Should Button Binding with Hilde be banned?

By that same logic, since I personally find doing Taki's possession moves (214 and 236)easier on a stick than I do a pad, then sticks for Taki would be banned.

It is a mechanic that everyone has access to, on official controllers. Banning it would be stupid. Just like banning mapping multiple buttons would be for Hilde.
 
KingAce said:
That's the discussion...

Me personally, I want this character to flourish the way Namco intended her to. It might not to be as easy to release her full potential with a stick, but obviously she wasn't designed for a stick. She was designed for a pad with binding mind.

The way I see it, she isn't broke with the binding...So the only issue here is that stick users can't use her the same way pad users can.
So is this a good enough reason to ban binding for her specifically, I don't think so. Not nearly enough of an argument.

Not sure what kinda of arguments peopl can bring-up...but I this is a fair concern for the community to address.
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Who are you to say how we should play with hilde?? you cant even do the fuckin combos thats why you want them banned. you weak piece of shit
 
Logos said:
Then use a fucking stick. Christ.
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Some people like pad. There's a lot of good players that use pad.

And Jay, I'm not sure they intended to do that with Hilde. Otherwise, why would they need to make the 1.01 patch to fix the charge dumps? I think assuming they designed her with that in mind is giving Namco a little too much credit, all things considered.

That being said, even with the earlier throw breaks she's not jumping up to top tier or anything. Just leave it be.
 
As I said before I'll say it again. It allow the benefits of a stick to flourish (exact directional control, easier to mash out of stun, easier to do slide moves like aB and so forth, but yet we somehow want to disregard the benefits of a pad. And that is, we can more easily bind buttons within reach, as oppose to being well out of reach on a stick. When another unlikely advantage comes up, like with Hilde, it to benefited pad players. And lets be serious, the xbox and ps3 comes with a pad, the game has buttons bind preset with the intention to be played with a pad, and that probably 90% of the people who plays this game Plays with a pad.

So to make useless threads again, discussing what should and shouldn't be done regarding pads is a waste of time.

the only thing that is illegal is you push a button and it does a string of moves for you, for example, I push X and it does the Stun palm of doom for me with Akira in VF5 or I press O and it does Setsukas B+K string of moves completely for me. Everything else is fair game. Pads have an advantage in some ways, Sticks have an advantage in another plain and simple.
 
This is a very silly thread, but I'm glad it was posted. I didn't know that she had something specific to gain from binding multiple buttons like that. Thanks everyone and especially Jaxel for turning an "lolwut?" into something meaningful and helpful.

I still won't play her though. Someone on another thread (or maybe more) compared playing Hilde to playing the piano (stick or pad, it doesn't work for me). After an hour of practice with her and probably another hour playing her and yet another doing finger exercises to ease the pain, I can honestly say she's not my type. Sorry baby. It's me, not you. I'll still call, but I play Lizardman and Voldo so I might sound obscene. Excuse me while I crawl over to something, go low, then hump it.
 
I'm honestly not convinced that Hilde with button bindings is that much better than without considering the way she's meant to be played. If anything I think it'll just give most players a lazy mindset when playing her and it'll hurt their game. I am somewhat concerned about high level play though. It gives Hilde outs she normally wouldn't have.
 
shauno said:
I was shown how mapping three buttons as 'G' made it super simple to tech roll Mitsu's 2KB sweep every time simply by sliding across all of them. It's normally a just-frame tech roll, but with multiple buttons to press what was obviously designed to be a difficult maneuver becomes easily mastered.
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It really does make it alot easier, thanks for the tip. I found having an extra a, b or g helps make those wacky slide input moves that some chrs have like NM's agA or Sets's agB be more consistent as well.
 
Logos, I am a stick user who also happens to be quite proficient in pad use (I switched to stick maybe 2-3 years ago). I just decided that since Hilde was going to be my main I might as well use the controller that is most effective when playing her. Really if I was going to main anyone else I more than likely would have stayed stick for SC4.

I don't have a pad martyr complex, I just feel that people whine way too much over these types of trivial things. If they feel a character is better on a pad then by all means use a pad, same with stick being better with certain characters. It's not as if you* have to choose one controller type or the other from birth and are stuck using it for life.

*When I say you I am referring to the 'people who whine way too much'.
 
Actually, seeing as my first post wasn't very clear, I am a pad user, and the only reason I made this thread was because Cha Cha said in the Nationals Thread that binding with Hilde was under review. Button binding as of now is allowed. Binding with Hilde...is still not banned/but it is under review. So I made this thread to discuss the issue, if it is an issue...of course I am all for binding. I don't really see the issue either except that on caliburforums, you will definitely find opposition for binding, especially in terms of Hilde.
 
Wait, Hilde binding is under review or button binding is under review?

Because if Hilde players can't put an "A" at some shoulder button while Taki users can map A+K it would be incredibly unfair.
 
I have yet to see anyone dispel my logic with a INTELLIGENT statement so here goes.

My stand is that ALL players CAN choose to bind buttons ANYWAY they would like. As long as they do not exceed more than 2 A or B buttons or have buttons binded to simultaneous press (A+B,B+K,A+G etc). (You can bind 4 buttons to ABK and then have 5 G buttons, it doesn't matter. As long as A and B are solitary.)

Why is this so? It is mainly because of Hilde.
A Hilde holding charges is able to break throws by releasing her charge and tapping the respective break immediately. This works for normal throws.

If the throw is a command throw, it is usually 25-ish% harder to break than normal throws (Using older numbers for reference, a normal throw break window is 12 windows. Most command throws break windows are from 8-12 frames wide) Again, Hilde can charge her attacks, but when it comes to command throws, she needs to react a LOT faster compared to any other character in this situation.

If the throw is a really unique one, it usually has a throw break of 1-5 frames. Examples would be Talim's SC2 Chain Throw (1 frame break), Ivy's SS/CS in all versions (5 frames) and Astaroth's JF Command Throws in SC4 (8 frame normally, approx 5 frames for the JF).
Now, if Hilde is charging her attacks, are you telling me that you are able to SEE the throw coming, REACT to it, release your index/middle finger from a button and then slam it down again within the timespam of 1/12th of a second? Pretty much humanly impossible.

If you require FURTHER Proof.
I will paint out 2 scenarios.
JasonL and Killa6 in ATL.
JasonL is an Astaroth Player, Killa6, a Hilde who has button binds.

There's me and Shen Yuan in Singapore
I am an Astaroth and Kilik player, Yuan plays Hilde with a stick, no button binds.

In JasonL's case, he's told me quite a few times that Killa6 has no reason to fear his JF throws, no more than if Killa was playing Setsuka or someone else.

On my side, Yuan has trouble breaking my JF throws even on Anticipation. Sometimes as Kilik, when I go into MO against him, i see him release his charges immediately.

In short, button binding with Hilde allows her to break throws she should not be able to break.
It allows her to ignore throws that she should be FEARING.
The ability to shut-down a Hilde's confidence in holding her charges, any proper hilde player would tell you, isn't something to laugh about. Button binding REMOVES this aspect from the game COMPLETELY. (She still has to fear the throws, but she doesn't HAVE to make a choice on whether to charge or not, and she won't ever need to lose her charge against you.)

Also, to add on to that, a Hilde player on a stick or a pad (without binding) has to decide when to charge their attacks, when to release, and when to reset the charges (Let's say you're at C4 and you need to go back to C3). A Hilde player on a pad WITH binding is able to hold their charges for as long as they want, and only release their charges WHEN they want to. This means that they can choose to have access to a 170 damage unblockable which is faster than some lows in the game.. Again, not something to scoff about.

At the same time, its absurdly hard to play Hilde, on a pad, on default settings.
Hell its a lot easier to play ANY character if I could bind a couple of buttons to the triggers.
While stick vs d-pad/analog is still a comparison, I'd say stick buttons vs customizable pad buttons are pretty much even in terms of ease of use.

Ok, that's input for this topic.. Now onto find out wtf those 3 bars below my gamertag mean.
 
So what's the solution? Bring an arcade stick or don't play? That's some nice gesture by the community.
"Sorry, Taki players can bind buttons so they never miss the air-throw, but you can't have A+K to charge A. Very sorry, pick some other character or bring an arcade stick."

I take a look at the aftermath forums, both here and at CF. The highest Hilde I've seen was third, SkatanMilla, on that Swedish tournament.


So, we have a top+ character going through game mechanics due game binding not winning a single tournament. Where is my roll eyes smiley?
 
Yo, this is DancingFighterG. Jaxel explained the issue with button binding with Hilda perfectly. Right now button binding with Hilda is under review. After doing some more testing of my own this is what I have found.

Wether a trigger is programming or you break the throw with A the same results occur. She can break throws with the same throw break window amount. Everyone try this test:

Program your A+G throw on a trigger
Set the computer to do A block then do an A throw
Charge A with square
Now attack the computer with B
Break the A throw with just using the square button then do the samething but break the throw with your A+G trigger
If you hit the A button in the earliest with either the trigger or the square you will see that 9/10 you can get the same throw escape animation almost every time. Depending on how fast you input in A this might vary because human testing is not perfect.

Based off my findings I don't see any reason not too allow button binding for hilda especially since her charge get's reset after a throw break. Jaxel, I don't know about the 5 frame drop off though but my findings say that the escape window is the same no matter what.

As Jaxel said, this has nothing to do with if you use pad or stick so let's just kill that idea right now!!
 
It does (pad vs stick) because Hilde without button binding is unplayable on a pad. Try it yourself.
 
Cirex said:
It does (pad vs stick) because Hilde without button binding is unplayable on a pad. Try it yourself.
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If it's unplayable on a pad that would mean it's unplayable on a stick too.

So no. It's just 'different'.

Has there been any resolution yet over binding?
 
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