Should Button Binding with Hilde be banned?

KingAce

KingAce

HERMITISM
That's the discussion...

Me personally, I want this character to flourish the way Namco intended her to. It might not to be as easy to release her full potential with a stick, but obviously she wasn't designed for a stick. She was designed for a pad with binding in mind.

The way I see it, she isn't broke with the binding...So the only issue here is that stick users can't use her the same way pad users can.
So is this a good enough reason to ban binding for her specifically, I don't think so. Not nearly enough of an argument.

Not sure what kinda of arguments people can bring-up...but I think this is a fair concern for the community to address.
 
KingAce said:
That's the discussion...

Me personally, I want this character to flourish the way Namco intended her to. It might not to be as easy to release her full potential with a stick, but obviously she wasn't designed for a stick. She was designed for a pad with binding mind.

The way I see it, she isn't broke with the binding...So the only issue here is that stick users can't use her the same way pad users can.
So is this a good enough reason to ban binding for her specifically, I don't think so. Not nearly enough of an argument.

Not sure what kinda of arguments peopl can bring-up...but I this is a fair concern for the community to address.
Click to expand...

Eh...what?

I highly disagree with the "designed for pad, not the stick" comment. How in the world could Hilde be designed for the pad? You only had one thumb, how are you going to charge A while preforming a B+G grab on a pad? You can't unless you use shortcuts. So no, I do not see how Hilde was designed for the pad, not in the slightest. I've messed around with Hilde and I have to say I absolutely hate playing as her with a pad and find it borderline impossible to do the things you are suppose to do with her on a pad (unless you use shortcuts, which I dislike using). If I ever play Hilde, I always use a stick.
 
whats with the banning to begin with? i thought only button stringing was banned (ie ivy throw with 1 button) . what you set your buttons to (start > options > controller settings) is perfectly legal. I mean how else would you play hilde without using any of the bumpers/triggers?

besides, its not like you can charge A and use the A+K button because it just resets the charge... you get my point
 
Maybe I don't understand you, but this is the situation.

-Sticks are better than pad for any character, except Hilde.
-Pad (you say at least) is better than stick for Hilde.

Your solution : Weaken Hilde on pad.

My reaction : Laughter.
 
Before KingAce goes and makes a fool of himself by bringing up arguments that are completely wrong... let me explain about this whole Hilde Button Binding is about. Its NOT about Hilde's ATTACK game. If a Hilde player has two buttons binded to the :A: attack, they have the ability to charge with either button, and attack with either button. However, since the 1.01 patch, both buttons are bound to the same charge timer. When you push either button, the charge for both buttons are dumped. So there is NOTHING wrong with it in this aspect.

Its all about Hilde's DEFENSE game. One of the weaknesses with Hilde is the inability to break throws. If a Hilde player is charging the :A: attack, and they get :A: thrown, in order to break the throw, they will need to release the :A: button, wait for the charge to dump, and then hit :A: again to break it. However, if she has two :A: buttons, she doesn't need to release the first :A: button to dump the charge, she simply needs to hit the second :A: button and the throw gets broken.

Yes, when she hits the second :A: button, the charge on her first :A: button is dumped automatically; as I said before, the problem is not with her attack game. With only one :A: button, the whole process of breaking a throw, with human limitations, basically drops around 5 frames from her break windows. If a throw has an 8 frame break window, she now only has 3 frames to break it because of the nature of her charging. With two :A: buttons, this throw break limitation disappears and she once again has the full 8 frames.

It is some player's belief that this limitation on throw breaking for Hilde was the original intent by Namco; but with the double binding, it breaks that original intent. The whole inability to break throws mechanic with Hilde could be construed as an intended and major weakness of the character. The double binding gets rid of this potentially intended character weakness. I'm not advocating a ban on button binding for Hilde. I think the whole argument is unfair to Hilde players. I'm just explaining the reasoning since most people still think its about her offense game.

Its got nothing to do with Pad VS Stick; its just that its easier to use two :A: or :B: buttons as shoulders buttons instead of stick buttons.
 
I may be getting ready to show my ignorance, but here it goes.

I always thought that the two main Namco fighters, Soul Calibur and Tekken, worked in a way that holding a button and then pressing another button counted as a simultaneous input. In other words if I hold down A, with any character, then press B the result is A+B.

So to Jaxel's point, if I am chraging A with Hilde and somebody tries to throw. I don't have to release A then press A again for the escape, I could hold A and press G to get an A+G input and thus break a throw attempt without having to waste time dumping a charge. If this is correct then it doesn't make a difference whether I am a pad player or a stick player.

Personally I don't have a stick for my X-Box. And with Hilde as my main, I can say with 100% confidence that I cannot play Hilde on a pad without having A and B mapped to the triggers. I've never tried with a stick so I can't say if it would be easier or harder.

My two cents.
 
Shin... thats not actually how it works in Soulcalibur...

Often while I am blocking (holding :G:)... I will mash :A: and :B: because I am expecting the opponent to throw in that situation. If what you say was the case, instead of blocking, and putting in throw breaks, I would be forced to do my own throws, since holding :G: and then hitting :A: would be :A::+::G:... But its not, its holding :G: while inputting an :A: break.
 
just so im clear, are we talking "you cant put A+K and B+G on your triggers if you're using a pad" or "you can't put CS on your left trigger, asshat." ?
 
To expand on what Jaxel described above, keep in mind that there are many things made much easier with button mapping besides just Hilde. I was shown how mapping three buttons as 'G' made it super simple to tech roll Mitsu's 2KB sweep every time simply by sliding across all of them. It's normally a just-frame tech roll, but with multiple buttons to press what was obviously designed to be a difficult maneuver becomes easily mastered.

This isn't a post saying what the rules should be one way or the other on this topic, but it shows that there's quite a bit one should keep in mind as they debate the issue.
 
Dumb question: If the advantage here is from having 2 A buttons mapped to make guard breaking easier then why not ban mapping of the same button multiple times? No player can have more than 1 button mapped to A but they can have one mapped to A+K or A+G or whatever. Unless hitting a button with A+K mapped also allows you to guard break while charging A.
 
ooberallen said:
Dumb question: If the advantage here is from having 2 A buttons mapped to make guard breaking easier then why not ban mapping of the same button multiple times? No player can have more than 1 button mapped to A but they can have one mapped to A+K or A+G or whatever. Unless hitting a button with A+K mapped also allows you to guard break while charging A.
Click to expand...
I dont think ANY button binding should be banned... (button sequence mapping should still be banned) Some people use multiple K or multiple G buttons because they are used to varying button placements between different games.

But again, its not about making GUARD breaking easier... Its about making THROW breaking easier with Hilde, and ignoring a specific designed weakness to her character.
 
ooberallen said:
Dumb question: If the advantage here is from having 2 A buttons mapped to make guard breaking easier then why not ban mapping of the same button multiple times? No player can have more than 1 button mapped to A but they can have one mapped to A+K or A+G or whatever. Unless hitting a button with A+K mapped also allows you to guard break while charging A.
Click to expand...

Then we got the problem with Hilde.
 
Erm, I meant throw breaking. Honestly I haven't played in enough tournaments or with/against Hilde enough to know any better.
 
Is there a real need to ban button binding for her? Is anyone getting beat down because of it because I don't see the need to ban it.
 
Uh oh another ban happy thread. Can't have any characters play better on a pad, but it's cool if a vast majority of the cast plays better on a stick.
 
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