Why does everyone say sc2 is the best

Is sc2 best in your opinion?

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ShadowCollector said:
I remember spending Hours reading the information on the Weapon info thing they had >_> I think it was Weapon Gallery or something.
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Yay, I'm not the only one. The description of the weapons were so detailed and I love the history about them as well. I fully support the return of team battle and the weapon gallery return to SCV. :D
 
Master_Thespian said:
ShadowCollector:
1. You said that avoid wasn't broken, then described WHY it was broken. Swing and a miss.
2. You're talking about single player modes and online lag? We're not even in the same ballpark.
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1.) It wasn't broken. The tracking was just TOO good in that game. Raphael had Crazy Tracking in Prep in SCII which made him Very High tier. Other than by avoid you mean Step punish or just Dash avoid? Some moves could be Back-dashed. The problem was Verticals had too much Tracking which made Step-punish useless. Avoiding wasn't broken. Tracking was.

2.) Doesn't matter. SCIV Offline is the same way. Block.Hit.Block.Hit. Repeat. There's no good pressure unless you have NM, Mitsu, Raph, or Taki. Otherwise you just turtle, Hold G and wait for your CH BB to hit someone.
 
In general: *WHOOOOOOOOOOOOSH*

Specifically:
ShadowCollector said:
Raphael had Crazy Tracking in Prep in SCII which made him Very High tier.
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ShadowCollector said:
1.) It wasn't broken. The tracking was just TOO good in that game. Raphael had Crazy Tracking in Prep in SCII which made him Very High tier. Other than by avoid you mean Step punish or just Dash avoid? Some moves could be Back-dashed. The problem was Verticals had too much Tracking which made Step-punish useless. Avoiding wasn't broken. Tracking was.
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Er, gotta call your bluff on this. B's did not track as a rule in 2. Some did but not many. (Yoshi 44B+K comes to mind, a hilarious 360 degree tracking move) Raph was not great in 2 primarily because he was weak to his right. 2A, all lows, most mids, just didn't cover it. He was limited to 3A, BB (which swung on both sides, an oddity in SC2) Stepping his 2A was actually a viable and often discussed part of beating Raph back in the day, because the move was incredibly fast + had tons and tons of range, but the recovery if whiffed usually led to a free launcher.

EDIT: Weak to his LEFT. I had to stop and think, raph's a lefty, so 2A would swing from right to left. Hurp a durp.

Also, once again, the culprit to Raph's suffering to a system is not being discussed- forget step and avoid and all else. Step-G is what did him in, without that, things like 3A/BB would have been even more threatening then they were. (That is to say, 3A = Not at all, BB = Hitting stepping fools at mid range by accident all the time!) If you really want to punch a hole in SC2's rose-colored past, step-g should be your main talking point. I'd still argue against you till i was blue in the face, but, yeah, that's the big ol bullseye master thespian should aim for. :)
 
I loved Soul Calibur II, because it had a nightmare that actually did not move like he had cement bricks on as shoes. Heihachi was a bad ass to punch weapon wielding people while only using arm guards as weapons. Weapon Master was a blast to play besides the dungeons. I loved the weapon gallery too. I hope it returns in Soul Calibur V.
 
crow_winters said:
Raph was not great in 2 primarily because he was weak to his right. 2A, all lows, most mids, just didn't cover it. He was limited to 3A, BB (which swung on both sides, an oddity in SC2) Stepping his 2A was actually a viable and often discussed part of beating Raph back in the day, because the move was incredibly fast + had tons and tons of range, but the recovery if whiffed usually led to a free launcher.
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2A wasn't the only non-safe move he had in SCII, 4A+B, And Advance A. All were Punished by Either Grabs or a Juggle.

That being said he was still superior than his SCIII and SCIV counterparts. He had a huge hitbox on certain hits that were just Horizontals.
 
Master_Thespian said:
My purpose wasn't to say it was a bad game, just to point out that each game had a bunch of bullshit in them people overlook for sentimentality reasons.
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That's for every game. No game is perfect and every game (Even Arkham City) has some sort of Gimmick to it. Pointing out the fact that the game had problems isn't very informing.

You could point out why SCIV is arguably the 2nd Worst SC game to date. (I wonder if the one on the Wii Counts?)
 
SC2 has many myths associated with it by people who even played it well, but the fact is the game was terrible at high level play. It was a boring step-g laden trashy 5 move whorefest. It was not balanced, the core systems didn't work, and the community sucked.

Casuals otoh, don't even know how to play so their standards are non objective at best.
 
crow_winters said:
And you are totally right. I am sorry I misjudged- I think I actually remember you from soulcalibur.com, so I should probably know better, haha. :)
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Yeah, I was around back then, although not as much in the SC2 and SC3 days as I was with the old style bbs we had with SC1. I lurked on guardimpact.com a bit too. Glad to see more old faces/names popping up more frequently.

ShadowCollector said:
That's for every game. No game is perfect and every game (Even Arkham City) has some sort of Gimmick to it. Pointing out the fact that the game had problems isn't very informing.

You could point out why SCIV is arguably the 2nd Worst SC game to date. (I wonder if the one on the Wii Counts?)
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The original question was why everyone says SC2 was the best. My response was that 1). Everyone doesn't think that and 2). It has as much to do with what a person identifies as their first real SC game as anything else.
 
Lol suddenly I feel right at home 1.I didn't make this thread to debate about nightmare sry if it seems like it it's the game as a whole 2.I know sc3 is unbalanced it's just everyone seems to imply that sc2 had none which is wrong, e.g ivy 3. Sry if I seemed agressive im getting rid of pent up frustration, sry again 4.im not much of a tournament or serious player nor have I ever claimed to be this thread is on te casual section because it's a casual player who is pissed off at all the commnts saying"herp deep sc 5 will be shit if it isn't like sc2, sc4 is nothing but doom ccombos and littl green midgets" which wouldn't be a problem were it not for the fact that even the admins have that attitudes seriously we can all agree the other inferior fighting game series hate eachother but from what ive seen they like all of their own games equally while sc argues over sc2 framerqtes and how Raphael turnedfrom ridiculous to decent. To fuzziViking I'm sorry if I offended you but stick to my opinions that while personalities like talims are nicety see they should not be in games with sc tone it's full of evilswords and dominatrixs for gods sake finally I likes sc4 nightmare bestpurely because he seemsmore badass and I like unsafe fighting styles they make fights more tense and for me norefun in conclusion your logic will not work on me because I'm stubborn and don't care about the community in Short I have wasted everyone's time with caual logic (wall of iPad text hits everyone for rock falls everyone dies damage)
 
1.soul calibur
2.soul calibur2
3.soul blade
4.soul calibur3
5.soul calibur4

Thats how i would put it but if SCV proves to be as amazing as it lookd than it could bump soul blade down to #4 or it could be better than 2....
 
crow_winters said:
SC2 is the best game because every character is a threat in high level play. Name a character and I can recite at least a few terrifying mixups and at least one example of a player rocking with them back during the day. I never felt like I stomped someone in SC2 because they picked worse characters then me, whereas I KNOW I've beaten good/better players in 3 and 4 because they picked some awful low tier that I knew how to pick apart.
)
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I've been looking for info on SC2 Talim, so...
 
Bleh, I don't have time tonight to pull out SC2 and really delve deep, so I'll just write stuff off the top of my head-

Stuff that Talim had in SC2 that would blow your mind if you only played 3 and 4-
33A- This move was jesus. 2-hit full horziontal knockdown mid. It tech crouched at the start and ended in jumping, pushed out, was safe on block, did decent damage. It singlehandedly defined a lot of her matchups because not everyone had easy/good ways of punishing it on whiff (since she was considered airborne) NM, for example, had to backdash to make it whiff, then B6 > 3B it's recovery. (B6 created combos only versus airborne enemies)
1A+B- Also jesus move. Super TC, i've seen it avoid mids, pretty sure it was safe, pushed out, mid launcher. 44b guaranteed afterwards.
AAB- High high mid that comboed on counterhit. i10. mid was safe and forced crouch (but could be GI'd, and i believe stepped if the AA was block) knockdown. Considering you could also go into the side evasive stance, AAB fear could freeze opponents allowing you to pressure with the stance further. Only hinderance was range.
1A- This low would make sc3/4 players cry. safe, TC'd, big + frames on hit, knocked down on counterhit. maybe a little slower then other lows in the game but it didn't matter, it was so good.
WS B- Fastest WS move in the game (i think it tied with cervy ws K?), great punisher
BB- i13 mid mid, + frames on hit, had a mid/low mixup.. sort of (low was - on hit and mid was somewhat easy to gi on reaction with practice, but mid was a combo starter and also + frames on block)
Stance Tranisitions- you could win without them but they were nice gimmicks that definitely could catch anyone offgaurd, they were still pretty evavsive in SC2 but not as "core" to her gameplay as they are now (but they were safer). BT stances had auto-GI's...
44K- Good alternative to 1A. Pretty sure it was safe, +0 on hit, fast/deceptive unlike 1A. You can see how she can pressure really well just with what i've already listed...
command grab- she has it.
B+K/A+B- GC's that are both cancelable, each have thier own ranges/quirks, both give + frames. A silly trick involved with.. I think it was B+K.. .basically, immediaitely do 66B and if they didn't re-GI after B+K, it's gauranteed to hit in the vulnerable window, and if they do re-gi, buffer the GI chicken command (i totally forget what it is but i know someone on this website will remember) you'll cancel the 66b animation immediately and grab them. It was one of the simplest setups for GI chicken in SC2 and the only one i really remember anyone using with consistency.

There's a lot more (to her and to any character in SC2) but that's the core stuff that I remember that you HAVE to use (well, maybe not the GI chicken, but it's sooo cool, haha)

It pretty much goes without saying since I think he was one of the best to ever play the game period, of XCTU's talim was pretty amazing, particularlly at Cannes when he was pretty much MVP for team USA. (sadly all you can find are videos of him loseing at cannes, which is really.. really silly)
 
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