Run Counters in SCVI

Party Wolf

Party Wolf

Administrator
In this game it seems that it is variable for a backstep to get a run counter property. My theory is that they have removed the ability for a vertical to cause a run counter.


Instances where there is a run counter:

0:35 0:46 4:08 4:35

No run counter:

0:42 2:19 2:53 4:00 8:32

The only thing that counters this theory is that at one point Sophitia's BB run counters mitsurugi when he steps the first hit and gets clipped by the second hit at around 8:09. Thoughts?
 
Considering the moment at 8:09 and the instances where verticals don't cause a run counter my current theory is that each character will have a handful of attacks with a run counter property, similar to Tekken 7 where only certain moves can crush.

I hope run counter is removed entirely before launch, but if it stays in I hope other mechanics balance it in a way so that movement is a viable and rewarding strategy at all levels of play.
 
SC2 had run counter and people liked the movement just fine. In SC6, there seems to be a less inclusive run counter than the one in SC2. Don't worry, it'll be okay.
 
If I remember correctly run counter in SCII just gave increased damage on the hit but didn't produce the stagger state allowing for large combos like SCV did correct? From the PSX gameplay video at times it seems like the SCV run counter was being used, which worries me a bit.
 
Javan said:
what is a run counter
Click to expand...

When you hit someone while they are moving. There have always been run counters in SC, but in most titles they just provided bonus damage. In V a run counter produced a stagger allowing for a follow up combo, it really discouraged movement, particularly at high levels. It seems the run counter system from V is present in VI to some extent.
 
Have they removed quick step? Or is that still in? Really hope 22 88 moves can be combed again without the pointless delay.
 
Last edited:
I think the ability to instantly guard during movement causes a lot of the run counter fear to be dispelled.

Now is that ability actually confirmed? I dunno, I'm just some dude on the internet.
 
As someone who mained Raphael, I don't really mind rampant running being made to have consequences. It sucked getting heavily outplayed by people who knew next to nothing about his moveset barring "it's just a bunch of verticals lel".
 
Ofc you should have horizontal combostarters, and ofc there should be risk to movement. What's the deal with all the SC2 fanboys flooding the discussion all of a sudden?
 
Punchdrunk said:
Ofc you should have horizontal combostarters, and ofc there should be risk to movement. What's the deal with all the SC2 fanboys flooding the discussion all of a sudden?
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone is arguing that there shouldn't be risk to movement, there is just a group of us who feel tracking moves provides enough of a risk to balance movement. It's not really a SC2 thing specifically but the fact that in SCV at higher levels of competition movement was almost nonexistent. Go watch some of the old SCV evo matches on youtube.

From what we have seen I think the game looks great, I'm excited for it, and I'll support it regardless of run counter. I just happen to find movement in SC really fun and one of the things that makes it unique so I hope it is just more viable in VI than it was in V.
 
Discoprophet said:
in SCV at higher levels of competition movement was almost nonexistent. Go watch some of the old SCV evo matches on youtube.
Click to expand...
That's just not true, and EVO is an awful example. Footage from a few months into the game is not very indicative of what the meta actually becomes. Movement was still a necessary tool in the game that people obviously used all the time.

Not trying to defend movement being unsafe, though. throw that shit in the trash can
 
linkorz said:
That's just not true, and EVO is an awful example. Footage from a few months into the game is not very indicative of what the meta actually becomes. Movement was still a necessary tool in the game that people obviously used all the time.

Not trying to defend movement being unsafe, though. throw that shit in the trash can
Click to expand...

Fair enough, I did not stick with SCV long enough to know what the meta ended up evolving into so I should perhaps not comment on that game.
 
Punchdrunk said:
Ofc you should have horizontal combostarters, and ofc there should be risk to movement. What's the deal with all the SC2 fanboys flooding the discussion all of a sudden?
Click to expand...
Why are you overreacting and calling people SCII fanboys when there is no fanboyism of the sort? Why do you attribute peoples dislike of SCV run counters to SCII fanboyism? Please grow up.

And who even said there shouldn't be a risk to movement? You're exaggerating to prove your point, what we're discussing is the level of reward. Bonus damage, frame advantage and knockdown (and actually getting hit) have always been enough of a punish for having your sidesteps read. This isn't a 2D game; we shouldn't dissuade people too much when it comes to 3D movement.
 
Generally, I don't see anything wrong with running counters as long as you can guard while doing so. But I can see the issue with it.
If running back and forth and get hit with horizontal attack and got a counter states, than that will hinder movement. Running side ways and get hit with a vertical and got a counter states, it is also the same thing. But revers the situation where a horizontal attack cause counter to side walk and vertical attack causes counter to straight forward walk, I have no issue with that.
 
I really don't see a problem with it, but then I'm a Raph player and we're always starving for ways to kill mindless running around.

Frankly I think it needs to be in the game, but it doesn't need to be used by all characters. Just Raph, really.
 
Shin_Zakira said:
Generally, I don't see anything wrong with running counters as long as you can guard while doing so. But I can see the issue with it.
If running back and forth and get hit with horizontal attack and got a counter states, than that will hinder movement. Running side ways and get hit with a vertical and got a counter states, it is also the same thing. But revers the situation where a horizontal attack cause counter to side walk and vertical attack causes counter to straight forward walk, I have no issue with that.
Click to expand...
You don't get CH from forward movement, for sure.

ReturnToPlanetX said:
Why are you overreacting and calling people SCII fanboys when there is no fanboyism of the sort? Why do you attribute peoples dislike of SCV run counters to SCII fanboyism? Please grow up.

And who even said there shouldn't be a risk to movement? You're exaggerating to prove your point, what we're discussing is the level of reward. Bonus damage, frame advantage and knockdown (and actually getting hit) have always been enough of a punish for having your sidesteps read. This isn't a 2D game; we shouldn't dissuade people too much when it comes to 3D movement.
Click to expand...
Are you sure? What if the damage from horizontals was lower than verticals, as they are in every SC? How do you do know that it's CH among all things that will dissuade movement past your preference? If they just gave you all the CH properties from horizontals on NH, would that be fine?

No, as you said, what matters is the level of reward. CH is just one variable affecting that.
 
Signia said:
You don't get CH from forward movement, for sure.


Are you sure? What if the damage from horizontals was lower than verticals, as they are in every SC? How do you do know that it's CH among all things that will dissuade movement past your preference? If they just gave you all the CH properties from horizontals on NH, would that be fine?

No, as you said, what matters is the level of reward. CH is just one variable affecting that.
Click to expand...

Erm, I think you misunderstood. We're not talking about CH as a whole, we're talking about CH's punishing side steps with a full combo.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back