The future of Algol, Hilde and Star Wars

IdleMind said:
snip* Outside perception of our game already sucks. I don't think we can make it "worse".
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That's interesting... why does the outside perception of our game suck? Is it the community's fault? "Broken" characters? What could we do to change that perception? Is it just because it's Soul Calibur and not Tekken or SF?

Elaboration would be nice.
 
Psylocide said:
That's interesting... why does the outside perception of our game suck? Is it the community's fault? "Broken" characters? What could we do to change that perception? Is it just because it's Soul Calibur and not Tekken or SF?

Elaboration would be nice.
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Other communities shit on us left and right. If you saw the devastation or evo live stream, SC got a LOT of hate. Maybe now that people saw it live at Evo are a little more open minded, but there is still a MASSIVE opinion that SC is a scrub/mash game compared to their favorite game of choice.

Our mission shouldn't be to knock other games, simply encourage people to try our game before making an opinion.
 
Outside perception of our community sucks because of some or all of the following factors:

Direct to console- this seems to imply a game directed at the casual audience.

Scrubby, masher friendly gameplay- this stems from ignorance and can be fixed IF THE PLAYERS STAY AROUND LONG ENOUGH (and if they see Hilde/Algol, from my expieriences, they wont)

General distaste for any 3d game that isnt Tekken- for some reason the 2d community, which comprises most FG players in the USA have a pre-disposed hatred for games that are 3d that arent Tekken. It isnt logical, but that seems to be the way it is.

The idea that people who blindly hate this game have done their research enough to call us "whiney banning scrubs" is absurd, most of the people hate at the mention of Calibur and are about as educated as the average Calibur player is about DOA.

-Idle
 
U guys arent getting it.
OMG WHY IS THIS SO HARD TO FUCKING COMPREHEND!?

This is being done to bring more people in the community. Who doesnt want more money in the pot, and more scrubs playing at tourneys? This is not what they want! This is Soul Calibur! The closest thing to Hilde has to be like Ivy RO cannon and Nightmare RO combos from SC3.

On that note PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, STOP BRINGING UP OTHER GAMES!!! We get it, Marvel allows broke shit, SF4 allows Seth, GG is GG. Leave those games where they are! No reason to bring up BR! Cmon, u know those guys entering their first tourneys or getting the feel for the game and the scene DO NOT want to go up against Hilde and lose instantly. 20 players who wont come to a tourney cause Hilde is allowed VS. 8 people who dont care about Hilde. Its obvious what tourney organizers should be doing.

Moral Of The Story: DON'T MAKE THIS SC3 AGAIN!!!
 
IdleMind said:
The idea that people who blindly hate this game have done their research enough to call us "whiney banning scrubs" is absurd, most of the people hate at the mention of Calibur and are about as educated as the average Calibur player is about DOA.
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It's not that they've done their research into SC, it's that Hilde pro-banners spread more hate towards that character than positive SC hype, and other communities pick up on that. EVO's live stream chat during all of SC's showing was about 10% legitimate discussion, 20% misconceptions about SC's gameplay, 40% ignorant Hilde hate, and 30% people just raging about SF4 not being shown.
 
Dreamkiller said:
On that note PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, STOP BRINGING UP OTHER GAMES!!! We get it, Marvel allows broke shit, SF4 allows Seth, GG is GG. Leave those games where they are! No reason to bring up BR!
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Since people are choosing to play other games instead of SC, games that are not only more competitive, but competitive for longer, it doesn't make sense not to look at these other games. Why is it worse for a newcomer to lose to a Hilde RO or Algol bubbles, rather than the assorted b.s. that the other characters have? It's because the community embraces whining about it rather than just accepting it as a viable tactic like every other strong one out there.

imo, we don't need to go back to the types of tourneys where throws were banned in sf2 because the majority didn't like them. The competitive majority will play with Hilde in or out, might as well play the more competitive game.
 
DK: I think as a community, if we spent more time making Anti-(insert top tier char) vids and TEACHING newcomers how to beat it, it'll show we care more about the community vs shielding them like infants in a rated R movie. Nobody is telling them "When you fight top tier Hilde, figure it out yourself, otherwise you're trash". Time spent banning and complaining can be used to make threads breaking down how to beat each char
 
iKotomi said:
imo, we don't need to go back to the types of tourneys where throws were banned in sf2 because the majority didn't like them. The competitive majority will play with Hilde in or out, might as well play the more competitive game.
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You pretty much covered what I was going to say to Dreamkiller.

You don't bring people into a game by babying them with "See that legitimately beatable character over there? You won't ever have to fight her, because she's hard to beat before you understand how to defend against her."
 
It really doesn't seem like namco/bandai does anything to help the community either. Cranking out new PSP games, instead of working on some issues with this year old game. I think people have played enough to see some issues that could be changed/patched, and that kind of support from the company would help out the community quite a bit...one would think.

As for the Hilde/Algol ban debates, they should just go away. Keep them in the game, don't ban, and stop talking about it. It really is a turn off. And all we can do is go in circles and circles and circles. Discussing viable tactics is much better, for the everyone involved
 
This is pointless, the idea of why this is being done is going over most of your heads.

When the local tournaments I run continue to get 20 plus entrants after T6 drops, and your stuck playing the same 8 people, you can stay on your high horses for all I care. Feel content in your ideological superiority while we are STILL PLAYING THE GAME.

I'd rather take the risk and be wrong, than do nothing and snub my nose at the people who are trying to make things better. You can't "educate" people onto how to beat charaters when they possess things that are "SO DUMB" you cant explain how to beat it with less than paragraphs of effort. Do you understand how intimidating that is to new players, and to trying and convey as not BS as a teacher?

Also, this ban is not being bandied about by just whiney players- major proponents of it include KDZ (a hilde player himself), DK, Ramon. Yeah, cause those guys are scrubs and don't know how to beat Hilde or Algol.

Time will tell, if I'm wrong I'm wrong. All I know is someone better get their humble pie bibs out- be it me or all of you.

-Idle
 
the bans arent about being broke

its about drawing more players

if people see an algol bubble juggle with out knowing how it works they will run because it looks broken

i support the algol ban if it will draw more people

my sig is just a joke

thing about algol bubble juggles is they are almost impossible to set up

people who are prospective players dont know this and if they see a 230-240 dmg they will bolt
 
So you are trying to get new people on the scene by banning characters? Is that the logic here?

Or to play with the same 20 ppl that play at your tournaments everytime... amirite?
 
omg

you dont get it

they are trying it NJ and NE where people will play regardless

algol and hilde bans might not bring more people in

but NJ and NE have a strong scene where people will play regardless

THEY ARE JUST TESTING THIS TO TRY TO BEING MORE PLAYERS IN

keep in mind as an algol mainer I SUPPORT THE BAN if it brings more people in
 
omg omg omg I don't think you get it. I'm just raising questions, don't get your shit all bent out of shape.

So are they going to run ads like, ALGOL IS NOT ALLOWED HERE!! Come and Play, More fun this time around!

I don't see how it is going to bring more people/new players in. That's it. I'm not arguing for or against the ban, it's not in my area, so I don't care.
 
Hilde, regardless of being "beatable" is starting the same trend that VC and Teleport did in SC3.
Some could say that other games hurt SC4's turnout rate, but to debunk that all you have to do is overlay the situation in SC3 right over our current situation now.

There are too many similarities to ignore this.
So lets give this banning shit a shot.
 
ok lets face facts

algol and hilde look broken to the out side

you cant tell me seemingly broken shit like that doesnt hurt turn out
 
Yes, I understand that logic. Now, what about the scrub Hilde and Algol players that might have turned out, but their main just got banned and now they won't come, cuz they don't have secondary characters.

I'm just still confused as to how this would bring in new players. Half the people that pick it up as a newb or casual gamer haven't done their homework and have no idea about RO and Bubble shenanigans, until someone who knows about the game and is part of the community uses these tactics on them, and then they are discouraged.

Blame the people who are exploiting these moves if you ask me. But I digress, if it works... good deal. If not, couldn't have hurt i guess.
 
I say if you're gonna do the ban thing let it last for at least 6 months or until next years NATS.

Personally when I saw those characters only thing that went through my mind was "At least it's not the scraper lol" but go for it. Just make a choice so players will know who they are playing with and players that want to come back can come back and players that leave cause their characters are gone can either switch or leave.
 
IdleMind said:
This is pointless, the idea of why this is being done is going over most of your heads.

-Idle
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It's not over my head at all, but as iKotomi has pointed out one very big reason people may be quitting is because of how people embrace the whining in this community. So keep on doing what you're doing, but realize this is just one big circle jerk of people trying to get things they don't like banned. The more people complain about things the more impossible beating the characters seems. This gives people a false idea about the game. If everyone were positive and actually spent time explaining how to deal with Hilde / Algol, then you would not have such a bandwagon of people all shouting and crying in our community. Commentary at Evo... I mean come on why should any other community give a shit about our game? Of course they are going to think badly about it if more than half the time people are bitching.
 
Bubbles said:
ok lets face facts

algol and hilde look broken to the out side

you cant tell me seemingly broken shit like that doesnt hurt turn out
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True but I don't see it as the characters fault. It's mainly the community's fault for blowing it out of proportion and making a bigger deal about it than it needs to be.

Like Psylocide I don't really care if NE/NJ bans or not, since I don't live there. I just hope this doesn't catch on as a nationwide thing, since those guys do have a big influence on the community.

And Bubbles, I don't see why you care so much, it's not like you play in offline tournaments. :P
 
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