Soulcalibur VI DLC Discussion Thread

Crash X said:
But would you still buy another SoulCalibur game if it still had the CaS system, however this time they were disabled in Ranked and (when certain settings were active) Player Matches?
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Probably. Though can I request certain setting in player matches for CaS only as well? I tend to enjoy seeing and fighting other people's CaS so long as it isn't that inappropriate crap that I'm pretty sure is from CaS haters purposely trying to ruin it for everybody. I get very bored seeing the original cast all the time.

With a CaS only option I'd probably play online a lot more often.

Though no CaS in ranked is a sure way to make sure I never play it. Then again I rarely touch it anyway. I typically play it casually with friends, or to show off my CaS.
 
Ardenwolf said:
Probably. Though can I request certain setting in player matches for CaS only as well? I tend to enjoy seeing and fighting other people's CaS so long as it isn't that inappropriate crap that I'm pretty sure is from CaS haters purposely trying to ruin it for everybody. I get very bored seeing the original cast all the time.
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Do you at least understand why there are people who dislike the CaS characters?
 
Ardenwolf said:
Sure, do you at least understand why there are people that get no enjoyment without CaS characters? It goes both ways you know, and there's the rub.
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Of course I do, I myself have played plenty of role playing games to see the the joy of using a character of your own making.

It seems you also must be aware of the jank that is in the CaS characters when they’re being used (which is where the dislike of the CaS comes from people).
 
Crash X said:
Of course I do, I myself have played plenty of role playing games to see the the joy of using a character of your own making.

It seems you also must be aware of the jank that is in the CaS characters when they’re being used (which is where the dislike of the CaS comes from people).
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Jank? What the hell is Jank?
 
Ardenwolf said:
How about solutions then? Got any besides removing CaS from the game?
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I was thinking for a different online mode similar to Ranked. Only this time you’re not being ranked and CaS is completely permitted in there, while only the main cast is permitted in Ranked. Player Match remains the same.
 
Ardenwolf said:
Many of the races are failures as concepts though. They lack things they should have, and have things they shouldn't that make them weird, and some act in ways totally unexpected from what would have been useful.

Take for example the weird bunny cat race. It has one ear type, which coexists with human ears, as well as two tails. When I saw it, and when most saw it before game release I think most were expecting the race to function as the animal people race and have several ears and tail options to allow for animal people who's ears and tails don't just disappear on gear breakage. Instead always one size fits all hybrid cat/bunny ears and two tail options, and weirder still they still have human ears in addition to their cat/bunny ears.

Also the statues can't have hair, which is weird because I've seen very few statues without sculpted hair. They could have just removed physics from the hair and made it static, but no instead stuck with bald statues...

Oh right, and who's heard of a mannequin that can't wear underwear, has no one ever been in any clothing store ever?

Just reminded by girlfriend of another complaint. The weird ogre/orc things can't have hair in CaS, but yet all through Libra of Souls you fight those things WITH HAIR!!!! WTH game?

I could go on for every species but two of the three malfested and the elves who were fine. If they are going to be this lackluster then I'd prefere they just stuck with 5's creation, forget the races, and have more parts.
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I don't know man, seems a little nitpicky to me. I've been occasionally frustrated by the lack of particular options myself, but typically I could see where these combinations were not available how there would be technical issues that would prevent their working together well, or which would have required inordinate amounts of time to fix that would have not been worth the trouble given limited resources. Regardless, not every asset has to work with every race in order for the proposition "they open up a lot of new options" or "they bring a lot to the creation suite" to be true. I stand by my assertion: there are issues I wish were not there (particularly with a limited wardrobe), but all factors considered, this is the best creation editor to date as stands (and b a considerable leap, once more items drop, I hope). Considering how the rest of the industry has mostly moved away from providing these kinds of user features to players, it's better than I expected. Not that I don't wish they had the resources and inclination to load it up with more legacy assets, but...you can't have everything.


Crash X said:
It seems you also must be aware of the jank that is in the CaS characters when they’re being used (which is where the dislike of the CaS comes from people).
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Has this really been a big problem in your experience? I reckon I've played just a bit over a thousand matches so far and I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen objects large enough to have any chance of throwing my perception of the hitboxes off, and of those, not one was the kind of huge cube/apple nonsense of someone clearly trying to leverage the situation to game an advantage. Am I an outlier here? How often is it happening to you?
 
Rusted Blade said:
I don't know man, seems a little nitpicky to me. I've been occasionally frustrated by the lack of particular options myself, but typically I could see where these combinations were not available how there would be technical issues that would prevent their working together well, or which would have required inordinate amounts of time to fix that would have not been worth the trouble given limited resources. Regardless, not every asset has to work with every race in order for the proposition "they open up a lot of new options" or "they bring a lot to the creation suite" to be true. I stand by my assertion: there are issues I wish were not there (particularly with a limited wardrobe), but all factors considered, this is the best creation editor to date as stands (and b a considerable leap, once more items drop, I hope). Considering how the rest of the industry has mostly moved away from providing these kinds of user features to players, it's better than I expected. Not that I don't wish they had the resources and inclination to load it up with more legacy assets, but...you can't have everything.




Has this really been a big problem in your experience? I reckon I've played just a bit over a thousand matches so far and I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen objects large enough to have any chance of throwing my perception of the hitboxes off, and of those, not one was the kind of huge cube/apple nonsense of someone clearly trying to leverage the situation to game an advantage. Am I an outlier here? How often is it happening to you?
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I don't think crash X is talking about extra equipment I think they are talking about height. Certain heights can make certain combos impossible or open up a completely new combos. It works two way. Lower height can mean that cas characters cannot do combos that the original cast can. it's also means certain combos that would work on the other cast do not work on them the lowest tyre if I recall correctly is shorter than Talim. hi I just fully opens up completely new combos that shouldn't even be possible for some characters well no examples come to mind imagine what a Voldo sized Talim could pull off.
 
Ukkesh said:
I don't think crash X is talking about extra equipment I think they are talking about height. Certain heights can make certain combos impossible or open up a completely new combos. It works two way. Lower height can mean that cas characters cannot do combos that the original cast can. it's also means certain combos that would work on the other cast do not work on them the lowest tyre if I recall correctly is shorter than Talim. hi I just fully opens up completely new combos that shouldn't even be possible for some characters well no examples come to mind imagine what a Voldo sized Talim could pull off.
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Ah, well as far as that goes, I just view it as a a variation in the design, and not something we are incapable of adjusting to as players. I will grant you, it does rather raise the question of whether or not the devs are taking account of these variables when they balance the movesets, or if they are just working from the base model variation (one can probably feel confident in assuming it's the latter), but even then, I can't recall seeing anyone leveraging this for benefit so far. Also, I don't believe your second class example there actually occurs: that is, you can't make yourself immune to combos by reducing your height; any combo you're opponent might hit you with they can still land; as best I know, it's only the offensive capacities that can be changed.

And even then, while I hear tell of these supposed new combos, I don't know that I've ever seen one in action, either in my own matches or in a demonstrative video online. Does anyone know of any youtube videos attesting to these? Or even specific examples I could lab? I'm curious to see just how much of a problem they could be in theory. I know I haven't seen them as a problem in ranked as a practical matter so far. In any event, even if use of such characters became a problem, the obviously solution to my mind is to match these problems out, not remove CaS from ranked altogether. And creating a sequestered mode has it's own issues.
 
Ukkesh said:
I don't think crash X is talking about extra equipment I think they are talking about height. Certain heights can make certain combos impossible or open up a completely new combos. It works two way. Lower height can mean that cas characters cannot do combos that the original cast can. it's also means certain combos that would work on the other cast do not work on them the lowest tyre if I recall correctly is shorter than Talim. hi I just fully opens up completely new combos that shouldn't even be possible for some characters well no examples come to mind imagine what a Voldo sized Talim could pull off.
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That’s basically it. It messes up the hitboxes and is pretty much the reason why there are people out there that dislike fighting a CaS character. I’ve actually had Voldo’s RE K whiff straight through a Nightmare CaS before when he did a RE B. I’m not against CaS being a part of the game, but I don’t think it should be a part of a mode such as Ranked where it was designed to be more competitive focused. After all, they have been banned in tournaments for years.
 
Rusted Blade said:
Ardenwolf said:
Many of the races are failures as concepts though. They lack things they should have, and have things they shouldn't that make them weird, and some act in ways totally unexpected from what would have been useful.

Take for example the weird bunny cat race. It has one ear type, which coexists with human ears, as well as two tails. When I saw it, and when most saw it before game release I think most were expecting the race to function as the animal people race and have several ears and tail options to allow for animal people who's ears and tails don't just disappear on gear breakage. Instead always one size fits all hybrid cat/bunny ears and two tail options, and weirder still they still have human ears in addition to their cat/bunny ears.

Also the statues can't have hair, which is weird because I've seen very few statues without sculpted hair. They could have just removed physics from the hair and made it static, but no instead stuck with bald statues...

Oh right, and who's heard of a mannequin that can't wear underwear, has no one ever been in any clothing store ever?

Just reminded by girlfriend of another complaint. The weird ogre/orc things can't have hair in CaS, but yet all through Libra of Souls you fight those things WITH HAIR!!!! WTH game?

I could go on for every species but two of the three malfested and the elves who were fine. If they are going to be this lackluster then I'd prefere they just stuck with 5's creation, forget the races, and have more parts.
Click to expand...

I don't know man, seems a little nitpicky to me. I've been occasionally frustrated by the lack of particular options myself, but typically I could see where these combinations were not available how there would be technical issues that would prevent their working together well, or which would have required inordinate amounts of time to fix that would have not been worth the trouble given limited resources. Regardless, not every asset has to work with every race in order for the proposition "they open up a lot of new options" or "they bring a lot to the creation suite" to be true. I stand by my assertion: there are issues I wish were not there (particularly with a limited wardrobe), but all factors considered, this is the best creation editor to date as stands (and b a considerable leap, once more items drop, I hope). Considering how the rest of the industry has mostly moved away from providing these kinds of user features to players, it's better than I expected. Not that I don't wish they had the resources and inclination to load it up with more legacy assets, but...you can't have everything.
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Considering I know how the creation system works under the hood for SoulCalibur V, and it's so similar that even though I haven't dug into it to know for sure, it's probably the same for SoulCalibur VI, considering how it's mostly a copy-and-paste from a mechanics point of view, it's very easy to flag any equipment as non-breakable, which is essentially what the races are doing, for the most part, giving a free extra equipment slot and making it unbreakable. What would have been ideal, instead of adding the races, would have been giving extra extra equipment slots that were limited in choice but automatically flagged as unbreakable, allowing mixing and matching and making our own races. It was a decent enough idea, but it didn't really add as much as it would seem like it was supposed to add. Especially with arbitrary restrictions that the game doesn't even follow, like armor and hair restriction.

But a lot of this discussion really does belong in this thread instead of this one.

Edit: Added the quote I was referring to because we started a new page, for clarity.
 
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DanteSC3 said:
Considering I know how the creation system works under the hood for SoulCalibur V, and it's so similar that even though I haven't dug into it to know for sure, it's probably the same for SoulCalibur VI, considering how it's mostly a copy-and-paste from a mechanics point of view, it's very easy to flag any equipment as non-breakable, which is essentially what the races are doing, for the most part, giving a free extra equipment slot and making it unbreakable. What would have been ideal, instead of adding the races, would have been giving extra extra equipment slots that were limited in choice but automatically flagged as unbreakable, allowing mixing and matching and making our own races. It was a decent enough idea, but it didn't really add as much as it would seem like it was supposed to add. Especially with arbitrary restrictions that the game doesn't even follow, like armor and hair restriction.
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I don't think that really would have been comparable honestly. The only races you could have recreated that way are the outcacts, lost souls, hidden village clan, and mummies. Lizardmen, revenants, automatons, shapeshifters, colossi, malefics, darksiders, and the three level of malfested rely on more than simple objects; they are defined more by the base model and by texture than any ears, horns, tails, or other indestrutable objects.

I will say this though: I wish you could make certain objects unbreakable on any CaS. Especially since movement of an object is set to the part of the body it is mapped too, so you can't get around region breaking in order to create levels of break.
 
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Revenants also had an equivalency in the skeleton DLC for SoulCalibur V, and a similar thing could be done for the others, where the "underwear" layer is taken by this skin, and it's probably what they're doing, or at least is similar, seeing as how Automatons can't wear underwear, as an example. Even the Malfested, arguably the best of the new races, is kinda limited, because the level two always has the same markings. It would've been a lot better if there was better customization there. But with limitation on gender for Lizardman and Fully Malfested is also a bit upsetting, especially considering you can give normal male voices, and aren't limited to growling/monster voice. It's overall just not handled very well, could have been done a lot better is how I feel.
 
DanteSC3 said:
Revenants also had an equivalency in the skeleton DLC for SoulCalibur V, and a similar thing could be done for the others, where the "underwear" layer is taken by this skin, and it's probably what they're doing, or at least is similar, seeing as how Automatons can't wear underwear, as an example. Even the Malfested, arguably the best of the new races, is kinda limited, because the level two always has the same markings. It would've been a lot better if there was better customization there. But with limitation on gender for Lizardman and Fully Malfested is also a bit upsetting, especially considering you can give normal male voices, and aren't limited to growling/monster voice. It's overall just not handled very well, could have been done a lot better is how I feel.
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Well, they only have so many resources. I think going from one race in the base game to sixteen is rather more of an expansive change than I would have expected a year ago. The fact that it's less than it could be in some theoretical perfect world is not what I would call the fairest of complaints. There are hundreds of tweaks that I would make as well, if I could, but added features are still positives even if we can imagine more robust variations
 
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