Nightmare's Movelist Changes and Move Speculation Thread

Nightmare has a gauge game now which is all safe or positive. Sick!

66A (Looks like it cracks in 6-10)
66B (which looks like it cracks in 4-6)

The 3K whiff after CE to set-up another CE looked sick.

After CH 6K, 1A looks like a tech-trap. (Wow!)

Post GS K BE, there seems to be grounded stun (IE the opponent is unable to tech before NM has recovered) on the last hit. What will be interesting is if there are tech-traps from this (Would make it crazy good). Look at 14:45 specifically and notice that the opponent's legs have not hit the floor and Nightmare's 4K has already come out. At very least, I think we might be able to get 66B must-block.

3AA does look much safer and faster, especially at tip.

B+G throw wallsplat into manly 44K combo which does about 100 damage. Nice...

1K NH into CE set-up. Sick. Some fucking high level stuff he's showing us there.

3AA is an NC at tip range. Sweet.

CE activates on highs and meds (so far). Can be stepped however (damn :( ). Whether the GI protects you even when the move is stepped will remain to be seen.

Edit: Page was using Nightmare earlier in that stream. Did okay. 3AA looks really good now because of its push-back, helps a lot in Nightmare's spacing game.
 
Engared said:
B+G throw wallsplat into manly 44K combo which does about 100 damage. Nice...

3AA is an NC at tip range. Sweet.

CE activates on highs and meds (so far). Can be stepped however (damn :( ). Whether the GI protects you even when the move is stepped will remain to be seen.
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That wasn't a combo, they just didn't stand up after B+G, notice how the hit sparks were yellow and the combo count came out before 44K hit.

3AA was a NC in SC4 as well.

I think the GI will still protect you when its stepped, there was that instance earlier where it whiffed against Lexia even though the Auto-Gi activated.
 
- CH 6K > 1A definitely looks like a tech trap; I recall Daishi going for 1A after CH 6K multiple times
- I'm not so sure about what the followups after GS K BE are other than another GS K BE. The Maxi player didn't ukemi after it, which made it seem like there was more stun than there was. Something interesting but probably not right, 44K ground hit body slam might combo after the GS K BE. You see Daishi does 4K after the BE, and Utoh (another developer) says "he missed the combo there", followed by Daishi going for 44K anyways.
- On that topic, I'm not so sure that B+G wallsplat > 44K ground hit is a combo. The combo counter only had 3-hits, which is what it usually has when it's a B+G wallsplat without any followups.
- NM's CE GI's Maxi's low, 14:55 (that is a low, right?)
 
Schneider-X said:
That wasn't a combo, they just didn't stand up after B+G, notice how the hit sparks were yellow and the combo count came out before 44K hit.

3AA was a NC in SC4 as well.

I think the GI will still protect you when its stepped, there was that instance earlier where it whiffed against Lexia even though the Auto-Gi activated.
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Said 3 hits, so maybe that confused me. But options after B+G wallsplat throw? Yes please.

I was afraid 3AA at maximum tip would not be a combo. Still is which is good.

microgamer said:
- CH 6K > 1A definitely looks like a tech trap; I recall Daishi going for 1A after CH 6K multiple times
- I'm not so sure about what the followups after GS K BE are other than another GS K BE. The Maxi player didn't ukemi after it, which made it seem like there was more stun than there was. Something interesting but probably not right, 44K ground hit body slam might combo after the GS K BE. You see Daishi does 4K after the BE, and Utoh (another developer) says "he missed the combo there", followed by Daishi going for 44K anyways.
- On that topic, I'm not so sure that B+G wallsplat > 44K ground hit is a combo. The combo counter only had 3-hits, which is what it usually has when it's a B+G wallsplat without any followups.
- NM's CE GI's Maxi's low, 14:55 (that is a low, right?)
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I was calling it in other videos too, i think this is the 3rd time we have seen it and the stun as he hits the ground indicates to me that it is not techable (speculation of course, but look for the flash as he lands). I have reviewed some of the other footage and not one opponent teched GS K BE immediately (There was Ukemi but it occured quite a bit after the knockdown).


I think the developer was talking about a wall splat combo.
 
microgamer said:
- NM's CE GI's Maxi's low, 14:55 (that is a low, right?)
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Some 2A moves are considered Special lows, they can be jumped over and blocked standing or crouching. The best confirmation would be if it auto-gi'd a 2k since those are almost never S.lows iirc

Engared said:
Said 3 hits, so maybe that confused me. But options after B+G wallsplat throw? Yes please.
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Yea I understand where the confusion is coming from. Now the hits of a throw animation is counted in the combo. Like at 40:18 when mitsu does his throw. The combo counter says 4 hits.

Also you can press reply for different posts and the forum automatically adds it to your single post. No need to reply for each quote :)
 
Schneider-X said:
Some 2A moves are considered Special lows, they can be jumped over and blocked standing or crouching. The best confirmation would be if it auto-gi'd a 2k since those are almost never S.lows iirc



Yea I understand where the confusion is coming from. Now the hits of a throw animation is counted in the combo. Like at 40:18 when mitsu does his throw. The combo counter says 4 hits.

Also you can press reply for different posts and the forum automatically adds it to your single post. No need to reply for each quote :)
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Thanks. Options post B+G wallsplat though? That would be crazy.
 
Oh I dunno, I think doing 2A+B for meter is probably going to be one of the best options for NM.

Also I'm glad to see that the auto-gi window for NM's CE is not instantaneous, at 42:01 he gets knocked out of it by mitsu. Yay for nothing silly like wakeup CE
 
That GS B > GS B > GS K BE combo was sweet

the match vs Malek really shows what happens when you don't have/don't use a fast mid, his throws and other highs were getting ducked like crazy at close range

glad to see he can do some guard meter damage now though. hope it doesn't get patched away lol
 
1:33 - vs Pat, Pat ukemis after the GS K BE; you also see NM try 1A post GS K BE, but it's out of range; if there's a wall to keep the opponent in range, who knows
and while we're looking at this video, 1:58 - you see the B+G wall splat without any followups and it says 3-hit combo.

Tiamat said:
...
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I'm just quoting you so that this shows up in your notifications, but for around 14:53, do you think that's a low? You know Maxi's moveset, right?
 
microgamer said:
1:33 - vs Pat, Pat ukemis after the GS K BE; you also see NM try 1A post GS K BE, but it's out of range; if there's a wall to keep the opponent in range, who knows
and while we're looking at this video, 1:58 - you see the B+G wall splat without any followups and it says 3-hit combo.

I'm just quoting you so that this shows up in your notifications, but for around 14:53, do you think that's a low? You know Maxi's moveset, right?
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Unfortunately I'm not sure what move he is using there. I think it is either 22A (mid) or 11A (low). Based on the speed I think it is most likely 22A. I have a feeling it works against lows though since GI works against all 3 types of attacks at the same time now....so I think it may be like that.

edit: I think I saw the move in the stream and I have no idea what it is or if it's mid or low. blah

some info from the stream according to Utoh:
CE does around 80 damage
full charge is around 160 (or did he say 180? i forget) I think he said...and counterhit full charge is 220
he also said it gives nightmare the advantage if blocked....I guess he means frame advantage?

also, he said Just Ukemi is GONE. This means no more people just umeki from Nightmare's 33B6 GS B combo

"clean hit" is a new property that makes certain moves randomly do extra damage. I believe nightmare has this on 6K and 22B
 
@14:53 its the LOW from maxis RO kA 2A (sc4 version) it indeed is a low!

what the actual input is now...I dont know

HRD
 
It looks like his new 1A. from what people say in the Maxi forums it's like his old WL A. Which is look very similar too.... either way both of those attacks are lows. The only curiosity i have is if it knocks down, but that's for a different thread.
 
this new NM's range is pretty good, the push backs, tip hit getting stun/full damage/combo.66A, 66B so awesome, the videos are lacking some good old aGA though.

edit: GS A can be stepped avoid to NM's rightside :(

edit2: daishi stream, at 40:23, wtf at the damage from the drop kick hitting a grounded mitsu.
 
microgamer said:
1:33 - vs Pat, Pat ukemis after the GS K BE; you also see NM try 1A post GS K BE, but it's out of range; if there's a wall to keep the opponent in range, who knows
and while we're looking at this video, 1:58 - you see the B+G wall splat without any followups and it says 3-hit combo.

I'm just quoting you so that this shows up in your notifications, but for around 14:53, do you think that's a low? You know Maxi's moveset, right?
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Yeah i saw that as well but i think 66B, 3A+B, 33B (if its in range it should hit as its 22 frames IMP while GS K BE should be 27 frames IMP based on SC4 frames), 44BB etc should have the range to hit. Ill test it when i get ahold of the game this weekend.

Tiamat said:
That GS B > GS B > GS K BE combo was sweet

the match vs Malek really shows what happens when you don't have/don't use a fast mid, his throws and other highs were getting ducked like crazy at close range

glad to see he can do some guard meter damage now though. hope it doesn't get patched away lol
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Malek just spaced him much better with his turtle style. At least now random 33B can be used more effectively with 33B BE. He should have been using more 66K anyway which he was not.
 
Okay Let me shade some positivity as well.

Possible situations where 1A might techtrap or combo or add pressure(SG dmg).

66A 1A combos in SC4. 1A is now faster.
CH6K 1A
BEK(near walls) 1A
22AA(near walls) 1A
Late throw break
After his CE.

B+G wall splat...in SC4 Keev blew my mind when he followed up with 66KGSB into crazy shit. So I really hope NM has more mids aside from 66K that are i16 or faster, 4KK I am looking at you.

NM definitely has a lot of push back, safety on a lot of his anti step. A lot of spammable stuff. Now I can employ my zoning type NM. Aga/66A/6A high, 3AA/22AA mid, 1A low...the circle is complete.
 
i love what i seen in the last vids, GS B, GSB, GS K BE combo what sweet, 6K seemed as great as it was in Broken Destiny, allowing 1A guarantee and as a tech trap, i would love to see if 44BB is guarantee if you don't tech there like in BD, or if something worse is guarantee if you don't tech there, it seems GS A is safer, Maxi did 2A after blocking it and didn't punish Nightmare, maybe he did 2A late, also NSS K seemed safe or at least safer than in SC4, love new transition into GS in 66A6, his CE seems incredible, and his A+B counter i had the impression it did better damage than in SC4, i want to see what are the options after that GS K BE, there seems to be a good oki there or even a guarantee extra hit, in other vid saw 66K wallsplat on NH, Nightmare seemed safer than in SC4 but its hard to assure that without testing in practice the game.

the things i liked the most were his 6K, his GS B combo, and his CE, and overall i am loving SC5 Nightmare =)
 
Vlaster said:
i love what i seen in the last vids, GS B, GSB, GS K BE combo what sweet, 6K seemed as great as it was in Broken Destiny, allowing 1A guarantee and as a tech trap, i would love to see if 44BB is guarantee if you don't tech there like in BD, or if something worse is guarantee if you don't tech there, it seems GS A is safer, Maxi did 2A after blocking it and didn't punish Nightmare, maybe he did 2A late, also NSS K seemed safe or at least safer than in SC4, love new transition into GS in 66A6, his CE seems incredible, and his A+B counter i had the impression it did better damage than in SC4, i want to see what are the options after that GS K BE, there seems to be a good oki there or even a guarantee extra hit, in other vid saw 66K wallsplat on NH, Nightmare seemed safer than in SC4 but its hard to assure that without testing in practice the game.

the things i liked the most were his 6K, his GS B combo, and his CE, and overall i am loving SC5 Nightmare =)
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Looking strong, but Pyrrha, Maxi, Sieg and Pat look extremely strong at the moment.
 
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