Ivy Frame Data discussion

Last couple in this post:

Jumping Attacks
While Jumping A - i29, -12, 4, TJ
While Jumping B - i18, -15, 4, TJ
While Jumping K, i26, -6, KND, RO, TJ

Self Notes: Too bad while jumping B lost its CH properties, but it -is- safer than 4 and actually has positive frames on hit. Not bad for an i18. Jumping 7B can make this safer as well.

Throws (I will just list the frames here and any special property they might have)
Normal throw - i17, 13 frames escape
CS - i18, Clean Hit C, 85 damage as a back throw (normal back throw does 70), 9 frames escape
iCS - i18, Clean Hit B, 94 damage as a back throw, 9 frames escape

Self Notes: So that's why iCS is worth it. Clean hit B would mean that this more easily hits over 100 damage as a throw.

CS does 75 base damage, iCS 84 base damage as an FYI. If both clean hit, CS would do 90~ damage, while iCS does 101~ damage.

Back Turned Attacks
BT A - i15, -6, 8
BT FC A - i15, -6, 8
BT B - i17, -6, 4
BT 2B - i18, -8, 2
BT K - i15, -8, 2
BT 2K - i17, -14, -4
BT B+K - i32, -18, 12, Guard Burst 13, aGI all, ends in BT
BT 2B+K - i27, -6, KND, Guard Burst 10

Self Notes: BT B+K is better and worse in a sense than its WR counterpart. It gives +12 on hit, but is far less safe on block. Granted, Ivy has very few moves that innately go BT, but still.

BT 2K... why did they murder you so? :( Looks like BT A and 2A are her best BT attacks.

Brave Edge
6b8 BE - i12, -22, -8, RO* no clue how this RO's if the opponent is just standing
6b8 BE (enemy airborne) - i12, RO, Clean Hit C
1B BE - i16, +12, STN (or 16 if blocked), BA, NC
99_66_33 B BE - i17, -3, 11, Guard Burst 9, NC, LNC on CH
22_88 B BE - i16, 12, KND, Guard Burst 7, BA, NC, ends in BT
SS - i17, 13 frames to break, Clean Hit C

Self notes: 1B BE at i16 is a decent punished and unless your opp has mastered JG-ing/aGI-ing/reacting properly to it, is a decent guaranteed damage setup as well.

I really want to see if there are any more 66 B BE setups to find.

I thought SS was harder to break, I guess the fact that you glow gold makes it even easier to break than a normal A+G. It does have clean hit C though.

I feel that 22_88 B BE has properties no one has really capitalized on yet.

CE
236236 A+B+K - i26, KND, opp cannot crouch by i22

Self Notes: Interesting, so un-reactable by i22? Meaning this should technically be guaranteed post GI and anything equal or above -22. For 90 damage, finding those moves is probably worth our while.
 
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We will need to re-check this data because there seem to be some typos.

WS B is not +10 on block. It's +10 on hit.
7_8_9B is negative on hit (-4)
5-hit JF is at least +10 on guard

Funny, the game itself said that "A+G,A+B+K is a command throw and is difficult to throw escape" while it has 13 frame escape window, like normal throws. What the hell? And the next part is even funnier "Crush the opponent's guard by using it after 66[A]" which is 0 on hit. Yes, fantastic strategy.

iCS does 106 dmg with clean hit. So maybe Clean Hit A,B,C does different damage?
 
Ring said:
We will need to re-check this data because there seem to be some typos.

WS B is not +10 on block. It's +10 on hit.
7_8_9B is negative on hit (-4)
5-hit JF is at least +10 on guard

Funny, the game itself said that "A+G,A+B+K is a command throw and is difficult to throw escape" while it has 13 frame escape window, like normal throws. What the hell? And the next part is even funnier "Crush the opponent's guard by using it after 66[A]" which is 0 on hit. Yes, fantastic strategy.

iCS does 106 dmg with clean hit. So maybe Clean Hit A,B,C does different damage?
Click to expand...

No, the damage numbers I put up are just estimates I calculated myself without going into the game. Guide says around 20% damage boost for clean hit. However, what the guide is sure of is that C, B and A differ in probability.
 
Can't wait until the final frame data gets put up like in the PO boards. I'm really interested in learning this character, but not knowing which string to go with and proper frame data is killing me. She's definitely more weird to play then expected.
 
Ring said:
We will need to re-check this data because there seem to be some typos.

WS B is not +10 on block. It's +10 on hit.
7_8_9B is negative on hit (-4)
5-hit JF is at least +10 on guard

Funny, the game itself said that "A+G,A+B+K is a command throw and is difficult to throw escape" while it has 13 frame escape window, like normal throws. What the hell? And the next part is even funnier "Crush the opponent's guard by using it after 66[A]" which is 0 on hit. Yes, fantastic strategy.

iCS does 106 dmg with clean hit. So maybe Clean Hit A,B,C does different damage?
Click to expand...

Ring, can we get a list of 'questionable' items to test once we migrate this to the stickied thread? That way we can get a final correct list out.
 
Alright lemme see if I actually understand this stuff. In the guide it says that her B+K is -2 on block, does that mean that it has a slight disadvantage but is more or less safe?
 
I've been playing around with that 6AK. This move is great with opponent back against the wall...will beat out all AA's if you follow with 2A giving an 8 advantage. Cannot beat Pyrrahs BB, but for some reason 214B can be pulled off in certain circumstances. I've been experimenting with 6AK(-2..H,H), 2A(hit +8..s-low), WR A+B,A(M,H,H...NC on counter)...problem is that all can be blocked high. The animation of the 2A special low may cause a crouching block or maybe hit then the games can begin....just really digging tryin to find something with her.....
 
2B at tip range WRB beats out A LOT of things. Still testing things out though. I seem to be having a lot of success poking with her, getting close and using her arsenal of FC and WR moves. Like 2A to WR A works a lot, though damage is minimal. Or either 2A, 2B to WR A+B then 4B are just good things to be able to do to swing a round. Low damage but quick and sets up things that involve FC B or WR A+B,A to a 9B....I'm just really re-thinking her trying to solve her puzzle.
 
Am I the only one that uses 3K/3[K] mix-up like a madman? It seems to be much more useful than SCIV 3K and it has a pretty decent range. Not to mention 3[K] sets you up for a lot of guaranteed moves. Also, WS A+B gives you good mix-up opportunities.
 
KineticClash said:
Am I the only one that uses 3K/3[K] mix-up like a madman? It seems to be much more useful than SCIV 3K and it has a pretty decent range. Not to mention 3[K] sets you up for a lot of guaranteed moves. Also, WS A+B gives you good mix-up opportunities.
Click to expand...

Well, if Link at WB is any indication, it's not a bad idea at all. I just wish 3[ K ] didn't knock back as much as it does now on block -- that we, she can actually use the frame advantage it gives her.
 
Maybe this is a good place to discuss post-GI, postJG stuff.

As rare as GIs go, they're useful if you're in a bind but with a lot of meter built up and on the defense.
Successsful GI gives a free 8A+B,B...can't find anything more reliable at the moment.

as for JG, which is something I've only started doing lately, it seems that only throws(including CE) and BB are guaranteed.
Anything else seems situational.

You can interrupt Nightmare's BB by JG the first and pressing BB yourself.
Perhaps one day we will get a more extensive JG punishment list.
 
Sora the push back on 3[K ] is mix of good an bad. IIRC you can use 2A+B (I think the range has improved in sc5) and land a hit after a blocked 3[ K ] and your at about plus 3 so you have decent frame trap in that and if they blocked the push back from the 3[K ] and FC from 2A+B makes it a little more difficult to punish. also regular 3k is a great move to apply pressue with -6 b/+6 h.

Also Gi are still pretty useful (fight a decent hilde) and its good to know that 8A+B,B is garunteed after words. I have done all maybe 4 JG and and starting to wonder how the mechniac works again is it tap g just as you are about to get hit or hold G then release as you are about to get hit.
 
Kaz said:
Also Gi are still pretty useful (fight a decent hilde) and its good to know that 8A+B,B is garunteed after words. I have done all maybe 4 JG and and starting to wonder how the mechniac works again is it tap g just as you are about to get hit or hold G then release as you are about to get hit.
Click to expand...

You tap it.
Tap it as fast as you humanly can.
If you do it correctly, Ivy will only flinch a little, she shouldn't even raise her hand to guard....that's how subtle it should be.
 
The press and release can only be 4 frames (0.07 secods). Also you can't have G pressed within the last half a second or so. So you can't just continually tap G and hope for a JG.
 
yeah i know about the cooldown period, it was that the few times i have gotten it and the number times had tried to do it again made me question if i was doing it right to begin with but Neo confirmed that for me.
 
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