SC Community needs to move on....

[mikosu]

You know I was tempted to close this thread cuz y'all be trippin'. But in the end I think this discussion will actually help the community. Lots of people are commenting here showing that this game is not dead. DINO hit that perfectly. If this thread does get closed it won't be by me unless it's nothing but trolling from this point.

Also I don't think they should be banned. Jaxel's declaration really doesn't impact the entire tourney scene. It's up to the organizers since as has been said there's no central authority. I would think for their own tournies each region can do its own thing but for something like Nats I can see why we'd want a unified decision.

 

[Kikaleek]

Completely off topic but <3 miko's icon, shit has me dying

 

[Something-Unique]

[Edit] SU, you should know by now these people don't care about evidence. They just want to jack off to their own voices and pretend everything will get better.

Definitely the case. I agree.

Now you've pissed me off Omar. What *we* did wrong? Has your "moral superiority" gone so far to your head that you feel as though you have the right to throw castigation on the very people who have tried to do the right thing from day 1, in effort, thought, sweat, and money?

It's not that we aren't above admitting we are wrong, it's the idea of YOU of all people demanding it from us like your some kind of litigator is just flat out stupid. Seriously, fuck you. Now there's no reading into it for you to do.

-Idle

If u have the balls to cast a ban on those who are part of this community and treat them as expendable. Then u are being disrespectful to them as a member of the community and disrespect doesn't get respect back sorry to inform u. Respect those who attend and support ur events or would like to. To support ur cause and help u succeed. You cannot succeed as a tournament organizer without ur support base. Clearly u don't give a fuck as doing what ur doing u have implied the notion that some are expendable for a cause that holds no weight because u lack facts and proof.

You deserve to lose something in return for ur disrespect (bans with no justification) and if it fails and u lost those who were here. As a result u shouldn't have a voice in any community decisions (if ur movement fails). So u know what fuck u to. Cry more! Learn that life has ethics and respect is key.

Let me make this clear Moral Superiority does not fit the profile for me. What fits the profile for me is standing up for ethical reasons; matters of principle and integrity. Imagine if at any moment someone who dedicates his time into this game is subject to a random ban whenever people like u feels it fits the bill for better results which have not proven better.

I went out of my way two times to support u as an organizer. One was for GU when I advertised it in my sig and even now for GAMME because no one else does what u do. But regardless I will not respect ur movement because it disrespects others on principle.

 

[IdleMind]

If u have the balls to cast a ban on those who are part of this community and treat them as expendable. Then u are being disrespectful to them as a member of the community and disrespect doesn't get respect back sorry to inform u. Respect those who attend and support ur events or would like to. To support ur cause and help u succeed. You cannot succeed as a tournament organizer without ur support base. Clearly u don't give a fuck as doing what ur doing u have implied the notion that some are expendable for a cause that holds no weight because u lack facts and proof.

You deserve to lose something in return for ur disrespect (bans with no justification) and if it fails and u lost those who were here. As a result u shouldn't have a voice in any community decisions (if ur movement fails). So u know what fuck u to. Cry more! Learn that life has ethics and respect is key.

Let me make this clear Moral Superiority does not fit the profile for me. What fits the profile for me is standing up for ethical reasons; matters of principle and integrity. Imagine if at any moment someone who dedicates his time into this game is subject to a random ban whenever people like u feels it fits the bill for better results which have not proven better.

I went out of my way two times to support u as an organizer. One was for GU when I advertised it in my sig and even now for GAMME because no one else does what u do. But regardless I will not respect ur movement because it disrespects others on principle.

Did you really just give me an ethics speech? Let me lay it out for you. Your talk has NO RISK INVOLVED. You can run your mouth off like an idiot all day and it does not cost you one iota. I run events and have a public image to maintain in doing so. Ask anyone who's ever been to an event of mine "Did Idle take care of you and treat you with respect?" I'm gonna guess the answer is gonna be yes, even if they disagree with my points of view on certain things. I earn my keep and my reputation from DOING THINGS, not just talking shit on an online forum and not showing up to tournaments out of some vague sense of principle about a video game.

So I re-iterate: Fuck you.

-Idle

 

[Malice]

I'm loving that avatar too mikosu. GGs.

This thread doesn't need to be locked. Everyone might as well get their bitching out of the way.

As for the East Coast being the bitch coast, if it keeps people coming out to compete and have fun, then we some bitches then. When was the last time anywhere else had a tourney for this game? Like I said, the story is a different one when it comes to people actually coming to a tourney to compete. If what the rest of the country is currently doing is not evidence enough, then I don't know what is. Holla at Blue's Clues or some shit.

Tourney organizers may do their own thing, but I don't see anyone else organizing tourneys just for SC4. But nationally there needs to be a guideline.

We have been using these rules since August of 2009 when most of the country quit playing in and holding tournaments for SC4, so it's not some random ban coming out of nowhere. So you guys who are saying that it will just leave to calls to ban Amy, Kilik and Voldo, that's not happening.

I wish there was a better solution, but nothing else has worked at a national level up to this point. Democracy has not worked and having one person make a decision isn't working, so I don't know what you guys want. How the hell do you expect anything to work in this community if everyone is so combative?

I am all for any solution that keeps people playing this game in tournaments. That's my goal, but I am sure if there was one, we'd be doing it by now before the majority of the country stopped having tournaments for this game or have some weak excuse as to why they aren't having one while they bitch at the east coast for trying to do something. So if anyone has any better ideas instead of all this back and forth, let's hear it.

 

[MONEYMUFFINS]

You deserve to lose something in return for ur disrespect (bans with no justification) and if it fails and u lost those who were here. As a result u shouldn't have a voice in any community decisions (if ur movement fails). So u know what fuck u to. Cry more! Learn that life has ethics and respect is key.

If you're going to talk about ethics and respect, then there's no real beginning. At what point did it become respectable to move the website from CaliburForum to 8WayRun? When was it respectable to make rules in the first place? Why should any one person have decided on the rules? My point is that, ultimately, it always starts with an individual who takes lead. So, what? If nobody takes the lead then nothing moves forward, so you'll be arguing with leadership all day if you want to talk about respect at its core. New decisions are never perfect. You're better off influencing a decision before that decision is made, not being bitter afterwards.

Sorry, but IdleMind is right, and if anything it's unfortunate that you disrespect him when he's so graciously being a leader in the first place. In other words, consider making your own moves instead.

 

[KingAce]

Real nigga talk...SU, Ceirnian, RTD

The community comes first.
One, Idlemind is the last person I would be disrespecting, he has done more for this community than any of you ever have.

Second, Tournament organizers can run their tournaments on whatever rulesets they want. That's how it's been for a long ass time.

Third, Why is hilde and algol getting banned? You don't know? I'll tell you it's not because the characters can't be beat. It's retarded to even mention..."Ohhh you guys are just whining, hilde hasn't even dominated anything." Bull shit...what happened in ATL is real, and that was one of our strongest regions, that's all the proof you need.

Fourth, Noone is disrespecting RTD or Ceirnian just because hilde is getting banned. I am sorry but two players don't dictate shit in our Community, only organizers and the community it self does. It's unfortunate like I have said, but Idlemind is looking at a very different picture from you SU. You're worried about losing your rivals, he's worried about getting players. His concerns out weigh your selfish ones' by a large margin.

Hilde is getting banned, because she gives nothing to back to the community.

The very same community that is paying for your trip to France. And that's the equation.

Ceirnian at this point it doesn't matter how NorCal runs it's tournaments. People go to majors, if organizers want people to show up...these bans become relevant, does the allow or ban effect turnouts? Only an organizer can tell you that.

In defense of hilde especially in consideration of RTD and Ceirnian...I am not convinced that people actually want hilde banned completely. To me and I believe to some deep down that's excessive. I firmly believe their perfectly good stages in SC4 where you can have a perfectly good match without hilde having a stage adv. I think both Idle and Jaxel should be open minded to this.

To other regions, I say running your own rulesets is perfectly fine, but it's the majors that matter. So for that if you have an opinion or a compromise or something to say about how majors should be run; so that people spend money to actually travel out of state for competition and a bigger pot, debate on that.

 

[Angrel-San]

Wow, this is getting out of hand.

Peeps, relax, we're all mostly adults here.

Let's agree to disagree on some points and if you still have beef take them to PMs. This stuff is a stain for the image of the community.

As for the ban issue, let's learn from the mistakes on SC3 and SC4. All this started when the head honchos (not you Jaxel) banned Algol when the combo video pre patch was brought up. Let's learn to not jump the gun so early for next time even if things look wack from combo videos. Banning stuff prematurely is not wise and the whole Algol issue brought other things later.

Let's just learn from this and be more prepared for the next game or upgrade.

 

[Something-Unique]

Did you really just give me an ethics speech? Let me lay it out for you. Your talk has NO RISK INVOLVED. You can run your mouth off like an idiot all day and it does not cost you one iota. I run events and have a public image to maintain in doing so. Ask anyone who's ever been to an event of mine "Did Idle take care of you and treat you with respect?" I'm gonna guess the answer is gonna be yes, even if they disagree with my points of view on certain things. I earn my keep and my reputation from DOING THINGS, not just talking shit on an online forum and not showing up to tournaments out of some vague sense of principle about a video game.

So I re-iterate: Fuck you.

-Idle

Fuck u to; How cool where in the same boat. Everything else well whatever it is what it is! Keep on destroying the SC image in the process cause I think that's the part ur forgetting about.

 

[IdleMind]

Fuck u to; How cool where in the same boat. Everything else well whatever it is what it is! Keep on destroying the SC image in the process cause I think that's the part ur forgetting about.

Hey SU, did I take care of you at GU?

Thought so.

If the image I'm portraying is of a person who does shit, and does not brook false accusations against his reputation without retaliation, I'm inclined to keep going.

-Idle

 

[Ceirnian]

Real nigga talk...SU, Ceirnian, RTD

The community comes first.

Real nigga talk...

Fuck the community.

If the community wants to burn my commitment to this game then I have no reason to give a shit about it. Simple as that.

We'll do our thing, you do yours.

 

[Hustle_Man_77]

Real nigga talk...SU, Ceirnian, RTD

The community comes first.
One, Idlemind is the last person I would be disrespecting, he has done more for this community than any of you ever have.

Second, Tournament organizers can run their tournaments on whatever rulesets they want. That's how it's been for a long ass time.

Third, Why is hilde and algol getting banned? You don't know? I'll tell you it's not because the characters can't be beat. It's retarded to even mention..."Ohhh you guys are just whining, hilde hasn't even dominated anything." Bull shit...what happened in ATL is real, and that was one of our strongest regions, that's all the proof you need.

Fourth, Noone is disrespecting RTD or Ceirnian just because hilde is getting banned. I am sorry but two players don't dictate shit in our Community, only organizers and the community it self does. It's unfortunate like I have said, but Idlemind is looking at a very different picture from you SU. You're worried about losing your rivals, he's worried about getting players. His concerns out weigh your selfish ones' by a large margin.

Hilde is getting banned, because she gives nothing to back to the community.

The very same community that is paying for your trip to France. And that's the equation.

Ceirnian at this point it doesn't matter how NorCal runs it's tournaments. People go to majors, if organizers want people to show up...these bans become relevant, does the allow or ban effect turnouts? Only an organizer can tell you that.

In defense of hilde especially in consideration of RTD and Ceirnian...I am not convinced that people actually want hilde banned completely. To me and I believe to some deep down that's excessive. I firmly believe their perfectly good stages in SC4 where you can have a perfectly good match without hilde having a stage adv. I think both Idle and Jaxel should be open minded to this.

To other regions, I say running your own rulesets is perfectly fine, but it's the majors that matter. So for that if you have an opinion or a compromise or something to say about how majors should be run; so that people spend money to actually travel out of state for competition and a bigger pot, debate on that.

I honestly agree with the whole post.

 

[Something-Unique]

Hey SU, did I take care of you at GU?

Thought so.

-Idle

Yes u sure did! Don't misunderstand me. I'm as honest as it gets. In the process of this argument I still even said no one does what u do. There is no flakiness surrounding me. GU was the best tournament this game has had since I have been here except maybe just maybe NEC9.

It still doesn't change the fact u fell into the pro-ban pool and its a sad thing cause otherwise I think u are good for the community. You lack morals it seems though and I guess I can't be mad because business comes first for a business man.

 

[IdleMind]

Yes u sure did! Don't misunderstand me. I'm as honest as it gets. In the process of this argument I still even said no one does what u do. There is no flakiness surrounding me. GU was the best tournament this game has had since I have been here except maybe just maybe NEC9.

It still doesn't change the fact u fell into the pro-ban pool and its a sad thing cause otherwise I think u are good for the community. You lack morals it seems though and I guess I can't be mad because business comes first for a business man.

Fair enough. I'm content to let it drop on that note.

-Idle

 

[TsunamiBye]

Holy-moly-donut-shop-til-you-drop-dead-eating-donuts-because-shit-just-got-crazy-for-donuts-that-killed-me.

 

[Dullyanna]

Democracy has not worked and having one person make a decision isn't working, so I don't know what you guys want.

DFG saying BAM YODA'S BANNED AND EVERYBODY IS WELCOME TO ATTEND NATS (Fuck the regionals!) without warning isn't democracy.

 

[Tukk1]

In France Kilik has no presence. Meaning placement in tournaments. In fact I remember the French not thinking much of him until they came over here and played mine over the course of the time they were here.

In the U.S. Kilik had no presence except for Me and Wing-Zero overall. Even during Wing-Zero's time before he quit he was still on the same plain as Cassandra, Sophitia, etc. in SC4.

Kilik didn't begin rising up the ranks until I continued using him after Wing-Zero left. But even that was nothing. Kilik moved higher on people's opinions and the tier list after my debut at Nationals. I remember it like it was yesterday. I'm not bragging. Its the truth. Shit even Omega was super suprised when he saw my Kilik and I believe he has one out there in DR or had.

Ur an online player who hasn't been around offline so it kind of leaves u behind when it comes to info.

True I play online, but I keep up with offline shit too... What I'm saying is Kilik was never considered garbage... U said he was considered GARBAGE until u started winning with him, I'm saying that's not true...

 

[Whodat]

Banning Algol in the beginning was just stupid. It was completely unfounded and the turned out to bite everyone in the ass later. Now Hilde is being banned, and although it may be somewhat justified it's way too long after the fact to really do something about it.

Everyone has made all these post about I hope SC5 will change everything, but you have to realize it's the people that's not problem not the game. I'm not saying there aren't problems with the game, but it's the people who caused this one. Why do you think it is that everyone stopped playing? Do you really think it's because Hilde is broken? I'm pretty sure it's not because people still play MVC2 and the top characters in that game make any other characters in it obsolete. Do you think it's the economy? Well seeing that major SF4 tournaments are drawing in 200+ people I'd doubt it. Do you think it's Tekken 6 or SF4? Well Melty Blood actually has actually had 100+ people in quite a few of their majors that included T6 and SF4 so that can't be the case either. So what is it? It's the people of this community.

Idle- I understand what you're doing, but I think that because you do run tournaments and have a pretty big impact on the community that you should take the opinions of other influential people in the community (yes that means SU) and then make your decision on the bans. There shouldn't be any of this "Fuck you" type stuff. I mean I think you're wrong on the bans, but if you actually make an informed decision then that would be best for the community. Leaders in each region should talk it out and come up with a national ruleset. Even if that region doesn't run tournaments anymore they should still be represented.

 

[Tiamat]

Third, Why is hilde and algol getting banned? You don't know? I'll tell you it's not because the characters can't be beat. It's retarded to even mention..."Ohhh you guys are just whining, hilde hasn't even dominated anything." Bull shit...what happened in ATL is real, and that was one of our strongest regions, that's all the proof you need.

maybe that's all the proof you need if you are a rabid ATL fanboy++ :P

At what point did it become respectable to move the website from CaliburForum to 8WayRun?

capitalism happened

 

[Ceirnian]

Oh yeah i missed the CF thing. Critical Failure was just as the name implied, a complete failure of a website. It ran into the ground and Jaxel made a superior site. That absolutely needed to happen and I really do appreciate that he did it.