Punishment Thread

piggy

piggy

RIP Team Edward
I started this a while ago, but have had to take a quick break from it cause things at work picked up a bit the past few weeks (and I've had a few tournies wasting my east saturdays at work). In any case, I went through the wiki (mostly) and took note of what all moves can be punished with what by Raph. This kind of knowledge is really good to know and is what will help make us all better players.

NOTE - this has not been tested (since I don't own the game)...I simply went through the wiki and used the data there (so if moves have special unlisted properties, I haven't checked this out...simply if a move leaves you at enough advantage to hit...so 2K on block which may RC, won't necessarily be able to be punished, since another 2K would duck 6BB...).

I'm only using a certain amount of punishers:

i13 - 6BB_
i16 - 3B_ / BB / AA (for frame advantage)
i17 - 33KB / Throw (?)
i20 - 236B / 6_2_8B+K (if off axis)
i22 - 4

(I'll add more when I have more time, or if y'all wanna throw some info in, I'll add it to the OP)
Hopefully this makes everyone more aware:



ALGOL:

i13 Punishable-
aB
4A
6K
2K / FC K
4K
6B+K
8A+K
66A
66B

i16 -
6A
3A
6BBB
3B_BB
4B
6KK
A+B
BT A+B
11A

i17 -
6AAB
3AA
1A
1K
8B+K
2A+K
66BA
QI B+K

i20 -
623AB
BT 2K
QI K

i22 -
623B


AMY-

i13-
6BB236
3B
FC 3B
4KK
WS K
2A+B
FCA+B
44A
44AB
A+B A
A+K A

i16-
6BBB
4B
1K
6A+B
4B+KB
236B_BB_BBBBB_BBBBBBB
236KK

i17-
4A
1B
FC 1B
2B+K
FCA+BA
44B

i20-
1A
66B+K
236A

i22-
6A+B236

ASTAROTH

i13-
6A
3A
1A
214A
B
6K
2K
4K
33A
22A
11A
11B
11BK

i16-
1B
1K
WS K
6B+K
44A

i17-
6AB
2A
FC A
4KK
66A
66AB

i20-
1[A]A
BT 2K
A+B
2A+B
4A+B
11[A]A
22B4

i22-

CASSANDRA

i13 -
2B
4BB
FC 1B
6K
2K
8A+B K
B+K
22A
66A+B

i16 -
AK
A~K
3A
4A
3B
4B
FC 3B
1K
4A+K
236
236AB

i17 -
3AK
3A~K
1A
3K
B+K B
4B+K
33K
66B+KAB
66B+KAK
236B
236A

i20 -
JMP K


i22 -
2BB_BBK



CERVANTES

wiki info severely lacking...went through his frame data thread (weak sauce)

i13-
6
3B
1B
8B
2A+B
2B+K
66A
22A
66B
44B
11K

i16 -
BB
1K
44aB

i17 -
aB
3AB
1A
WS A
BBB
6BB
WS BB
421kB
A+B
6A+B B
6A+B:B
8A+B
2[B+K]
11AA
44aBB
66A+B
GDR

i20 -
214A+K

i22 -
421K
FC A+B
iGDR

Darth Vader

i13 -
3B
1B
4A+B
2B+K
4B+K
11AB
33B

i16 -
44B+K

i17 -
B+KBB
66B
44B

i20 -
BT 2K

i22 -

(damn this no-double posting to reserve space...weak)
 
this is important

im thinking about sticking

think you could tell us which move is our best option instead of i13 ect ect?

good job though
 
I did, at the top of the post I list a handful of moves that are useful in each frame category
 
I like this thread, especially if we can compile ways for him to get some consistent 6B's on hit against the cast. Let's get to work on some of this.
 
Punishment questions concerning our favorite pretty boy vampire.

1)What does it take to get the final hit guaranteed off 6BBB besides CH? If a move is -19 for instance, if I WANTED to do 6BBB, would the final hit go through?

2) 33KB i17? Does this include the transition from standing to 8wayrun? I just got a feeling this move is slower then this and punishing something -17 with this is going to be difficult.

3) Using the B+K series(not VE, the needle) as punishment, How do you guys go with the 3B prep combo off it? The stun of the needle is SO SMALL AND QUICK, it reminds me of 6A CH, I can't figure out how to prep rushdown off of it because it's so small of a window.
 
BelovedChild said:
Punishment questions concerning our favorite pretty boy vampire.

1)What does it take to get the final hit guaranteed off 6BBB besides CH? If a move is -19 for instance, if I WANTED to do 6BBB, would the final hit go through?

2) 33KB i17? Does this include the transition from standing to 8wayrun? I just got a feeling this move is slower then this and punishing something -17 with this is going to be difficult.

3) Using the B+K series(not VE, the needle) as punishment, How do you guys go with the 3B prep combo off it? The stun of the needle is SO SMALL AND QUICK, it reminds me of 6A CH, I can't figure out how to prep rushdown off of it because it's so small of a window.
Click to expand...

1) nope..only way is either the opponant doesn't guard, or tries to step/counter attack because they expect you to do 6BB, then something else. Just remember when you punish with 6BB..you have options to do 6B and even 6BBB, so while the raw damage isn't as high, in terms of punishment it can shift momentum to raph real quick.

2) it's a little difficult, but if you time your buffering right, it should be a perfect i17. Obviously you can do this from crouch too, as it's a better punish than wrB on NH

3)It's small, and online i've whiffed the 3 .. maybe you'll like A+BA better or something..but the 3 combo is optimal.
 
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