New to SC, not to FG's

S_O_F-TYM

S_O_F-TYM

[08] Mercenary
Greetings.

I picked up SC5 while buying Injustice and I must say this game is hella fun with great mechanics. MK9 was the first fighting game I decided to learn properly, I got that game because I liked to play MK2/MK3 as a kid and as a teenager at my friends' on some emulators. I switched to Tekken when TTT2 came out and haven't touched MK9 since. A PSN buddy of mine convinced me that SCV is very accessible and doesn't have as much bullshit as Tekken does, at first I was skeptical, but I decided to give this game a try on a casual level, but now I find myself doing what I do with Tekken which is looking at frame data and using the record function to test optimal punishes and counterpoke setups and what not hahaa, good thing for now I have the time to explore and worry less about real life stuff.

I generally like to play whiff/block punishing/CH fishing/Keep-out/zoning/baiting style of play and pick characters that have the most appropriate tools for this sort of playstyle (MK9: Smoke/Kano/Sektor and others, Tekken: Heihachi/Kazuya/Bruce/Bryan). I try to play safe/solid and look to condition my opponent into pressing buttons and watch their habits and blow them up with whiff punishes and CH's when I make a read and commit to something. I do take calculated risks with characters who have poor safe options (high risk/high reward) and play offensively when I need to, but my default gameplan is to start on the defensive. The way I see it, if my opponent is willing to hand me the match by pressing buttons and constantly moving forward and constantly going for YOLO 50/50's then all I need to do is evade/block and punish. Nightmare's character design instantly caught my eye when starting to play the game and I picked him as my first character to play and I have also picked up Mitsurugi to cover a different approach to the game.

I am looking to add some European PS3 players as friends on PSN. This game has great netcode like TTT2 and while I whole-heartedly enjoy both games I feel it keeps things fresh when switching between these 2 awesome Namco titles.
 
Well, hello there! Mitsu and Nightmare are both great characters to learn the game, though given the way you play you may also like Patroklos, Aeon, and Ezio.

Enjoy your stay!
 
I haven't gone through the entire casts movelists yet, or even played vs all the cast yet. I haven't even unlocked Algol lol. I can accept the fact that Nightmare requires precision and patience and handles 0 range poorly, given his other tools suit my playstyle. Mitsurugi was a "pick up and start winning" for me. I have been able to pick up this game fairly painlessly, nothing seems overwhelming or stupid/OP.

Something that rustled my jimmies about the rest of the cast however was Alpha Pat's 99_33B or whatever the notation was and him having access to that move without resorting to 8WR by just pressing 236 into 3B. A lightning fast mid launcher with hella range that is only -11 on block with push back, that move is about as stupid as Lars' uf4 in Tekken. If someone isn't sidestepping he can just repeatedly throw it out to condition opponents to step and then just come in with a horizontal. No risk with all that reward. This is just my initial glance though, so I hope people won't starting flaming me how I am a scrub and how A. Pat requires "mad skillz" to play.
 
If you're leaning more toward NM i suggest getting his spacing tools down and whiff punishing. For spacing master aGa, other spacing tools would be 22a, 3a, 66a, and even 66b. For whiff punishing you generally want to use 3b and aGa. NM can be surprisingly annoying up close (depending on the MU). 3k (i15), 1k (i15), 6k (i14), 66k (i15), k (i13), and ofcourse grabs. His grabs are on the weaker side but his "grab game" is pretty good. He has probably the 2nd biggest grab range of the cast and he also has low grabs (can be blocked tho). Mix up his throws and low throws with WR b for your 50/50. He's pretty unsafe and on the slower side but he's great at spacing and has top tier damage. Oh and learn his wall combos...

Enjoy your stay :)
 
S_O_F-TYM said:
Something that rustled my jimmies about the rest of the cast however was Alpha Pat's 99_33B or whatever the notation was and him having access to that move without resorting to 8WR by just pressing 236 into 3B. A lightning fast mid launcher with hella range that is only -11 on block with push back, that move is about as stupid as Lars' uf4 in Tekken. If someone isn't sidestepping he can just repeatedly throw it out to condition opponents to step and then just come in with a horizontal. No risk with all that reward. This is just my initial glance though, so I hope people won't starting flaming me how I am a scrub and how A. Pat requires "mad skillz" to play.
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Nah, we all agree that 33B is strong. You seem to have the right ideas. Game is balanced really well aside from a few odd ball moves. Which are not all that difficult to deal with since the mechanics and damage give everyone a fair chance to win.

Hope you continue to enjoy the game, and find 8way helpful.
 
I find Mitsurugi's entire moveset is useful in one situation or another. Even his unsafe moves have decent risk/reward to throw out occasionally, although I feel he doesn't even need to take risks to win. When it comes to 3D FG's I really don't believe in the "just don't ever use that move, you have better moves" mentality. I tried to practice finding a reasonable and practical use for most moves my characters have in Tekken and I have been able to do so without eating counterhits, but at this point I just can't see myself landing Nightmare's moves like 4A, 66B or 88_22K on any solid players. I do hope I can find a way to land these, safe launcher is safe, but these are all a bit slow to land in the neutral game and I feel would require a sophisticated setup to land.

EDIT: BTW, is just frame AGA worth learning? I don't even know how to theoretically get the jf. I play on a standard ps3 pad with the default control scheme. I can do regular AGA consistently.
 
4A is pretty garbage, but 66B is a good move and 88_22K has uses. 66B is often used in Oki and post-gi situations, and after NSs A+B you can mix it with GS B and get some really good damage.

88K can be used to punish predicted verticals into 4KK for wall splats/ROs. With the inherent risk of step in SCV its common for players to use moves this slow and completely commit to their side step punishes.

JF AGA isnt critcal to NM, but better frames and damage are obviously nice. Im sure NM's Soul Arena has a topic on performing it, and it's not frowned on to change your button layout around here.
 
What is funny about the Tekken community is that pad players who don't use claw grip and use 2+3 and 1+4 binds on the triggers are considered scrubs by some of the OG players lol. There aren't many people who can execute Mishimas on a pad (not saying I can to the fullest extent) but I have put up a shitload of hours into practicing EWGF, wavedashing and basic movement in that game. What is good about this game is I don't have to grind the practice mode so much just to be able to play the game on a basic level.

It's going to take some time to get adjusted to using the slower moves and getting a feel of the recovery of moves on whiff. I have been using NM's 88_22B for evading verticals and punishing counterpokes, but I need to find a way to use 88_22K.
 
Pretty much what Kvasir said but i'll add on. You want to be using 66B for its great gaurd damage, its +2 on gaurd so you can set up some frame traps depending on the MU. Its best used in oki and in combos but you can throw it out at neutral it tracks enough to discourge stepping but you can bet hit out of it.

88_22k has uses but it has whiffing issues, your better off using 3B imo you can get similar damage, ringout and wall hit opportunities aswell.

iaGa is worth learning but not necessary. Its actually a frame slower thn aGa (i15), iaGa (i16). iaGa does more damage with a chance of clean hit and breaks gaurd.
 
I guess I'll have to learn how to land 66B from neutral, but if my opponent is not respecting my options and trying to get in, I feel I am better off checking them with AGA/6A/3BB. Picking up Mitsurugi was easy after I got accustomed to his optimum range after a few matches. My main offence with NM has been to check people with 1k and see how they react and step or back dash into 3B/AGA/88_22B or jump B over 2A counter pokes on a read.
 
S_O_F-TYM said:
EDIT: BTW, is just frame AGA worth learning? I don't even know how to theoretically get the jf. I play on a standard ps3 pad with the default control scheme. I can do regular AGA consistently.
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siegfried player here.

http://8wayrun.com/threads/aga-discussion.14058/

there is a thread with tutorials on how to agA. in general, it is not super necessary, but a little extra damage is always good, and it is always worth going for. if you have a solid agA you have nothing to lose by attempting the just version.
 
I actually decided to start practicing AGA just today and trying to get the JF. I realized I was never gonna get the just frame by pressing A into A+G pretty quickly so I decided to try to replace the A+G bind with just A on L1. After some experimenting I decided that I am gonna use the default control scheme as sliding from A to G and immediately pressing R2 or A+B+K after pressing G feels the most natural way of doing it. I try to think of it as A slide into G and "meter burning/EXing" the G. I started getting it 1/4 times after an hour and got used to getting the regular AGA every time.

Something I am curious is how big the frame gap is when going from G to A? I am starting to think the gap for pressing A after A~G is 2 or 3 frames.
 
agA is not A~G A, it is a: g :A. i think some wonderful person tested it, but i would not be able to find it. i am also not completely sure of differences between night and sieg. ultimately you are somewhere within the right ball park on frames, though.

i am glad you found something that works for you. i had to tape my fingers and slide across three buttons on stick to get it - i was 95% accurate, but it hurt. switched to hitbox because of it.
 
I am glad his JF is not as crucial as say EWGF to Mishimas or Bryan's taunt follow-ups. I think I am just gonna play this game in vs mode and learn it the "old fashioned way" which is playing actual matches and not sweating too much about movelists/frames/optimum punishes. If something particularly annoys me about a certain character or I find myself getting blown up repeatedly by the same moves I'll hop on the training mode and look at the frame data and see how to deal with them. I have been enjoying this game as soon as I picked it up and have been ever since, not always the case with Tekken as that game is just a never ending project of figuring things out. In SCV there are not so many NCC's and delayable strings and + on block moves or strings with an alternate 50/50 ender, stances and crush moves and all that BS that just seems never ending sometimes.

BTW. here are some matches between me and @Temjiin. I am the Mitsurugi in the armor costume. It's always kinda embarrassing to watch myself play on recorded streams and matches as I see my mistakes and just facepalm lol.


 
ah, yes tekken is that way. soul calibur does not have as much of an entry barrier. very newcomer friendly.

i understand the hate for being recorded, i narrowly escaped being on stream at the last tourney i was at. your mitsurugi looks like you have put in some good work so far. looks like you need to play more to get a better feel for matchups, though. speaking of which, mitsu mirrors are silly as hell.

most characters, except cervy and apat, can do well without their just frames. in general, getting the just is just a bonus.
 
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