Rock-It-Science

D_Matt_Ma

[10] Knight
This thread is a how to guide to play a flow chart Rock. This will be a guide is an easy, yet effective way to play Rock's pressure game. It does not substitute the strategy needed to get to the wake-up. But it does teach you what to do once you get there.

Note: I wanted to Upload in 2007 format, but the website did not accept it. So I was forced to convert it to a 97-03 format.
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How are there over 100 views of this thread, and not a single comment?
 

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arnboku

[09] Warrior
Nice work. Found some nice setups in it I weren't using.
Is this jump forward thing working because 44K looks similar? I'll toy around with it.

In the throw section I'm missing 63214B+G (perfect release)-> Dash 4A+B
 

LAU

[09] Warrior
D:

I think you got a good list you have there.. but imo it's missing a lot of stuff... most of the stuff listed are stuff that I would expect most Rock should be doing.

I did learn some stuff like how you use the jump forward option i like how you included the 44K 'mixup' i mentioned before...

I also learn about the unblockable setup and will get that a try tonight.. i'm a little skeptical on how it will work.. so i gotta see it myself to see how it works

but here's some of the stuff you're missing. .... these are some stuff the hotnikkelz and I use

1) FC 3K followup.. this gotta be incomplete since you didn't even mention any followups
2) I would add 6B+K to some of my options.. simply because 22B sometimes fail, like seems like certain setups or characters can tech sometimes... or you might simply mess up the timing... but 6B+K you can't go wrong.
2a) 6B+K is a good choice after 3B+G, they must guard this.
3) force block options... I'm not sure if you really use much of Rock's CF game... but honestly Rock's decent at it.. and if you don't wanna guess there's many good places to put in your 22B, WS B, 1A, 6B+K, A+B etc....specifically after ground throw break, post 1A+G, 3B+G scenarios.
4) you didn't list out what happens in 'ground throw break' scenarios.... but here's some.
a) 6K - interupts anyone who's trying to interupt you while lying down.
b) refer to dash forward, or ground game
5) you didn't really list out certain scenarios like 44K blocked...
a) 3G or GI... (3G simply because you force crouch they are UNLIKELY to throw a high move)
b) step
6) in advantage section.. i really suggest you take a look into 6AA.. i think it's a must need move for rock... yes.. it's high high... and very duckable but... doesn't mean it's not a good move.
7) high wall hit -> 66B -> 6K/CT/4K->CT/etc
8) 3A+G/1B+G -> you didn't list what you should do when you wanna try to RO them... imo... right now i use 6[A+B] even if they can manage to get in.. they MUST block that crap.
9) 1K-> GT should be listed as one move....
a) 1K alone is good on ground as well but imo that serves a completely different purpose compared built in 1K GT
10) this list is pretty good.. although most of the stuff is given... however if you have many choices you might write reasons why one choice is better than another.....
11) personal preference... you didn't list making the 'wrong' GT attempt.. trust me this will be important.. i AM doing a lot of wrong GT attempt ON PURPOSE... because it's this good...
a) wrong GT attempt -> major ground advantage/dash advantage setups...
12) didn't list certain CT tech traps.....
a) here it is... most of Rock's SAFE throw attempts are basically when you do a CT tech trap or jf dash -> CT tech trap... why is it safe? if the opponent lies on the ground and FAILS to tech... he/she doesn't have the frames to punish it... example... FC 3K -> CT.... this one is special because the GT is safe as well but for most other cases... only the CT is safe.
b) so if you have a choice between 4A+B... or jf dash -> CT ... it's really your choice of... 4A+B whiff = punished.... or... CT being broken... 4A+B is definitely more rewarding if you guessed right.. but CT is definitely much safer when you guessed wrong.


final remarks:
What i've been learning with Rock is... not everybody breaks your throws ALL the time... sometimes.. you can 'hear' it.. (they are playing on stick), other times you can sense it... they played against you so often they naturally assumed you won't rethrow them in the air for the 3RD TIME!!!.. or they'll assume you fucked up your GT attempt so they are safe now.. but instead you land a side throw on them ;) .... or they get caught off guard by 1K-> GT... or 1K -> regular throw.

for those who do try to break EVERYTHING possible... chances are they are soooooooooooooo focused on breaking.. .they will end get up getting tech trapped or anti-tech trapped more often... they might just end up guarding and mash on breaks.. but doing that sure makes you more safe against rock's throws.. but doesn't leave you more safe agaisnt 2B+K and they are losing frames like that

i think in the end it's just sometimes kinda hard to explain this mind game to people.... people naturally assume break all rock's throws = rock is crap... but nobody breaks everythign nobody even tries to attempt to break everything... and even if they do try to break everythign they might fail during tech traps.

-LAU
 

hotnikkelz

johNNy blaZe
Good guide, Lau pretty much summed up most of the additions that should be there imo. Will probably make one of my own, and cross reference it with yours, joint that shit up and put it in this thread. Gimme a while though, busy as fuk these days
 

LAU

[09] Warrior
tried out the unblockable setup ... it's nice however i believe it's possible to get up REALLY late then attack or step away from the unblockable...

regardless it's an interesting option...

-LAU
 

D_Matt_Ma

[10] Knight
tried out the unblockable setup ... it's nice however i believe it's possible to get up REALLY late then attack or step away from the unblockable...

regardless it's an interesting option...

-LAU
I'll add the rest later in the weekend. I don't think the unblockable is escapable.
 

LAU

[09] Warrior
I'll add the rest later in the weekend. I don't think the unblockable is escapable.
well another problem like i said....

you NEED to cancel the unblockable early for the CT to cause tech trap.. but I think it's possible for the opponent to see if you cancel and determine from there....

finally... you need a wall/ring for this trap to work

-LAU
 

LAU

[09] Warrior
It merely took 1 day for me to reply to D

so...

I guess it takes 3 weeks for anyone to reply to me?

-LAU
 

D_Matt_Ma

[10] Knight
I've been busy. I will update this ASAP. Quarter/Month ends are always busy for me.

EDIT: This isn't working. Can someone edit directly on my the changes and I re-upload it again? Let's check out the file one at a time so not everyone edits it at the same time.

It's hard for me to do it all at one time as I don't know where you want to put what. If someone can just make the edits, I'll do the linking once its uploaded.
 

tetsu

[09] Warrior
11) personal preference... you didn't list making the 'wrong' GT attempt.. trust me this will be important.. i AM doing a lot of wrong GT attempt ON PURPOSE... because it's this good...
a) wrong GT attempt -> major ground advantage/dash advantage setups...
Would you please to explain more bout it LAU ?
 

Haeven

[09] Warrior
Hi. If you decide to perform the wrong ground throw (eg. performing 3B+G or 3A+G when your opponent's head is facing you, or 1B+G or 1A+G when your opponent's head is facing away), Rock will not perform a throw. But you'll have a small frame advantage before your opponent is ready to get back up or roll. Use this opportunity to dash up close before grabbing or using a sweeping low.

You can also use this tactic when the opponent happens to lay at an odd angle so you can't successfully perform a ground throw.

(Let me know if I have it wrong/missed something. =) )