told you there's more
  • Run up and block wait too see what happens sometimes you have to carry your space with you he blocks walk up at tip range keep taging him on block and delay your pokes till they get frustrated walk back knockdown
  • If they walk forward in a particular spot that they always step in to attack you, you hit em with a CH and step forward rinse repeat
  • If they turtle take a few steps inn till they in a corner keep using frame traps and leave little gaps between to get a reaction and you can shimmy, grab,mids,highs etc..
  • Dont always attack right away and dont always keep throwing pokes out there. unless, your certain you will get a counter hit from pressuring them, by being patient, conditoning them to throw a move just by walking forward, and block.
  • Also walk forward and walk back out there kill zone...however please dont walk back in there face by having predictable movement remember ! Backstep = -20
  • when u walk in there space and counter hit, try to look for predictable step inns and CH.
  • Sometimes, you have to walk forward, you cant sit still all day dont be afraid to walk foward take a chance
  • Dont be predictble while picking a spot to wait inn be patient, and dont press nothing, just hang around out there kill zone a sec walkback and forward is footsies 101 counter poke/ pressure/ hitconfirm etc...
  • To apply pressure with footsies is to be passive walk up and poke at a distance till you get inn by delaying a poke, if, he/she blocks it dont follow up with a move, it can be AA,BB or whatever it has to be a safe string to follow up but before that make sure it connects than continue the combo/or mix up that's hit confirming
 
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shen11a1

[08] Mercenary
Footsies can be applied to any fighting game. Footsies is about timing and precison. Its not about who can press the most buttons and who can always hit someone. Its about when to press buttons, when not to press buttons, when and where to press buttons and why ? In other words, knowing the purpose of a move. This is to encourage new and old players alike and not to discourage anyone nor to show disrespect. Thank you guys for your hard work.