Siegfried Q&A / General Discussion

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How has your play style changed with new Sieg?

I notice new tendency to spam attacks when opponent is at distance, hoping to catch him as he moves in. Also notice I resort mostly to block/step/grab when opponent is near, since close range wiff equals lost round in most cases. (Guess Im learning to value some of his horizontals more too.. esp 6[A] and 88A)
 
Ive been doing 3A like a monster since running 3B is free after. that and aGa/JaGa. but mainly I`ve been doing stance transitions most of the time
 
@kPC

Usually you have enough time to guard or roulette to counter their sidestep into TC 8WR Move. Remember its 10 Frames for the Quickstep + speed of said move. For Siegs 22A that would be 31 frames for example. Still a mix-up against his favor in any case.
 
lillekri said:
How has your play style changed with new Sieg?
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Lots more SCH B on offense... Also a lot more shoulder. A lot less SRSH overall (I just don't feel it's worth it in this game).

Still lots of agA/B6.

A little more B+K auto-gi vs. 2A (that guaranteed B means if you catch a 2a spammer one good time they are losing close to 50%). Also a little more 66A (whereas I never used it before) also for range, auto-GI and visual similarity to B:4.

- I.C.E.
 
lillekri said:
How has your play style changed with new Sieg?
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IMO sieg requires alot more patience in this game. the goal is to control and confuse the opponent while simultaneously aiming for your larger set ups. whiff punishment, spacing, and grabs are all extremely vital parts of his gameplay. CH is also still a very strong part of his gameplay. Its all about watching and baiting the opponent. once you get pressure going, its either a good idea to chase after it with block traps and stance set ups, or if you have a good life lead, to start backpeddling and play the zoning game.

and also kPc, yes you do have enough time to roullete away or even aGI. i wouldnt say that 3B reverse mixup is in siegs favor, but so long as you excersise some caution in its use, its not neccissarily bad either.
 
lillekri said:
How has your play style changed with new Sieg?
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As others have said, less SRSH. These days I cancel out of it and throw more than actually hooking that low kick out.

Lots more 22_88A, agA, 66A, SCH B and its tech traps, and plain ol' throws. Lately I've been falling in love with 2[A+B], kA+B+K as the pressure from that is wonderful and it makes those SCH Bs that I land oh so much more rewarding.

I've also been experimenting with SCH's GI. Given it's about a half life combo off B if the GI lands, and I don't have to risk massive negative frames, I've deemed it worth my attention this game. My favorite thing to GI at the moment is Yoshi's teleport low slash. Makes me laugh every time. It also really helps with lag-tactic Pyrrha. I'm not sure, but I think it's possible to drop in the SBH on reaction to Mitsu's big spinning low, and if you see the lightning hit K and knock them out of the mid-transition, but I might have just gotten lucky with that one...
 
How come sometimes when I perform the FC B+G>B+K>SCH B>236236 A+B+K combo the CE goes through my opponent? I've been testing it on Pyrrha. It works sometimes, other times it goes through.
 
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I need help on playing against Omega, I am unable to punish her after blocking her combos, and it seems she dodges my 6A all day. I am afraid to use 3B, becasue after she blocked it, it seems she can sidestep and punish me before SCH A comes out... 4B is slow and 4A is just so risky... and she doesn't give me time for my mix up.... What do I do?

Someone said at Omegas board "I think the Nightmare and Siegfried matchups are all in Omega's favor actually. They're both so slow and easily punishable. Apply pressure and throw in some of her TC moves like 66A, 44B. 4K stops both lows and TCs. And of course DNS A/B are givens. I've found that there's nothing they that really do unless you whiff something serious. Essentially, they're playing the same game as you (pressure + punish), just Omega seems to be more better at it."

From my experience, that seems to be true... Is Omega really such hopeless match up for Siegfried?
 
Sup folks, new to the boards here. Been lurking around these forums for some time..
This will be my first post ever and I found some interesting stuff for Siegs SCH K(BE).
Not sure if anyone else found this, I'll share it anyway.
So it looks like you can cancel SCH K(BE) into any stance by imputting A+B+K a little later than the regular SCH kA+B+K.
You can go into any stance you like by inputting any direction you'd normally press.
Have a look.


I accidentally found out about this in battle, however I never applied this in any match so far.
The best part about this find is that you can still do SCH K(BE) without using up another 1/2 meter.
And the even better part about it, is that SCH K(BE) after this cancel will not show the bright yellow BE particles. Also the input changes to a simpler SCH K.
There is a catch to this though. Siegfried cant ever go into normal stance and back into SCH and do SCH K(BE). But you can go into any other stance and back and still do the SCH K(BE) without the particles ever showing or having to use any meter.
I think this little thing can create more mindgames for Siegfried and make him a bit scarier. But then again I'm not sure if this will ever be useful. Anyway, try it out, see what happens, share some experiences.

Edit: Also on a sidenote, Siegfried can cancel quicksteps into any stance, good to use in combination with SCH for better evasion. Or multiple QS to bait your opponent into doing horizontals then cancel into SBH to GI . Usually works better at longer range though.

Edit 2: More finds, it seems when you do the SCH K(BE) cancel and go into any stance, lets say SSH and do SSH [A] into SRSH and do SRSH [K] into SBH and the back to SCH you can still do the no particle SCH K(BE), stuff is starting to look better if you ask me.

Johnny
 
Quasimodox said:
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I need help on playing against Omega, I am unable to punish her after blocking her combos, and it seems she dodges my 6A all day. I am afraid to use 3B, becasue after she blocked it, it seems she can sidestep and punish me before SCH A comes out... 4B is slow and 4A is just so risky... and she doesn't give me time for my mix up.... What do I do?

Someone said at Omegas board "I think the Nightmare and Siegfried matchups are all in Omega's favor actually. They're both so slow and easily punishable. Apply pressure and throw in some of her TC moves like 66A, 44B. 4K stops both lows and TCs. And of course DNS A/B are givens. I've found that there's nothing they that really do unless you whiff something serious. Essentially, they're playing the same game as you (pressure + punish), just Omega seems to be more better at it."

From my experience, that seems to be true... Is Omega really such hopeless match up for Siegfried?
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Yeah its bad.

If you want to win you will need to take more risks and make perfect reads on your opponent.

After 3b opyrrha's quick ss left into either 3b or tas a kills every option, but if you space 3b right then you can still have some things going.

For ssl into 3b you have some options:

-return to guard and punish or throw mixup.
-walk back in sch and whiff punish with sch b and kill.

For ssl into tas A same options adding:

-go to sbh and B
 
Also using i cant stress this enough, you need to use 3b from mid range.
 
hellbottom said:
Yeah its bad.

If you want to win you will need to take more risks and make perfect reads on your opponent.

After 3b opyrrha's quick ss left into either 3b or tas a kills every option, but if you space 3b right then you can still have some things going.

For ssl into 3b you have some options:

-return to guard and punish or throw mixup.
-walk back in sch and whiff punish with sch b and kill.

For ssl into tas A same options adding:

-go to sbh and B
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So basically, using 3B against Pyrrha is suicide... Thank you for clarifying. (I noticed you play both Siegfried and Omega...)

Ah... how I miss 6K in SC4, I would be happy if Siegfried can at least get a super punch like SC2 (I forgot the input, was it 6A?)
 
Quasimodox said:
So basically, using 3B against Pyrrha is suicide... Thank you for clarifying. (I noticed you play both Siegfried and Omega...)

Ah... how I miss 6K in SC4, I would be happy if Siegfried can at least get a super punch like SC2 (I forgot the input, was it 6A?)
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6K. I miss it too. Sadly it's Nightmare's shindig now, so we ain't getting it back. But it was high, so there was a bit of baggage there. Mid-interrupts are SC gold...
 
Yeah siegfried is bad vs a lot of characters. hes especially bad vs the more popular ones like natsu -_- that matchup is ridiculous.
 
Interestingly, I have been doing OK against Natsu (perhaps I haven't met a really good one), Natsu players tend to rely on the bomb + air throw for damages, and she is punishable after her combos are blocked. Pyrrha on the other hand, hits like a truck and 3B is useless against her...

By the way, against fast characters, it seems I am only able to attack back unless I blocked their combos. In the other words, the hit stun last long enough to prevent Siegfried doing any move fast enough to interrupt the opponents next attack. Anybody feels the same way? or is it common sense?
 
I think you should check the frame data for characters so you can have a better understanding of the matchups.
 
Quasimodox said:
By the way, against fast characters, it seems I am only able to attack back unless I blocked their combos. In the other words, the hit stun last long enough to prevent Siegfried doing any move fast enough to interrupt the opponents next attack. Anybody feels the same way? or is it common sense?
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That's pretty normal, particularly on counter hit. The additional hit stun can basically keep you taking hits until you block something. I think it was Cassandra's AA string in SC4 Sieg couldn't interrupt on counter hit, so if you mashed a quick high attack, the Cas player could just hit AA until you dropped dead, stopped taking counter hits, or blocked.

I wouldn't be surprised if Leixia and Natsu could do the same in this game. Cervy might be able to manage a long chain of aBs if you just throw out slow moves.

I would never write off 3B as useless. There are characters you're not going to want to use it against at point blank, Natsu and Cervy come to immediate mind. You have to respect characters with an i10 punish. But that move is relatively safe at range, particularly the range where Pyrrha needs to use DNS B rather than NS B to punish. That usually buys you the time to block. It's not your average Pyrrha than can manage a 15 frame DNS B every time.

Bear in mind that you can't make your opponents respect 3B if they're not afraid to step. If you've got people walking in circles around you, then 3B isn't going to be useful until you manage to make them stop.
 
Travaton said:
That's pretty normal, particularly on counter hit. The additional hit stun can basically keep you taking hits until you block something. I think it was Cassandra's AA string in SC4 Sieg couldn't interrupt on counter hit, so if you mashed a quick high attack, the Cas player could just hit AA until you dropped dead, stopped taking counter hits, or blocked.
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So I wasn't imagining things~ Well, I didn't feel so strongly about this until SCV, I guess due to the lack of 6K. Siegfried's 6K has been the "when-in-doubt-throw-it-out" move for me in the past... Ha...

Travaton said:
I would never write off 3B as useless. There are characters you're not going to want to use it against at point blank, Natsu and Cervy come to immediate mind. You have to respect characters with an i10 punish. But that move is relatively safe at range, particularly the range where Pyrrha needs to use DNS B rather than NS B to punish. That usually buys you the time to block. It's not your average Pyrrha than can manage a 15 frame DNS B every time.
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I understand. Since 3B only causes stun at the tip, it's a sign that the move is designed by the developer to be effective at range. But as hellbottom pointed out, the mix up after 3B against Pyrrha is so limited, while Siegfried may be able to block in time, or SCH K, it seems 3B is more of a risk than a tool. (Not to mention 3B whiffs magically sometimes...)

To prevent my opponents side stepping, 6A is what I usually do, but it whiffs against many of Pyrrhas moves... 3A seems to whiff if she side steps left too, and 3AA is a bit slow... 4A is short ranged and risky... Worst of all, she hits almost as hard as Siegfried~ Anyway, I hate to complain so much like a whiny person, but the match up against Pyrrha is just a huge struggle for me... Any words on when the next patch will be? ;-P
 
Quasimodox said:
To prevent my opponents to side step, 6A is what I usually do, but it whiffs against Pyrrha many moves... 3A seems to whiff if she side steps left too, and 3AA is a bit slow... 4A is short range and risky... Worst of all, she hits almost as hard as Siegfried~ Anyway, I hate to complain so much like a whiny person, but the match up against Pyrrha is just a huge struggle for me... Any word when the next patch will be? ;-P
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A few things to try:

-If she's stepping left, agA or 22_88A. Both should cover that side.
-If you find your 3B whiffing and you've been stepped, 2_8B+K, then press guard or B. That should step and realign you with Pyrrha. Though it likely won't work if she AAs or has already stabbed you by this point.
-Block then throw or step up then flapjack. Once you're got her ducking, you can 3B with impunity.
-You can try counter stepping. If you back off to one side when she steps you can cause her stab to miss, giving you time to punish. Or you can also step left with her and use 6A or 3A.
-Standing kick when she steps. Just block afterwards as I have this image in my head of a quick, violent stab coming at you.
-As she steps to your left hit 66K. If you do it late in relation to the step it should track correctly, and if she AAs you may tech crouch it.

3AA seems overall pretty terrible thus far. I would try to find something else to hit her on that side.

Edit: I just re-read one of your earlier posts and noticed that you mention that the Pyrrha blocks 3B, then steps, then punishes. If that's the case you can just plain block. It's take a bit for you to get out of SCH, but if she's wasting that time stepping then you can use that reprieve to get your weapon from behind you.
 
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