Talim in SCVI: Move Study & Analysis

So apparently Talim's 1B is, in fact, minus on hit, as well as stab punishable on block.

EDIT:
- 66A+B with no transition seems safe so far.
- 44B with no transition is safer than before
- 3B is minor unsafe on block, like AA punish
- 1B is garbage as it is. hope it gets patched to either do more damage or be plus on hit
- AABB is unsafe but AAB(B) can dodge punishes on a read. AAB(B) into WNC dodges BBs, AAB(B) by itself ducks highs
- Windsault K:G JF can be done more than once, possibly endlessly.

2nd EDIT:
- LH 6(A+B) gives massive damage with AABA followup
- 6AB 2nd hit wallsplats
- 1A is safe on block and plus on hit. New go-to low for Talim even though it's slow. May have use in tech traps
- WNF K is now safe on block. (it was very unsafe in SC4)
- WNC K is unsafe to fast highs like Xianghua/Taki AA. Might be safe vs characters though
- 4AK in wall combos extends into AABA stuff
 
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ZeroEffect317 said:
- WNF K is now safe on block. (it was very unsafe in SC4)
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Whaaat, I've been staying away from using it but that's super good news. Leads to 66B 2[A+B] mixup

Edit:

So I've found from a CH WF A, instead of a WS3B a good option is to 6BB WNS B. Same damage and won't leave you BT ever. Can also can hold the B to be in WNF for wakeup if wanted.
 
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I just play against a talim players with battle point 600 or something. Overall i think she's very annoyning with her play style even you block her attack it's very hard to hit back, her string is very long and mix with high low make it very difficult to block and RE. Your RE even when you hold as long as possible still be interupt or dodge with her move.

One of her main weakness is GI, due to her long combo string it's easy to GI and most people playing her don't have the patience to stay away from mashing the button when it's matter most.

But it's just my opinion what's about you guys ?
 
I’m still trying to solidify a base game plan. Fought online a bit and I still feel clunky (then again it’s been 6 years and a bunch of notations changes.)
Still trying to establish the best idea for pokes evasion some some mind games and tech traps. Not gonna be a easy week to gain all this muscle memory
 
ZeroEffect317 said:
BT 4A+G~6A or 4A - Classic Chain Throw (Command Throw. "Monsoon Season". Choose 6A or 4A to extend. Only from BT now)
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Anyone know how to break the second part of this throw? I get inconsistent results with hitting 4 or 6 A, B, or K and think it's just a timing issue.
 
sorwah said:
Anyone know how to break the second part of this throw? I get inconsistent results with hitting 4 or 6 A, B, or K and think it's just a timing issue.
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it's a guess like normal throws. If they extend with 4A you need to break with 4, if they extend with 6, you break with 6(and/or neutral? maybe).
 
Dr_Tom said:
it's a guess like normal throws. If they extend with 4A you need to break with 4, if they extend with 6, you break with 6(and/or neutral? maybe).
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Right, well that's the problem I'm having. I've broken it 1 time out of 20. The window for Talim to extend the throw is huge, so I don't know when the defender has the option to break the combo throw. Yes, I'm aware that in theory hitting 4A (or any button) when the attacking Talim does 4A should break it. However, I'm either messing up the timing of it or I'm pressing the wrong direction to break. I also don't know if the direction to break is based off of camera orientation at any given time as well.

Just putting it out there, would be nice to have a video tutorial on the estimated timing if anyone is able to do it 100% of the time. Because this has baffled me and my friends as we try to find consistency for the break.
 
Jump B is plus on block.
WNC A+B (the sweep) is 0 on block
RE A into WNC is also plus on block

About 66A:
I've gone back and forth over 66A knocking down or not. And my personal feelings aside, I'm beginning to see what the devs wanted the move to accomplish. They sped it up, (probably like i14 now where it was i17 in SC4), and going into WNC on hit makes WNC AA and WNC K a true mixup. Cancelling WNC into guard still leaves you at advantage. (plus the false-advantage on people hesitating).

Unfortunately, 66A on Hit into WNC AA doesn't force them to commit to a crouch as the can use a quick TC move to beat it. WNC K would stuff it, but they can step WNC K. Sadly for now, it seems most characters will hurt her more for the right guess here, than Talim will for being right. If Talim is right she gains decent momentum with a knockdown or plus frames on hit.
 
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Not sure if it's been listed yet, but I was curious about any and all plus or neutral on block moves she has, so I went through them. Let me know if I'm missing one or you think one of these is wrong...

(I wish I knew frame values for SC games. Also hopefully none of the notation or terminlogy is wrong.)

Plus or Neutral Moves:

6AB: (The B (Second hit) is plus)
8B: (Plus by a lot, 4B seems to work as a counter hit-confirm tool afterwards.)
66K: (0 on block)
WNC~A+B: (0 on block)
A+B: (Plus enough that the defending Talim's horizontal clashes against the aggressor's vertical)
6B(B): (Full charge is plus, though not by much)
44A(A): (Full charge is plus)
BT A+B: (Plus by a lot)
BT A+B (Full Charge): (+12? I don't know the frames in this game, but you can land an AA string for free here. Or a K or 2A.)
BT B+K ~ A+B: (Plus)

Soul Charge:

66BB: (Plus enough to land a 4B)
AABB: (Plus, 4B seems to clash against a A)
AAB(B): (Plus enough that WNF~K and WNF-B can't be interrupted. WNF~B can be stepped, WNF~K cannot, it will catch all steps. It can be GIed but not reversal edged. GIing through the tiny gap is actually a bit hard.)
66AAAB: (Plus enough that 4B clashes against an A)
WNS~B: (Plus enough that 4B gets a counter against an A)

Random Asides:

66A+B ~ WNC: (Plus after charmer)
66A+B ~ WNS(A+B): (Far as I can tell, they have to block it.)
66A+B ~ WNS(K): (Close-up, you will cross-up, the reverse kick can be side-stepped.)
44B WNS (K): Seems to be the best way to always cross up with this. 44B forces crouching on block.)
6AB: Seems to be the really high damage wall splat. Coincidentally, you can 236B after and launch them over any walls.)
 
One Step a question I wanted to know how you feel if there's move an actual battle because to me it seems okay as a way to stress opponents out and get them to move

 
I see, when exactly do you need to press the kick button for it to just frame? Is it dependent on the first time you press the kick button, or something you do upon connecting?
 
Fuzzieviking said:

I made a thing, and then had to re upload it because some of the notations were HORRIBLY off. That's what happens when you stay up all night making this,
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Some of these don't work due to teching. 22_88 B,B (JF) doesn't have WNS (K) guaranteed afterwards, though you can use 44B into either WNC K or WNS (K) as a tech trap (the opponent can still avoid the 44B by teching right). Or use 3B/2A+B for (as far as I'm aware) untechable damage.
 
That's actually really interesting. I didn't really consider that because 236B 44BWS(K) IS guaranteed I didn't think to check. IF they ukemi is though 22_88 BB JF 44BWS(K) is a techtrap that does more damage than these combos actually. some cool stuff. It's a weird af use for WS(K) but it looks really fuckin cool imo.
 
^I actually had some trouble getting 236B 44B WNS (K) to land against another talim, it was pretty inconsistent. Is it more reliable against big guys?

Anyway, these are the blocked moves after which WNC AA beats the defending talim's AA:
AABA
44B
66A+B
6AA
RE A
 
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More random notes from me:

AA: Plus enough that a 4B trades against a 12i
6A: Punishable on block by 4BB, minus on hit.
6AA: Minus (safe) on block, KD on hit.
6AB: Plus on block (4B trades with 12i), KD on hit. Can be interrupted or stepped.
6AK: NC, punishable on block by 4B, +0 on hit.

WR-B: Minus on block, plus enough to counter a 12i with 4B.

1K: Minus on block, +0 on hit
2K: Minus on block, minus on hit
3K: Minus on block, plus enough for 4B on hit (can be stepped).
4K: Minus on block, plus enough for 4B on hit (can be stepped).
6K: Punishable by BB on block, plus enough that a 6B beats a 12i. (That's a lot of advantage!)
K: Minus on block, clashes with 4B on hit.
BK: Minus on block, plus enough for 4B on hit (can be stepped). This string is useful for catching steps, the K seems to track well.
22(88)K: Minus (safe) on block, plus enough that a 6B clashes against a 12i. So quite a lot. Free reign after this.
44K: Minus (safe) on block, KD on hit
4A+B: Minus (safe) on block, plus enough for a BT-A to trade with a 12i -- not great.

A+B: Can be canceled by guard late enough that a break attack spark still comes out. Is it possible to break on reaction to no re-GI attempt? Need to test.
 
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