Looking for help with Taki

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
Sophie's 236B (if you mean that) can be punished with A:6 and also normal A6.
But on Block Sophie's 236 can punish both that moves too so that's balanced :)
 

Rufus

[09] Warrior
When i see this punish in tournament videos i will agree with you, but at this moment it doesn't exist for me.

And that imput A:6+B, it only helps you if you push 6+B too soon, and it will be A,B. But if you late it gives you only A and it' s not good. So it's not 100% guaranty and it's waste of oportunity.
 

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
When i see this punish in tournament videos i will agree with you, but at this moment it doesn't exist for me.

It doesn't exist? You want proof? Who do you think i am? You can try it out yourself quite easy:
Program the opponent to do Asty 66A or Sophie 236236B and block immediately after that, then try to punish that tell me about your experiences.
It's not that hard.
In this punishment case it's AB for 20 damage VS A:6 for 35 damage, so...
Who's wasting opportunities now?

And that imput A:6+B, it only helps you if you push 6+B too soon, and it will be A,B. But if you late it gives you only A and it' s not good. So it's not 100% guaranty and it's waste of oportunity.

You got that A:6+B one wrong :

If you do 6+B too soon, you WILL do normal A6!
A:6 requires you to hit 6 at the latest possible moment, you can't do 6+B too early and get AB it's impossible.
I suspect you don't know that much about this move really.

And if you get just normal A you are doing 6+B waaayyy too slow.
 

Rufus

[09] Warrior
If you do 6+B too soon, you WILL do normal A6!
A:6 requires you to hit 6 at the latest possible moment, you can't do 6+B too early and get AB it's impossible
So it's even worse...
Program the opponent to do Asty 66A or Sophie 236236B and block immediately after that
Ok, if i manage to punish it's 35 dmg, but if i fail (50% in real battle) it's huge disadvantage -i14 and Sofa can even punish 40-50 dmg.
 

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
Do as you wish.
I'm not here to persuade people.

But just because you (and me) can't do it very consistently doesn't mean it's useless.
I couldn't do Ivy CS if my life depended on it but i don't say it doesn't exist or it's not doable.

I'm just trying to tell people what's possible with Taki.
 

ZOMBIEBEAR666

[09] Warrior
Tip: If you can setup 66B:A to hit midair (like off of CH 11K, etc) you can get an iFC 1A+B(GSTN) for a combo and then follow up with all those fun tech traps...
 

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
Dont take Shoguns or Fleshmaster Advice. They dont know Taki.

Hey D.I.N.O. when did you post anything useful here?

I'm not saying that A:6 is the ultimate move for everything or that i can punish with it everytime i just thought it's quite ignorant to say it doesn't exist.

Yes of course it's unsafe especially against Sophitia.
And it has other drawbacks as i stated above.
And those 2 attacks (Asta 66K and Sophie 236236B) are extreme examples because they are barely unsafe to A and A:6 (-10/11)

I'm just sharing information, unlike you.

Another bit of information:

You have to consider distance and the recovery of the opponent's attack too for A:6
Because at some distances the enemy's attack's pushback makes A:6 whiff or partially whiff.
This often happens with Mitsu because of his weird lean back stance/hitbox.

And on partial whiff (last hit whiff) A:6 is a bit unsafe. -9 or something like that :(

Same thing happens when you hit the opponent in mid step sometimes, when he steps to the wrong side.
 

kikoshoo

[09] Warrior
Yes, when A:6 hit partially it is actually disadvantage to Taki. Most of the time, the enemy is shocked by the (shiny)attack that they don't have time to punish. But good players can punish.
Sophie's 236236B on block is an opening as far as I know.
Flesh, DINO is just playing around. I don't believe anyone would be dumb-fuck enough to make such an idiotic comment.
 

Rufus

[09] Warrior
Yo, Flesh, it's not about sharing information, it's about giving bad advice, for a player.
I agree with you that in theory A:6 is gdlk, but only in theory (and it's very sad), this move good for skill videos, but not for real battles.
 

D.I.N.O

[11] Champion
I'm just laughing because you guys Treat A:6 like a move Taki needs. She doesnt.

Plus, Taki is not about Combos, She is about Setups. She is one of the characters where you're in trouble if you stand up, or stay on the ground.

The Key to playing Taki, is first decide what Combos you'd like to land.
Hover B
PO A+B UB
6A+B UB Launch
A+B Bomb Launch
WR BKB
33B
BT PO B+K.

You also need to decide what you're going to do when you jump/crouch a move.

tc 33B; tc WS AA PO mixups; tc 3bK PO, tj K2, tj 9A,

The other Key, is knowing your PO transtions.

AB PO to punish, or block pressure, BB PO if you know they'll duck, 3bK PO, 33A PO, all these should be cancelled with 8_2~4 on block, or on hit to restart mixup (Throw, Hover, etc)

Once you know what moves you want to evade with (tc, tj, or 44B type pullback) and you know what power moves you want to land (Hover Mixups, PO A+B UB) then its just a matter of watching what you're opponent does.

The other thing is, you will eventually land CH WS K. You have HOVER B Stuns, you have PO K Stun Mix Up, or you can just doe 1BA PO B. The key is mixing up how you end your combos, to always keeping them guessing.

ie A+B Launch, I can Air Grab, A6~WRB, A6 WR~6A+B UB, A6 WR~fc1A+B, stuff like that.

Other key moves include A+K K (Stalker K), 22K~A_WR mixups, A+B~A pressure, 4A+B~A~PO Cancels, 2BA ground hitting, or PO transtion....these small moves are how you get in, how you make it your turn.

This is just scracthing the surface. There is here Post Gi game. Her Bait Game, her PO Rush game, but that stuff is more advanced, and requires you know your opponents habits alot more.
 

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
Yo, Flesh, it's not about sharing information, it's about giving bad advice, for a player.
I agree with you that in theory A:6 is gdlk, but only in theory (and it's very sad), this move good for skill videos, but not for real battles.

I have to admit i may have made it sound better than it is, practically.
I'm trying not to be biased. That's why i posted some of A:6's bad properties too.
I think the truth lies somewhere in between.

@ DINO: Good Stuff there!
 

D.I.N.O

[11] Champion
When I said Combo, I mostly meant where your big damage is, so combo, or 1 hit. Taki's main combo is off (Hover B) CH WS K, everything else is just a move hitting.

Flesh - Yea Taki doesn't play like other characters, so everyone just looks for the main combo, but they never know how to set it up. Taki requires training the opponent to expect 1 Hit~ PO, or 2 Hit ~PO...when they're used to that, all your 3 hit strings will land....even AB4A+B, becuz they got used to PO transition, or AB~4A+B~A....same with her 3KK series.
 

ZOMBIEBEAR666

[09] Warrior
Tip: An odd intput, you can attempt A:6 but if you can't get the timing fall back on AB214, try using A:6B214 because it is a good punisher but you don't want to waste time thinking about what to do after you've missed the timing for the JF... AB214 works as a fast close range punish as well, seting up for PO frame traps and rushdowns... The main things to keep in mind are the input's timing and recognizing which hit for confirmation on the correct followup, it seems like alot but its quite easy after some good practice... I may not have worded this as well as I'd like to but this has been another tip...
 

Rufus

[09] Warrior
I wanna learn how to "land a combo with PO A+B UB and 33B"​
Well after PO A+B UB you can do FC 1A+B and go for mixaps, and after 33b you can do 2B/66B:A techtrap(doesn't work on some characters, but...). So it's a combo) with big dmg.

DINO wrote many good tools, but you always must remember, that it's all depends on matchap. And 1 thing that always works perfect it's her movemen, step one of the strongest sides of Taki.
 

kikoshoo

[09] Warrior
33B - -> 66B:A? I have to try that tonight.
If you do kG on the longest possible time before she kicks, it would step Taki back a bit. If you do it quickly twice at least, you might gain that extra room for whatever. Plus it juggles Taki and you can do 214 to confuse the enemy. Of course you can always 4G 4G or jump back. it's just too fun.
 

FleshMasher

[13] Hero
Well after PO A+B UB you can do FC 1A+B and go for mixaps, and after 33b you can do 2B/66B:A techtrap(doesn't work on some characters, but...). So it's a combo) with big dmg.

DINO wrote many good tools, but you always must remember, that it's all depends on matchap. And 1 thing that always works perfect it's her movemen, step one of the strongest sides of Taki.

Especially when it comes to tech-traps it heavily depends on matchaps.
Combinations that are guaranteed tech-traps on certain characters often don't work at all on others.
Ivy is generally a pain in the ass to tech-trap because her teching is as godly as her step. She almost always has a way out, often just normal tech is enough.
Yoshi is just weird his tech avoids stuff you go wtf? But eats stuff that noone else does.

In the beginning of SC4 i made the mistake to train tech-traps in Taki Vs. Taki practice mode and assume that tech-traps that work on Taki work on everyone.
That's not the case.
Actually to me it seems that everyone techs better than Taki.
Even fatass Asta can tech out of A6 WR B to both sides, where for Taki only one side worx.

I don't know if tech-traps are worth the effort with Taki. It's very complex.

And even juggle combos are matchup dependent:
22B, 2B is a combo on Taki, Sophie lands in time to block 2B.
After Counter Hit 11K, A6 sometimes even whiffs magically on Xianghua.11K distance/angle dependent, dunno.
Just a few examples.
 

Tha_Shogun

[10] Knight
Yo, Flesh, it's not about sharing information, it's about giving bad advice, for a player.
I agree with you that in theory A:6 is gdlk, but only in theory (and it's very sad), this move good for skill videos, but not for real battles.

This is untrue, A:6 is good for skill videos and anything else if mastered.

Flesh is not giving any bad info in this case, it can work in gatherings and is very amazing if you learn it.

I believe actually at my first tourney I won the set against with 22B, A:6 combo for a ring out in finals (and finished the set a 33K Wind Roll mix-up).

It does work in theory and in practice, I highly recommend mastering this move.

But like all advice, take it with a grain of salt and eventually different people will come up with different styles.

I really believe A:6 is a move Taki need honestly, it's too good not to master. I mean i10 punisher that's 36 damage that can lead to possible more damage, who wouldn't want that in Taki's arsenal? Taki needs every piece of damage she can get and relying only on 'set-ups' is gonna give you that damage.

In fact, I believe that A:6 with an last frame wind roll leads to tech trap oppourtunities and if Wind Roll is done right after A:6 on hit, will lead to a back turn set up to any character that techs towards or away from screen.
 

D.I.N.O

[11] Champion
A:6 to Punish, is its only use....after that, you're risking losing frames going for 35 dmg = 13%....

Taki Tech Traps are NOTHING like they used to be...but here is a short list of traps I use....

33K - The window is weird on this one, you kind of have to delay, but you can land 33B, or stuff like that..

CH A6 - Part of her PO K mixup is hitting a Mid mix-up, since they may think you're going to throw or do bombs. For those who Shake n duck,A6 is good for that. If they didnt Shake, CH A6 leads to a bomb tech trap.

CH 22K~WR - IF you land the 22K off axis, WR BKB will be gauranteed. The Same would apply if you land CH3KK of axis, WR BKB will pick them up.

22B - Not a Tech trap, fc1A+B combos, or you can AB PO mixup, instead of going for the A:6 combo