Natsu Questions And Answers / General Discussion

IIRC, Viola's SET 3B is -14 on block, so you can do a 4B or 3KK to punish instead of just AA, all depending on range, but I don't remember the range on her 3B being all that great anyway, so you could either use 4B or A:6 to punish for better damage than 3KK or AA.
 
Thanks guys! I was hoping there was some simple trick like "just tech roll to the side" haha. I'll refer to your notes when I go through Viola's moveset and acquaint myself with the character. Right now my first priorities to learn are Mitsu/Nightmare/Ivy. Especially Ivy is a super tough matchup for me because I never really understood her or played with or against her much in the previous games, haha.
 
Does anyone use 33_99K? I don't think I've ever seen it in a proper match. It's -2 on block so it's among Natsu's safest moves, but is the final mandatory High hit a liability if ducked? Or is it just too slow at i20 + 8wayrun?
 
Nimrodent said:
Does anyone use 33_99K? I don't think I've ever seen it in a proper match. It's -2 on block so it's among Natsu's safest moves, but is the final mandatory High hit a liability if ducked? Or is it just too slow at i20 + 8wayrun?
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It's pretty much as you said. It's slow, and does crappy damage on hit. It's mid high so if the opponent ducks and eats the first hit the 2nd will whiff over their head. So conceivably the only way to get it to hit is to whiff punish with it, at 20 frames why wouldn't you go with a move with better reward like 66b or 3b.

It's single use is to be blocked by the ring edge. Catch people who are unaware of its frames wit a:6 afterwards, if they get wise and try to 2a interrupt a+b will ring out. I'd like to see it changed to mid mid in the future, along with bb standing up crouches on hit so ch bbk and bba don't whiff as well.
 
Nimrodent said:
Does anyone use 33_99K? I don't think I've ever seen it in a proper match. It's -2 on block so it's among Natsu's safest moves, but is the final mandatory High hit a liability if ducked? Or is it just too slow at i20 + 8wayrun?
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I actually consider 33K to be one of, if not Natsu's most useless move. I can't remember the last time I used it in a match. Out of every approach move I use, there's just something better than 33K. 66B, 66AB, or 6B (hell even 66K at range) all have better risk/rewards or are simply faster or stronger (or both). The move doesn't even have Cervantes' bK benefit of guard pressure and being +1 on block. Does 33K even tech jump quick enough to be of any use? (though 8A or A+B would be better options anyway).

I can't find any use for 33K besides looking cool. For guard pressure, I prefer 6B due to it being a quick, safe poke. What Project Soul needed to have done was to make 33K: Mid, Mid and make it at least +1 or +2 on block to compensate it's speed and useless damage. Compare this move to the usefulness of Cervy's bK.
 
Nimrodent said:
Does anyone use 33_99K? I don't think I've ever seen it in a proper match. It's -2 on block so it's among Natsu's safest moves, but is the final mandatory High hit a liability if ducked? Or is it just too slow at i20 + 8wayrun?
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Its a good tool to use to catch rolling opponents. I use it alot in places when I know they will roll and it leaves u in a good position on there wake up. Use the shortcut for the move tho. Hold 6 to enter 8wr then 3K.
 
I recently saw a video with a Natsu who used 3A a lot, and I've been trying to figure out why.

If you compare 3A to 66B which are both TCs, 66B has faster impact, longer range, faster TC (66B is TC from 6th frame while 3A is somewhere between 7th and 9th as far as I can tell?) and substantially better damage. So, the only possible purpose I can figure for 3A is that it's safer (at i13 vs i16) which I guess could be a big deal against some characters. Am I missing something or is this attack just not that attractive? I feel like the i19 impact is prohibitive for this move, especially since it's not that safe on block.

Is the back turned +9 on counter hit really worth that much? I guess if you're up in the corner you could get a guaranteed back throw?

Do you guys use 3A?

EDIT: Oh and I guess I forgot that 3A is a horizontal so it should catch step. :P That's kinda cool.
 
Nimrodent said:
3A
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Positive:
  • Tracking, it catches step and TC (not super TC though) and can correctly hit where A6 will partially whiff due to sidestep. Thank god her other Horizontals including horizontal kicks have much better tracking than SC IV Taki's, with her you had to mix 3A with her other horizontals for an anti step left/right mix up lol. (Excuse my rambling)
  • Relatively safe
  • +2 and side turned on hit
  • +9 on CH
  • She does not spin around during it unlike in many other moves (like during 1A, 66B, 1K for example and 15 or so other moves where she spins around, a small thing but it bothers me a bit about her command list) so you can not end up in BT when interrupted. Only side turned unless your opponents attack turns you around.
Negative:
  • Quite slow
  • Rather short range
  • Short TC window (and unlike 66B the TC does not last until the impact so you can get hit by a high in the last moment)
I use it for timing variation against GI, and relatively safe anti evasion.
But not much because medium/good Backstep like Pyrrha or Cervy can make it whiff in many advantage situations like after 6B, KK or AA on hit and then your're screwed.
I just tested VS Cervy, he can almost always backstep it unless you use:
PO B on block, 3A, 9B or WS B on hit, or 22_88A on CH.
Or when you blocked his disadvantageous attacks.
Not much but she's got backstep killers for the other situations.
 
It's pretty useful vs ivy and leixia.

For an ivy that likes to 3b or 214b at disadvantage you can catch them ch in the back for free backthrow/mid mixup.

If leixia tries to do 1b+k after a blocked po b and you do 3a It sets up the same bt ch scenario.

An odd trade situation is your ws a blocked (-4) leixia tries to 1b+k, you trade but you recover faster and can land ch 3kkk into 1a or ce.

There are probably others to like Pyrrha 22k and Cervantes ss move as well. Lex and ivy are just the two I've tested extensively
 
Interesting analysis on 3A guys. I unfortunately struggle to find usage for it due to it's slow speed and lackluster range, but it can be handy for people that like to mash out AA's at disadvantage. 3B tech crouches too if I'm not mistaken and is much faster (i16). For dealing with step, I like 66A, AAB, A+B, and have been looking to implement 4KK.
 
Force_of_Nature said:
For dealing with step, I like 66A, AAB, A+B, and have been looking to implement 4KK.
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4K seems like it'd be a really good poke to me. Though a bit slow, it's super safe at -4/+6 and 22 damage is quite a lot for a poke like that. I haven't tested it out much yet but if you condition your opponent to crouch block 4KK, maybe you can cancel the follow-up and go for 3K?
 
Nimrodent said:
4K seems like it'd be a really good poke to me. Though a bit slow, it's super safe at -4/+6 and 22 damage is quite a lot for a poke like that. I haven't tested it out much yet but if you condition your opponent to crouch block 4KK, maybe you can cancel the follow-up and go for 3K?
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When in close, but not necessarily "face-to-face", I like the TC positioning that 4KK puts Natsu in, because people are usually weary about attacking her when she has access to WR K. You can choose to not go for the follow-up too if you want to keep the opponent on their toes. 3KK's are good for keeping people blocking.
 
I find myself doing to much mid's, so Im easily blocked.
I do try and use 11a, 2k, 1k and 2a although Im still working on being able to get closer to better players so I may use her close range lows/throws.

Any advice?
 
There's nothing wrong with doing too many mids as long as you're not being punished. I spam the hell out of 66B and A+B until I get punished for doing so (then I start to use 66B4 and A+B4 instead). If you want to get close to your opponent, just run up and block. It's the same thing I do with Pyrrha or Tira. 11A is a nice move but can be a slight liability if blocked. 66A or 66AB is usually my go to for advancement.
 
Its being read like a book and being blocked and tech-something out off.
Thats my understanding of me doing to much mids. Oh I try using PO B, that has helped
Agree wih 66a. Ive also found PO B to be better for me after bombs due to them being close
So I can pretend to have awake-up game/plan.
 
I've noticed this for a long time now but just got around to testing in practice mode.

Natsu has a fail safe built into her a, b, and k where if you are pressing buttons and someone pops off a ce to try and beat it out with invincibility frames, you can guard cancel the move without getting hit if its early enough in the animation. I tried this with several other characters and it did not work with them.
 
kAb said:
a, b, and k guard cancel VS CE
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I thought this works with everybody, it's just that after you press A, B or K, it takes a few frames until you're able to cancel and guard again, if you input the attack too late before the freeze you can't cancel and guard in time and will get counter hit.
 
Hey there, I am a new Natsu main from RI. I was wondering if anyone here would be down to sparr/train or even give me some casual lesson or session whenever available. PSN is LordXav1er for anyone that wants to play at anytime. ^_^
 
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