Regarding FSAK

[Chickenwing]

MAvericks420: you make TX look back, then again...you ARE a Mavericks fan. Stop posting.

Oof: being a hypocrite makes you look bad, stop posting.

Mick: you're still trash. <3

ShadowG & Krayzie - Calm down...don't get yourself worked up with idiots on the forums.

Idle - again, great idea, flawed system, the only thing left to do is to move on and improve. It isn't like it can't EVER be used again. Think of it like buffing some flaws and nerfing some exploits. I know you know it isn't hard.

Malice - Keep the hype alive.

Long story short, you morons are fighting over nonsense. Most of you i've addressed. Yes, i wasn't there, so i don't know EVERYTHING. However, this thread alone is the reason why people are quitting. Get over yourselves and move on.

Whoazz - you fucked up. you manned up and apologized. Don't do it again. Please....kthxbai

Other than that....i'm continuing to expand my games and move on because after this, i cancelled my plans for NEC. I personally don't want to deal with a community that acts like this after every tournament. Hmmmmm, then again, every tournament I'VE been to people tend to enjoy themselves. (devastation, QuakeCon)

 

[Chickenwing]

well....since mavericksfan pointed out a typo....

and he's not manly enough to post it on here. I'll help him. what i MEANT to type is "look bad" not "look back" oh well...i'm still saying what i'm saying Mavericks....

stop posting. You're idiocy entertains us, but yet it annoys us as well...and forgive my lack of knowing how to spell every word in the english/urban dictonary much less have a 100% accuracy for typing...oops....my bad.

Such childish behavior....lol

 

[Marginal]

People, understand something here. I do not think what happened at FSAK was right. But I do believe that the way this thread has done nothing but hurt a community that is already on the ledge. So with that in mind, I will ask all those out there who have posted into this thread, look at what this thread has done. Read all of it if needed. Then ask yourself, was this all really necessary? Could this have been handled a different way? What has been done is done and there is nothing we all can do to change that past. All we can do is make sure that it can be prevented in the future. So with that in mind, I will leave this thread and hope that everyone here take a couple of minutes to realize what has happened.

Nobody's being banned for life for cheating. Nobody's talking about new rules of formats to prevent shit like this from happening again. Pretending the hole in the bow isn't there doesn't stop the water from sinking the ship.

Come on this "lulz it always happens, and I did out of fierce love for my coast" is pure trash. People might have quit if some non-existent title was taken overseas? WTF?

Want to hurt the community? Drive away talent. Give new players less incentive to get involved. How do you do that? FIX TOURNAMENTS!

 

[Drave2117]

Think about that, to fix this issue, how do you do it? Some of these deals are made way before the time of a tourney which means the people who are running the tourney have no idea what’s going on before it’s too late. Take NEC; that happens in a couple of months. What can you do to stop me from asking Ramon, DK, and Jaxel to help me win one? They are friends of mine. The worst part is that you won’t even know until someone says something. This is not something that can be fixed as easy as people think you can. As people have mentioned, different people are motivated differently. This means that if Ramon likes Rum, and is willing to hook me up, I can supply him the Rum he wants, and not you nor anyone one else would know the difference. . If Ramon is the better man, then he would tell me to fuck off and earn my wins. (Ramon, thanks for letting me use you as an example, even if I didn’t ask you. Lol.)

The point of that example is so show that this is not something that can be easily fixed. To fix any issue, you need to fully understand it. The problem is that how do you control the people who are in the tournament? How can you ensure that people will be honest about the results? From what I understand, the T/Os take the word of the people who report it. So unless you run the tourney on one TV with one T/O watching the match, you really can’t control it. Even with this being the scenario, you cannot assume that player 1 and player 2 did not come to an agreement before hand on who would win if they had to fight each other. So in an essence, you cannot control this at all, which means you have to play with the honor system and hope that all the people will adhere to it.

Now, my first post in this thread was to help people understand that a lot of this can be handled in a fashion where the impact to the community is reduced. That is all. Right now, the community is looking for a new game. To have it, you need to support the current game; otherwise you give a reason on why the new game does not need to be made. This whole thread was made to enlighten people on what happened at FSAK that was wrong. There was nothing wrong in that, just that the outcome of this thread will reflect the community as a whole and not towards the individuals that it was originally pointed at. This hurt’s the community overall, and does not help support it.

Now I stopped playing SC since my job really does not give me much time to play anything now. But that is why I do what I can to help support the community. If people want my help, from driving them to the train station to helping running a tourney, I will do it because that is something that I can do to move the scene in a positive direction and that is what is needed right now.

 

[Marginal]

The problem is that how do you control the people who are in the tournament? How can you ensure that people will be honest about the results?

1) Make a rule stating it's against the rules to collude on match outcomes.
2) Ban players who collude. On the spot, or from future tournaments if evidence comes to light after the tournament. Raise their level of concern.

If there's a negative consequence for pissing in the community's face, then most normal people will think twice about doing so. There is no consequene now, and even though the fact it happens DAMAGES the community further, the only solution that's been floated so far is, "Do nothing. Just keep it quiet." (Which makes a damaging element the defacto standard.)

Saying it's difficult to enforce doesn't magically make it unenforceable. The other players obviously notice shady stuff happening too, it's not all on the TO's to police the community.

You want the scene to move in a positive direction, you gotta do something to make it move in a direction that isn't self destructive. Saying "Let it pass. Complaining about cheating (not the cheating itself) hurts the community too much!" Is not a solution.

 

[KingAce]

Please Marginal, there's nothing that can be done about throwing a match. End of story(Well it should be.)

It doesn't matter what community you run to, SSF4, tekken, BB, MvC hell even starcraft, that shit happens and will continue happening. If people want to leave because of that it's out of our hands...In my opinion they need to get real.

And throwing a match isn't cheating, why is it cheating exactly? In the circumstances of FGs it's anything but cheating. You as an individual just need to get better. No one is denying you your chance for victory as long as you put it in your hands to achieve it.

Rigging brackets on the other hand...

 

[Drave2117]

When rules are made, they tempt people into figuring out how much then can bend the rules before they break.

I understand, and i agree with you, but issue still remains that even if you do place that type of rule/rules into effect, the problem still exists. All you did was throw a road block in front of the issue and now you are hoping that this will deter the person/persons from just crashing into or going around the road block.. This is why i made that example before. You can place the rules, but only hope that all will follow it. Unless there is concrete evidence of foul play, you will always have the whole he said/ she said issue which now becomes a problem as well. The reason why is that depending on who the person is, they can either persuade the masses to side with them, or have the people, in on the deal, to make it look like they did nothing wrong. Now that has just divided the community because both sides will be heard, and then people will make their own judgments. This can be both good or bad depending on the scenario that is presented.

The best part about this thread has been that one party admitted, and has apologized for the wrong he did. Now let me ask you this? With the rules you placed as examples: Would you ban him because of what he did? Would you give him a second chance because he is sincere about his apology? Would you make him be the example of what happens if you break the rules? Would you be the one to make it clear that this community no longer tolerates mistakes and that once you broke the rules you are now the black sheep of the community?

Some people are only into the tournaments for the money bro, others for the fun and the challenge. Those people, who are greedy will always try to find a way to by-pass the rules and since humans are greedy creatures by nature it will happen.

 

[BABY]

http://m.youtube.com/index?desktop_uri=/&gl=US#/watch?xl=xl_blazer&v=Y9JMy2l9J7c

Can we get off this and move forward. Woahhzz or SU don't owe anyone an apology. You guys are worse than females, do I need to get y'all something for cramps or pads? It amazes me that you all as a community is not trying to get better to prevent shit like this.

Woahhzz quit apologizing, nothing is going to change history and this will always be brought up. This is a video game and many of these guys hobby. You know one of the things that made me stronger as a player, the forum lawyers...lol. They pushed me to a level of invisibility because they pissed me off so much. U can look at this one of two ways, how ungrateful these mofos are for me winning by any means necessary to keep the crown in our country or they turned their back on me for showing the US is still a threat in calibur, now I'm going to fuck anyone up that crosses my path that's not in my circle(the road I took). Again quit apologizing your a young man that's going to make mistakes good and bad, also there is nothing you can do to make everyone happy. You everyone in the world a millions dollars and someone will have negative to say to you and/or try to rob you. In essence fuck what they think and prepare for future tourneys. Look at the link and tell me what's going on two caliburs later.

SU quit apologizing too. You have the most haters in the community you should have the biggest smile on your face because you got the last laugh after all and you helped your friend. If it was RTD and myself in the same situation what u think we would have done? You are Woahhzz are friends so fuck it, it happened and will go down in history. Look at RTD and my evo moment it resurfaced in this thread not in a negative way but it came up again 6 years later. Think about it.

The only person I somewhat feel bad for is malek. Vengence shall be yours at whatever US tourney you show up at. NEC will not be a good idea because I will be there, there is no way you or scud will beat me. Xiang vs Ivy 6-4 X my favor.

Of most of the people posting in the thread about banning SU and Woahhzz and not supporting tourny anymore, how of you go to tourneys? Let's start a poll in this very thread if it's possible. How of you(besides oof) dogging these guys out been to more tourneys than me(2 majors 1 local) in sc4? I rest my case.

 

[Malice]

You can't stop collusion. You can't stop people from throwing matches. And no matter what rules you make, people will find ways around them.

I wanted to post something a long time ago, but with everyone quick to make their voice heard and not patient enough to listen what people had to say, I just decided to wait and see what everyone else had to say.

First, do people honestly feel that Woahhzz cheated? I don't condone what happen. I wish he would have just whipped ass like he was doing through the duration of the entire tournament and would have done to Something-Unique since he was playing like crap at the time, but it's easy for me to say that since I am not in that situation nor am I a broke ass college student. So he took the path that others have done at tournaments when put in such a situation is that they take the route of the least risk by using collusion.

If there was no collusion in tournaments, then I would be upset by this, but I can't when it happens at every tournament and started well before my time. But now more people are aware that it happens.

I would have been upset if SU actually tried to win in that situation since his position wasn't going to change. Or if Woahhzz and SU played and SU won but then said Woahhzz won, that would have been cheating right there. Instead, they decided to not play out a match through collusion. But the results would have been the same regardless. Do people really want a joke match to be played out in that situation? Why even go through the charade since people will see the match is clearly thrown anyway?

No one wanted France to win. Malek was sitting behind me rooting his ass off for RTD to beat Woahhzz like a hater and he knew the situation once Woahhzz prevailed. Now that he's said his piece and Woahhzz has apologized, why are we still continuing with this thread? What more do people want? What do people who weren't at FSAK or haven't been to a tournament yet for this game want?

It is a shame that an awesome tournament such as FSAK is uglied by this situation, but it shouldn't now that apologies have been made. What we should do is learn and grow from this and do better for the next event. I'm just not expecting anything to change dramatically because friends will still help each other out when in a situation to do so and it would be stupid for me to expect anything different.

I'm upset that people couldn't discuss this without drama. When I saw people saying that they were boycotting NEC before people who were effected had a chance to post and dumping on an entire community based on the responses of the few, I didn't like that. I don't see why we have to go to such extremes anytime a situation comes up, but it's good to see things have worked themselves out.

I would have quit Calibur if Woahhzz was no longer going to play. Thank goodness that I don't have to because I love this community. We can't afford to lose anyone else in this community, but we also can't afford to keep destroying each other when something happens. Was what happened bad? Yes, but people were blowing this up way beyond what it should have.

I do hope that what happened doesn't deter people from traveling. But collusion is going to happen because this community is small and people are friends with each other. It's just more apparent in this situation because of the format of the tournament.

But I really hope that we don't have to resort to destroying the community and going to the extreme anytime a situation comes up. This issue could have been handled alot better by everyone, including myself.

And nothing else is going to come about with the continuation of this thread now that people have apologized, so I am going back to playing Calibur. Hope you guys do the same. I'll see y'all at either Jaxel's or NEC. Hopefully both.