Pyrrha matchup

You two both need to cut it out.

Also, knowing how to punish 66B BE is important even if good pyrrhas shouldn't be doing it a lot. It's pretty abusive if you don't know how to deal with it and the game hasn't been out a long time so it's important to know how to deal with things like that. It is certainly matchup discussion relevant.
 
i totally whole heartedly agree, and sorry for messing up ur forums, i just was sad to see the discussion had not gone beyond that move, i understand the need for it, i just didnt want it to be all that was here
 
banes49 said:
i totally whole heartedly agree, and sorry for messing up ur forums, i just was sad to see the discussion had not gone beyond that move, i understand the need for it, i just didnt want it to be all that was here
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Assumption was the wrong word, more like a statement. An arrogant douchebag statement to introduce yourself to a crowd of people you have not met before. I am not the first to call you out on this by the way; Reign called you out on it yesterday.

You came across as an arrogant, inexperienced online hero who was looking to stir up trouble in an unfamiliar neighborhood. Apparently you are not but I have never seen you around in this neck of the woods before nor on any media in SC4 so I have no clue who you are. And you might say the same about me but it is you who are coming into our forums, not me. I don't have to prove myself in this area. And me calling you inexperienced was a direct result of your closed minded sounding tone when you introduced yourself.

Your wording when you discounted my gameplan also made yourself sound even more arrogant. Then you seem like you are on a grand crusade to develop a game-plan to defeat pyrrha. I have given you one. Want me to break down the entire game-plan into bite sized specifics for you? Do I really have to do that? Ok Im going to break it down for you. Hopefully this will help some NM players.

(Tiamat don't delete this part, this part is actually useful and is more for the Nightmare players out there) Play against Pyrrha at long range to start. Nightmare's great strength is not just how quickly he can get out of range, but how quickly he can move into range as well. Control Pyrrha's movement with iagA, 66A, 3AA, 44A, 22AA, GS B. Once Pyrrha is "controlled" i.e. she becomes hesitant to move; she is now more vulnerable to mid/throw/low mix-ups. Space her pokes, in particular 66A. In order for 66A to be utilized properly as a step kill, she has to be within a certain range. And due to Nightmare's long strides, she will have to run into 3AA or iagA vulnerable range. Both of which hurt a lot on hit.

44A, GS B, 66A, 66B and iagA all break guard very quickly and are safe. Use these early and often. 6K is a very good spacing tool in this match-up because on block, the push-back puts Pyrrha at a disadvantageous position, allowing NM to space Pyrrha. Though 66K is unsafe in this match-up, I would still recommend throwing this out randomly at neutral on close range in order to interrupt Pyrrha's AA in particular. The key at close range in my opinion is to be counter reactive and predict your opponent and evade his move to throw him out of his gameplan; and be patient and play relatively defensively at long range. 3AA and 33B are great whiff punishes to put her in a world of hurt. Practice reaction whiff punishing against a hard level AI or play against weaker opposition online. Then play an only whiff punish game (no offense at all) against them. This is very good practice on how to whiff punish with NM.

It is also very important to punish stabs with the very least 6K. Stabs are also linear; so is her BB. Most of her shield moves and launchers are also linear. If you can step these, you should get free side/back throws or 3B punishs. I also have some baits which I have developed to bait Pyrrha into whiffing her punish at certain ranges, in particular when it comes to stance transitions. But I will not share them here.

There, my plan is on the table. This gameplan which has worked well in the past and present for me is also on the table. But I realise that these are my opinions/ theory and I will give benefit of the doubt to factors which I cannot control (if JG becomes a huge part of this game later on in its life, it might make the match-up much more favorable for Pyrrha). If my points are stupid to you then well fine. The only thing I called you was inexperienced, then you act like a child and started the insults.

Go watch the latest videos of Omega vs Ramon from Final Round.

That is the last i will say of this.
 
hello,

I'm also a pyrrha player [and now picking up alpha]. been lurking the thread a bit ... but I'm also new to soul calibur ... just picked it up when the game came out.

I live in socal, like banes, and we don't really have any nightmares here at all and I don't really know how to play against nightmare much. I'd like to get some exp if I can ... mind if I add some people? ... us players preferable of course ... my psn is emily_rochefort ...
 
Engared said:
Play against Pyrrha at long range to start. Nightmare's great strength is not just how quickly he can get out of range, but how quickly he can move into range as well. Control Pyrrha's movement with iagA, 66A, 3AA, 44A, 22AA, GS B. Once Pyrrha is "controlled" i.e. she becomes hesitant to move; she is now more vulnerable to mid/throw/low mix-ups. Space her pokes, in particular 66A. In order for 66A to be utilized properly as a step kill, she has to be within a certain range. And due to Nightmare's long strides, she will have to run into 3AA or iagA vulnerable range. Both of which hurt a lot on hit.

44A, GS B, 66A, 66B and iagA all break guard very quickly and are safe. Use these early and often. 6K is a very good spacing tool in this match-up because on block, the push-back puts Pyrrha at a disadvantageous position, allowing NM to space Pyrrha. Though 66K is unsafe in this match-up, I would still recommend throwing this out randomly at neutral on close range in order to interrupt Pyrrha's AA in particular. The key at close range in my opinion is to be counter reactive and predict your opponent and evade his move to throw him out of his gameplan; and be patient and play relatively defensively at long range. 3AA and 33B are great whiff punishes to put her in a world of hurt. Practice reaction whiff punishing against a hard level AI or play against weaker opposition online. Then play an only whiff punish game (no offense at all) against them. This is very good practice on how to whiff punish with NM.

It is also very important to punish stabs with the very least 6K. Stabs are also linear; so is her BB. Most of her shield moves and launchers are also linear. If you can step these, you should get free side/back throws or 3B punishs. I also have some baits which I have developed to bait Pyrrha into whiffing her punish at certain ranges, in particular when it comes to stance transitions. But I will not share them here.

There, my plan is on the table. This gameplan which has worked well in the past and present for me is also on the table. But I realise that these are my opinions/ theory and I will give benefit of the doubt to factors which I cannot control (if JG becomes a huge part of this game later on in its life, it might make the match-up much more favorable for Pyrrha). If my points are stupid to you then well fine. The only thing I called you was inexperienced, then you act like a child and started the insults.

Go watch the latest videos of Omega vs Ramon from Final Round.
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good shit, this is exactly what i wanted, i actually had a very good NM player demonstrate most of this for me shortly before u posted this actually, i actually had theorized in one of my earlier posts that in order for him to do well against pyrrah, he would have to play a keep away game somewhat similar to astaroth, and it does seem like this is the best way to deal with this matchup, its definitely different playing an NM who doesnt constantly go into stance and backdashes like a champ, i had to learn to break some very bad habits i had acquired playing NMs who ONLY go into stance, but this was very constructive, thanks

i actually could not find any final round videos, could u link it?

very pleased that this thread eventually developed into more than just trolling, i really thought it was a lost cause
 
I saved some of the replays, if anyone wants to see them.

Best way to fight Pyrrha is to space, space, space. Up close, either lots of 1k pressure or guard pressure, depending on the type of Pyrrha.
 
I only deleted two of the posts cause they literally had nothing but flaming. Might delete more later I dunno. I generally dislike deleting posts but people reading this topic probably want to actually learn about the matchup not just read an internet flame war.

Also Ramon vs Omega, Ramon made some pretty fatal errors with punishing in a few places, and not just the worst one (the failed CE punish). Ramon wasn't just guarding 22AA etc either iirc.

Kane - you can add me if you want but since you are in socal and I'm in VA our connection will likely be awful. "TiamatNM"
 
thanks tiamat, I personally would have removed far more of the useless posts, my posts included of course, but I respect ur stance on deleting posts

I am still confused how to upload replays dime? I was trying to as well

ggs earlier to u n kingace, I had to break a lot of bad habits I had picked up against NMs who ALWAYS go into stance when the option is there, which feeds into free stabs, it was definitely an eye opening experience to have a NM do 66B and NOT go into GS and actually backstep instead, mind = blown, once I got more adjusted to it, it became obvious that I had to play like against astaroth where I am constantly running in and sticking my neck out, it was definitely waaaay tougher, please don't take any offense by this king because u r good too, but u definitely made my life a LOT less complicated because u did not rely on spacing as much and did go into stance on occassion or perform moves that reward me with stab, I felt way more comfortable at that point

at this point I am not certain what to say about the balance of the matchup, obviously dime is a better player than me, so as I stated earlier does me beating NMS over and over, or having a NM beat me over and over (as was the case with me vs dime), prove that the matchup is imbalanced? or just that the player who is winning more is the better player rather than his character being better, it would be easier for me to decide if I knew how difficult it is to space with NM, because it was definitely challenging for me to continually try to get in his face, almost reminded me of my games playing zangief vs an akuma who played keep away, if it is relatively easy to space, I may even consider learning some NM

has anyone found a stream of final round? I have been unsuccessful in my search for the stream, I would love to see some of the top tier playstyles that made it to finals
 
banes49 said:
I am still confused how to upload replays dime? I was trying to as well
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Here's how you do it:
1. Go to replays, then battle logs.
2. Save the replay you want.
3. Go to the saved replay press start to save the video to your PS3's HDD.
4. Use the PS3's video uploader to upload it to youtube.

That's how I do it.
 
ohh I see, so this is not done from the actual win screen, it saves the matches you just played in ur replays section and u have the option to save them, I have to check that out

so how ez is it to space against pyrrah? u seemed to do it with great ease
 
well if they were uploaded under my name as well, you could look up my name, banes49, in ranked mode, and scroll to the B section, I am in the b3 class I think?? or somewhere near there, from there you can go to my license, and view my replays and download them
 
banes49: http://www.twitch.tv/teamsp00ky/b/310663424 The Final Round Day 3 footage. The SC V stuff starts about halfway through, and I'm assuming that the Day 2 footage can be found from there as well.

@Engared: Like in previous SC games, I've been learning the Alexandra's as well as the usual suspects like Sieg and NM. I've spent by far the most time on Pyrrha (I like her more than Omega or either version of Pat), and I agree with a lot of what you've said. You really, really want to keep Pyrrha on the outside until you have them convinced that moving will get them killed. Only after they've begun to lock up can you really begin to apply pressure with throw mixups and the like because otherwise she will just use her mobility and close range tools to make your life horrible. I usually find that the only time I go in is when I have the frames for a mix up opportunity (e.g., after a hit on 22A GS), or when I've got a chance to apply some wake pressure (e.g., post A+G). Even her stab isn't as scary as it seems as first as long, since if you choose your moves accordingly and keep her at the right range, then it can't really threaten you as much as you might think.

I haven't played as much NM vs Pyrrha as I have Sieg vs Pyrrha (I'm still trying to convince myself that he is good...), but the match ups do have some similarities in that Sieg really, really wants to keep Pyrrha at 3B, 3A, agA sort of range and only move in when he's got enough frames to pull stance shenanigans or use throw mix ups. That said, I feel like NM actually has much better spacing tools than Sieg and hits a lot, lot harder without meter. Honestly, having to use 3B SCH K (BE) iagA to get slightly less damage than NM's 3(B) NSS b:A off a NH makes me just a little bit sad. NM's excellent damage output really makes it risky to try and rush at him because if you miss or get caught, you'll be taking a stack of damage. Just getting hit by 3AA alone is a sizeable chunk of health, not to mention they end up get knocked quite a distance back to reset the situation.
 
LGInfinite said:
banes49: http://www.twitch.tv/teamsp00ky/b/310663424 The Final Round Day 3 footage. The SC V stuff starts about halfway through, and I'm assuming that the Day 2 footage can be found from there as well.
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ah thank you very much, I quite enjoyed that ramon vs omega game, although that ending made my heart skip a beat, I know what its like to see that stupid 6B shield come out instead of 236B, omega was very in ramons face which I was surprised, constantly stepping back and then stepping in, I would love to play him haha

I still feel pretty shaken by the NM games I played today, I went from playing really scrubby NMs to playing a really good one who could play keep away like the biggest highschool cocktease, the skill difference of the type of players makes it really hard to gauge how I feel about the matchup now, but looking at the omega vs pyrrah matchup, it at least looks balanced, however omega didn't use as much of a keep away game either, and did get stabbed a lot for his unsafe moves

this post is probably not relevant to the discussion, obviously not an NM player, so I cant add much to the discussion, except to say that 9K and backstepping is super effective against me, and probably pyrrah in general, I wonder if NM can realistically be played purely keep away style, somewhat like ivy has in previous sc's, ill have to give that a try and ill update this if I find anything, but seems a lot of good shit has already been posted
 
heh cool this video makes it look like i did better than i actually did lol, although watching that video i saw so many missed punish opportunities, blocked A+B = 3B! instead i did nothing or stab lol, but ya watching this game i am very envious of your moves death, if any nms are having issues with pyrrah or any character who cant beat his range, work that backstep, i see a lot of nightmares who never even back up against me and its sad, i never even realized NM could do this lol
 
Blehhh, most of those A+Bs were failed agas or something equally dumb. And thanks man, it means a lot to me. I need all the encouragement I can get if I'm really going to MLG.
 
i wish you the best dude, in my entire life, i dont think i have ever played a NM who mind fucked me so badly, and i played dtn in sc2, i seriously wanna jump on the NM bandwagon now, and moonwalk all over suckas
 
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