Let's talk about B:4

Synraii

[14] Master
Rampart buster to me always seemed unnecessarily slow as compared to other attacks one could use just as effectively as in a situation where B:4 is warranted.
However, recently I have been incorporating it into my game and am still unsure as to whether I should consider it boon or burden.
Sooooooo...
What is the selling point of this move, aside from good damage and a scare tactic?
 

babalook

[10] Knight
Well because it won't track grounded in alot of situations but will force your opponent to block it if they do tech it can encourage roll so you could get 1AA/22/88B on the ground. Also after CH A+Ka2A it is a force block.
 

Pantocrator

[10] Knight
I rarely use the B:4 JF.
After a GI, or if the oppenant GI fasters versions of B4.
The move is too much slow to have else uses.

In the others cases, I ever use the fastest version of B4 (B delay 4, it's a second Jf, even there is no light)
Excellent range, excellent SG damage(8), excellent damage (65), nice in block (0).
Fast enough to preserve you against opponent's GI (and it's possible to do variations on the speed to confuse him).
You can use it for zoning (mixed with agA) or on wake up game.
Endly the fastest version track better on the ground.

This move is very strong. I can't play without.
 

MammothMan

WR B, NSS A+B, GS KK, W!, 4KK, 33B, GSB
The main selling points for B:4 is A-The slowness and awkwardness of the move allows for people to misjudge the speed of the swing, possibly screwing up an attempted GI. And B-I'm pretty sure it hits very heavy on the soul gauge on block.
 

Slayer_X64

Siegfried SA Moderator
The main selling points for B:4 is A-The slowness and awkwardness of the move allows for people to misjudge the speed of the swing, possibly screwing up an attempted GI. And B-I'm pretty sure it hits very heavy on the soul gauge on block.

this plus it is useful in corners, corners on wakeup, and other situations where your opponent cannot move away. walls to the left are also decent as(correct me if im wrong)b4 has tracking to the right side? although it is easy to GI it does have its uses in situations like these. lol i'd continue but i'd just be repeating pantocrater(already am). just listen to what he said, because hes right. just try not being too agressive with this move or u'll eat WR attacks on the left side for breakfast.
 

Synraii

[14] Master
Hmm... I didn't realise it tracked right side, I'll just check quickly.
Personally, I just abuse it against turtles for an easy soul crush :)

Edit
Yes, it does track slightly to the right, but I doubt it would catch a gut roll.
 

Slayer_X64

Siegfried SA Moderator
so far as i've seen(been testing it) it usually catches rolls to the right. and ukemi's to the right are forced to block it. its just the left side u really gotta worry about. that and maybe just ukemi's to the right?
 

Jink

[10] Knight
I use both b:4 & B>4 efficiently. Use B>4 often then if opponent GIs it, start using b:4 or even b4. The speed difference is enough to bug your opponent's GI timing.

On wake ups, if opponents side roll, step forward a bit before using b4, the step helps to track as it shift the timing against the roll's evasion.

Other good MixPokes with B-strings:
BB mixed with 2B, FC'K or FC'A. Get the opponent to expect BB, then using 2B's -2 plus opponent's expectation of the 2nd B, do FC'K if closed or FC'A if far. This works better at far range.
If the opponent start guarding low after 2B, switch to WS'A.
 

ZOMBIEBEAR666

[09] Warrior
b:4 is i45 and in some cases does track hitting ground, and can cause a force block on wake-up... b:4 on grd leads into frame traps as Seigfried gets +4, following up with b6 is a good option after this, the b:4, b6 string will keep your opponent in a state of FC position assuming b6 connects and b:4 is guarded... b:4 breaks in 8 consecutive blocks, adding to Sig's SCD game... b:4 on hit leads to massive damage and unlike B4 an 88 followup is a garaunteed tech trap (hits G, catches all tech directions), b:4, 88~T!, SRSH B, b:4 is a tech combo and the second b:4 after the combo is a force block... Depending on an opponent's playstyle and game knowledge, b:4 into a:G:A is another good option yielding more SCD and a continued grd advantage (I didn't say great option)... To remain safe, just like every move in the game, using b:4 appropriatly is key to a good Seigfried...

@Babalook;
Actually CH a+ka2A, b:4 is better in terms of a force block cenario, and I think thats what you meant...
CH A+Ka2AA results in the last 2 hits being a NC with good wakeup, CH A+Ka2A, b:4 I think would only be effective if you were to Soul Crush the opponent upon them blocking b:4 immediatly...
 

ZOMBIEBEAR666

[09] Warrior
The more you delay the 4 input in B4 the faster the move comes out... Fastest I think makes it around i35 or something I can't remember...
 

Jink

[10] Knight
That's what I meant by b:4 & B>4. B>4 stands for latest delay input. I've been using B>4 more than b:4 to punish whiffs & to counter after baiting in my opponents.

B>4 comes from SC2. Sig (NM) has a guard crush with SCharge & B>4, & it was also the basic way to confirm if the command was well inputted.
SCharge, G, B>4, B>4. The first B>4 was Guard Crush, if the second B>4 was inputted correctly, the opponent wouldn't be able to Guard it, just GI it.

The other great thing about SC4's B>4 & b:4 is its short recovery. If Sig does B>4 (or b:4) against Yun's Crane Auto-dodge, Sig would be able to guard (and perhaps GI) Yun's Crane Auto-dodge counter kick.
 

PsyentifiK

[08] Mercenary
sup guys, never really post on here but i noticed u guys talkin bout b4. is it better to use it when you do it as a just frame?
 

Jink

[10] Knight
b:4 just-input: When you are close & sure that your opponent is going to guard. When you have previously used B>4 (delayed-input for fast start up) often enough that your opponent GIs it, then use b:4 or b4 to punish their next probably early-timed GI attempt against the illusion of B>4.
 

sephalump

Video games kill people
@ jink thanks mein ima try incorporating that into my game. on another note peep my latest online match peoples. i accept all types of critique.
-peace

http://www.8wayrun.com/media/sciv_jerichoxwar-sieg-_vs_psyentifik-sieg-avi.1967/

Nice stance dancing game. I'd suggest you lay off the WS A stuff. Its an iffy move, and really unsafe. There's a couple holes in your play but whatever, everyone has them. Particular though is using WS [B ] rather than 3[b ] to enter chief hold stance. 3[B ] into stance can be interupted almost every time offline. I'd also suggest more a+kA alone since it gives great advantage and kills step. More pokes. I suggest 2A, 1K, b6(screw you slayer, screw you), 4K, 3K. Um you two were playing way more aggressive than I'm used to seeing though, so I'm a bit usure of what else I can say. On the other hand, Welcome to 8wayrun hope you enjoy your stay here :).